University of Southern California Recruitment Begins

[DTD Alum]

That is really, really low, but I think pledge classes at USC are often much higher than quota...although I don't think it makes sense with NPC rules (which I admittedly don't know about), it seems like every year every chapter makes over quota somehow. Pledge classes are usually in the 60s. Do you know how many ended up in the actual pledge classes?

[ginger85]

First timer...have lurked for a while, and mother of a USC sorority member. I have a few comments, observations, questions. Quota was in the mid-forties for my daughter's sorority but they have over 60 new pledges. Having pledged at an sec school way back in the day, I don't understand why there is such a bump up from quota. Also, football fan, have enjoyed reading your observations about sc sorority rush. I think you're right on with the changing demographic of the student body, but it's hard to understand with such a "strong" greek system why so many women drop out of rush when they don't get invited back to the so-called top tier ones. Evidently, there was a large number that dropped again this year. Having attended an sec school, and having had another daughter also attend an sec school, and hearing about the success that Alabama and Florida State are having with new chapters, why won't these girls make that leap of faith? They clearly wanted to be part of the greek community because they started the process.

[AZTheta]

Football Fan - you rock in my world. There are too many variables to speculate, aren't there? Thanks for all the information about USC.

[DubaiSis]

Ginger, when they figure quota, they run the numbers on how many girls get placed if quota is 30, what about 31, what about 32, and they put quota at the best figure and then add as many quota additions as they can. But some schools seem to choose an artificially low number and have everyone have tons of quota additions. Technically you could have quota be 1 and everyone has 59 quota additions. You'd end up at the same place. I think (don't know for sure, but I know there are some advisors who have been in the room with THE COMPUTER and have seen it in action) some schools weigh quota additions in favor of the chapters and some in favor of the rushees. The huge quota additions may have something to do with that as well. But I'm just speculating.

Why do girls drop out when they get cut from their 1st choices when they still have several perfectly good chapters available? There are many threads on here that discuss reasons, from they're snotty spoiled children to they just don't understand the process. I think there are probably nearly as many reasons as the girls who are dropping out. I wish they wouldn't, but what else can you do?

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

But some schools seem to choose an artificially low number and have everyone have tons of quota additions. Technically you could have quota be 1 and everyone has 59 quota additions. You'd end up at the same place. I think (don't know for sure, but I know there are some advisors who have been in the room with THE COMPUTER and have seen it in action) some schools weigh quota additions in favor of the chapters and some in favor of the rushees. The huge quota additions may have something to do with that as well. But I'm just speculating.

If you set quota artificially low, it allows you to say that all chapters made quota. :-)

I'm trying to think through the math on this, and I think that a lower quota combined with QA's helps to better achieve equity among chapters. QA's are supposed to go to the smallest chapter listed on the bid card, though I have no idea if every school does it that way.

So, let's say you have two chapters, and ten women. All ten women list chapter A first and then chapter B. B is the smaller, less-popular chapter. If quota is five, five end up in each chapter. If quota is four, four end up in each chapter during the quota calculation, then B gets both of the QA's because it has the smaller total chapter size.

Okay, now say you have five women who list A first, and then five only invited to A, but all at the bottom of A's list. If quota is five, five match to A and zero match to B, then A gets five QA's. If quota drops to two, two match to A and two match to B, and then B gets one QA and A gets five QA's.

In either scenario, the lower quota helps B.

[dukedg]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

If you set quota artificially low, it allows you to say that all chapters made quota. :-)

I'm trying to think through the math on this, and I think that a lower quota combined with QA's helps to better achieve equity among chapters. QA's are supposed to go to the smallest chapter listed on the bid card, though I have no idea if every school does it that way.

So, let's say you have two chapters, and ten women. All ten women list chapter A first and then chapter B. B is the smaller, less-popular chapter. If quota is five, five end up in each chapter. If quota is four, four end up in each chapter during the quota calculation, then B gets both of the QA's because it has the smaller total chapter size.

Okay, now say you have five women who list A first, and then five only invited to A, but all at the bottom of A's list. If quota is five, five match to A and zero match to B, then A gets five QA's. If quota drops to two, two match to A and two match to B, and then B gets one QA and A gets five QA's.

In either scenario, the lower quota helps B.

This took me forever to find considering it was in this actual thread! Sad. Now that I have read it through, DBB, can you please explain the second scenario? Maybe I'm tired, but I am not understanding that one. Are there five women who list A and then B second and another set of five women who only attend pref at A and therefore are not listing B at all?

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by dukedg

This took me forever to find considering it was in this actual thread! Sad. Now that I have read it through, DBB, can you please explain the second scenario? Maybe I'm tired, but I am not understanding that one. Are there five women who list A and then B second and another set of five women who only attend pref at A and therefore are not listing B at all?

Yes, that is what I mean. I am trying to think of a situation where a higher quota helps a small chapter, and I can't come up with one at all.

[dukedg]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

Yes, that is what I mean. I am trying to think of a situation where a higher quota helps a small chapter, and I can't come up with one at all.

I think it is hard to make a simple model of the bid matching process with all the unknown pieces. My problem with the "artificially" low quotas is the quota additions. At all the schools I've been involved with (granted, only three) the QAs are based on PNM preference, not helping the smaller chapters.

I tried to make a model with A and B, but I think the quota additions don't model correctly with only two chapters. Instead, if you think of a cluster of stronger-recruiting chapters and a cluster of weaker-recruiting chapters, then the problem becomes more clear. There will be women who get to pref that only preffed at two or three of the stronger-recruiting chapters. EVEN IF the campus uses the idea that QAs go to the smaller chapter, that would be the smaller of the strong cluster.

Then what happens is some of the stronger-recruiting chapters end up with quota +15, which still leaves the smaller chapters behind, even if they technically made quota.

If, as Titchou said, quota is now about matching as many women as possible to as many chapters as possible, then I can accept that we are saying it is no longer a tool to try to keep chapters at relatively the same sizes. Then, however, we should no longer judge our chapters on whether or not they made quota.

[FSUZeta]

what a fabulous explanation deltabetababy!

[DubaiSis]

But it has not been determined if QA's go to the smaller chapter or to the girl's choice. I believe I've read here that it is done both ways at different schools. Which would explain why, using a scenario we've read about here, Theta at Auburn had a disproportionately large pledge class this year. The presumption was that they are smaller so they "had the room." But we have since been corrected that they are in fact one of the larger chapters on campus. Which would seem to indicate that QA's at Auburn are going to girl's choice, not smallest chapter. Since Auburn seems to have achieved chapter parity, this may be the way they have to go since no chapter is in need of an extra 30 girls or something.

Now USC (from my understanding) does NOT have chapter parity, so maybe they do it in favor of the smaller chapter, but I don't think anybody's going to be fessing up to that one as it could really affect how a girl fills in her bid card.

[violetpretty]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

But it has not been determined if QA's go to the smaller chapter or to the girl's choice. I believe I've read here that it is done both ways at different schools. Which would explain why, using a scenario we've read about here, Theta at Auburn had a disproportionately large pledge class this year. The presumption was that they are smaller so they "had the room." But we have since been corrected that they are in fact one of the larger chapters on campus. Which would seem to indicate that QA's at Auburn are going to girl's choice, not smallest chapter. Since Auburn seems to have achieved chapter parity, this may be the way they have to go since no chapter is in need of an extra 30 girls or something.

Perhaps chapters with a lower relative recruiting strength or lower retention rates are favored for QAs? Just ideas. Not saying this is the case with Auburn Theta...just that as a new chapter, you're generally not top of the totem pole right away. Of course it's not out of the realm of possibilities that lots of PNMs may have wanted Theta and/or that because of a possible lower relative recruiting strength, they had a bunch of women attend their party whose only preference chapter was Theta, and per guaranteed matching policies, Panhellenic would have to match them with Theta.

[Pearly]

Any one have any idea if the fraternity recruitment numbers were down/less than expected as well? Other influencing factors sorority recruitment: the stock market tanking right before the registration deadline, the well publicized fraternity events of last spring and the party restrictions placed on the Greek system that might make it "not worth it" for those that are just focused on just that aspect.

[28StGreek]

Originally Posted by Pearly

the well publicized fraternity events of last spring and the party restrictions placed on the Greek system that might make it "not worth it" for those that are just focused on just that aspect.

Those could very well be factors. However I know chapters that took above quota. Perhaps they set quota low this year to try and help everyone achieve it, as DeltaBetaBaby stated. That statistic may become helpful for SC's upcoming extension plans. There has been a chapter which has not been so consistent on that regard and had to sometimes participate in COB over the last few years.

[DTD Alum]

Anybody know the pledge class sizes for either guys or girls? Guys always feels like some crazy range from 4 all the way to 35, but I imagine girls are much more standardized.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by 28StGreek

Those could very well be factors. However I know chapters that took above quota. Perhaps they set quota low this year to try and help everyone achieve it, as DeltaBetaBaby stated. That statistic may become helpful for SC's upcoming extension plans. There has been a chapter which has not been so consistent on that regard and had to sometimes participate in COB over the last few years.

The sororities still have to vote for extension and if there's a fakishly (is that a word?) low quota, it's not going to sway their vote - they're going to know what's up. Especially the chapter that hasn't been making quota.