Greece! Out of Control Due to Socialism

[DrPhil]

We are a blend of capitalism and socialism. We were never pure capitalism and have always had socialist leanings (even when labeled as something other than socialism).

Anyway, how you like dem Greeks? Depression 2010 or what?

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Ghostwriter

I didn't call anyone out I just gave my opinion. I disagree with you about how near we are to Socialism and what our leadership in this country wants. I believe they want as much centralized authority as possible and they are doing all they can to get it while they can.

Not that I'm agreeing with you about "they" wanting "as much centralized authority as possible," but "centralized authority" =/= socialism.

If a state such as Mass. wants their own Health Care system, more power to them. I have no problems with what states do for what they perceive as their own common good.

So do I understand you to mean that federal socialism is bad, but state socialism is okay?

The point here is that "socialism," like "fascism," gets tossed around so much that it's becoming pretty meaningless.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

We are a blend of capitalism and socialism. We were never pure capitalism and have always had socialist leanings (even when labeled as something other than socialism).

Anyway, how you like dem Greeks? Depression 2010 or what?

I think they're crazy! The riots, three people dead, all the anger. At some point, their population has got to see what their government does...it's the austerity plan or destruction of their country. I did find the discussions between Greece and EU comical. Germany: "You should sell one of you islands!" Greece: "Uh...you still owe us from all that sh*t in WWII!"

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

The point here is that "socialism," like "fascism," gets tossed around so much that's its becoming pretty meaningless.

Exactly.

BTW, the title of this thread was tongue-in-cheek and (if I recall) happened because I was watching the O'Reilly Factor (love it).

[Ghostwriter]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

So do I understand you to mean that federal socialism is bad, but state socialism is okay?

Yes it is okay for a state to be more "Socialist". If their citizens vote for that then by all means have at it and see how well it works. California is a great example. Out of money and heading for bankruptcy. I would not agree to the rest of the states/country/Feds bailing them out if and when they fail.

I believe that all power not ennumerated to the Federal Government by our constitution should revert to the States. If a state decides it is in their best interest to "socialize" areas within their power then that is acceptable to me. If I feel it necessary, I can always move my residency to a state that is more in line with what I believe.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Not that I'm agreeing with you about "they" wanting "as much centralized authority as possible," but "centralized authority" =/= socialism.

So do I understand you to mean that federal socialism is bad, but state socialism is okay?

The point here is that "socialism," like "fascism," gets tossed around so much that it's becoming pretty meaningless.

Thank you

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by Ghostwriter

Yes it is okay for a state to be more "Socialist". If their citizens vote for that then by all means have at it and see how well it works. California is a great example. Out of money and heading for bankruptcy. I would not agree to the rest of the states/country/Feds bailing them out if and when they fail.

I believe that all power not ennumerated to the Federal Government by our constitution should revert to the States. If a state decides it is in their best interest to "socialize" areas within their power then that is acceptable to me. If I feel it necessary, I can always move my residency to a state that is more in line with what I believe.

But it WOULD happen. We are the United States of America. You think we're really going to let California falter? Look at the EU and Greece...it's the same thing. They couldn't let Greece fall apart for the same reason we wouldn't be able to let California fall apart.

[AGDee]

And, I would think if our most populous state failed, the rest of us would fall like dominoes.

[AOII Angel]

States' rights freaks have such a weird fascination with their own state surviving like a roach after the nuclear holocaust. Uh...it's not going to happen. Every state is too entangled to survive without the others.

[Ghostwriter]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

States' rights freaks have such a weird fascination with their own state surviving like a roach after the nuclear holocaust. Uh...it's not going to happen. Every state is too entangled to survive without the others.

I call BS on this. Not true. Where did you get that idea? Unless they are holding muni or state bonds fpr bankrupt states there is little bleed over. There may be a ripple in the pipeline of products from these states but there are others who will fill the void.

The states that spend themselves into oblivion and then cry poor mouth get no sympathy from me. Try cutting the spending. It can be done.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by Ghostwriter

I call BS on this. Not true. Where did you get that idea? Unless they are holding muni or state bonds fpr bankrupt states there is little bleed over. There may be a ripple in the pipeline of products from these states but there are others who will fill the void.

The states that spend themselves into oblivion and then cry poor mouth get no sympathy from me. Try cutting the spending. It can be done.

Really... So You really think North Carolina would survive by itself? I don't think so. States rely HEAVILY on the federal government.

[Beryana]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

Really... So You really think North Carolina would survive by itself? I don't think so. States rely HEAVILY on the federal government.

And that is because of the way our society/country has devolved. The Federal government has gotten out of hand, something the framers of the Constitution hoped to avoid by limiting what the Federal government SHOULD be allowed to do and giving more autonomy to the individual States. What is good for the people of California, Georgia, Maine, etc is not necessarily what is the best for Wisconsin, Wyoming, Tennessee, etc.

I like the Constitution the way it was written - with limited Federal government. It is a shame that most politicians don't feel that way. I'm also REALLY happy (as a side note) that my Congressman, Dave Obey, is NOT running for his 22nd term!

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by Beryana

And that is because of the way our society/country has devolved. The Federal government has gotten out of hand, something the framers of the Constitution hoped to avoid by limiting what the Federal government SHOULD be allowed to do and giving more autonomy to the individual States. What is good for the people of California, Georgia, Maine, etc is not necessarily what is the best for Wisconsin, Wyoming, Tennessee, etc.

I like the Constitution the way it was written - with limited Federal government. It is a shame that most politicians don't feel that way. I'm also REALLY happy (as a side note) that my Congressman, Dave Obey, is NOT running for his 22nd term!

But that all changed after the civil war, and the question of whether we were just a loose federation of states or a true union was answered. I'm not arguing philosophical questions here but reality.

[DrPhil]

There are about 3 different topics going on here:

1. No state is an island. We are the United States for a reason. You are sadly mistaken if you think what happens in one state has absolutely no impact at the Federal and state levels.
2. What works for Wisconsin does not necessarily work for Maine and that's why states have a level of autonomy.
3. How you like dem Greeks?!

[AOII Angel]

How many times are you going to have to ask #3? Nobody seems to want to talk about it!