Indiana University 2014 Recruitment

[AOII Angel]

Every year I read about IU and shake my head. It is a bit ridiculous that these chapters, including my own sorority, continue to use bed quota. That being said, to all the mothers that are upset that their daughters only have unhoused chapters left. Do your jobs as advisers to your daughters and tell them the truth that they need to hear. No, you don't always get the exact outcome you want in life, but sometimes you just have to pick yourself up and make the best out of it. If those unhoused chapters weren't at IU, your daughters likely would have NO options. They should be grateful for the opportunity given to them by these "clubs" if they have any desire to be Greek at IU. It's an unfortunate truth that many girls will have no options and would take any bid. A house doesn't stand in your wedding as your maid of honor ten years after you graduate. A sister does that. If your daughter wants to be a part of a real sisterhood with lifelong benefits, help her get past the idea that the most important ingredient is a house.

[cinder1965]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

Every year I read about IU and shake my head. It is a bit ridiculous that these chapters, including my own sorority, continue to use bed quota. That being said, to all the mothers that are upset that their daughters only have unhoused chapters left. Do your jobs as advisers to your daughters and tell them the truth that they need to hear. No, you don't always get the exact outcome you want in life, but sometimes you just have to pick yourself up and make the best out of it. If those unhoused chapters weren't at IU, your daughters likely would have NO options. They should be grateful for the opportunity given to them by these "clubs" if they have any desire to be Greek at IU. It's an unfortunate truth that many girls will have no options and would take any bid. A house doesn't stand in your wedding as your maid of honor ten years after you graduate. A sister does that. If your daughter wants to be a part of a real sisterhood with lifelong benefits, help her get past the idea that the most important ingredient is a house.

[suzy88]

It is ironic that IU has turned away thousands of women over the years and has not allowed them to participate in Greek life because the sororities can't house them, then Panhellenic can't figure out why women don't want an unhoused chapter. They have created the emphasis on housing; they have created their own monster. I hope many women can still find happiness with the unhoused chapters.

Best wishes to all the young ladies going through this rush. My older daughter was turned away by IU sororities several years ago. It was a crushing experience for her. My younger daughter went to three parties today and we are hoping for the best and preparing for the worst Tuesday.

It seems that organizations that are supposed to be about helping women find a sense of belonging and empowering them to do great things with their lives should not provide the negative, demoralizing experiences that are provided by IU sororities.

[cinder1965]

Originally Posted by Sigmapsimom

Don't assume that we moms are not "doing our jobs." I have been on the phone with my daughter for hours today talking and texting. I encouraged her to go to the parties today, which she did. We've had the life isn't fair discussion - talked about sisterhood. We have discussed pros/cons, scenarios, what ifs - you name it. I've been honest with her and told her it is unlikely she will get in a sorority if she doesn't do this. I can't tell her to rank them. That's entirely her decision. Mine is only to advise.

Don't discount their feelings and make comments they should be grateful. They're 18 year old girls who had certain dreams of sorority life and they are mourning those dreams and that's ok. As someone said earlier, "Cry, eat chocolate, cry some more." It's up to them and only them to decide if they want to try it out or not. By no means, should anyone feel that they have to accept a bid just because it's the only option, even if it doesn't feel right to them. I think those not connected to IU do not understand the house culture of Greek Life. You don't know what it's like to be on a campus with many Greeks and GDI's alike putting down these 2 sororities. You are a second class citizen. It's incredibly unfair and some of it is false, but let's face it the opinions and acceptance of our peers at that age is incredibly important. And one last thing, even if she did rank them there is still no guarantee of a bid. That is the last thing she needs is to be rejected yet again. No idea what to expect from them.

How do you answer this question sent to me today by my daughter as a text?
"Mom, I'm not strange. I'm not mean. I'm involved. I like the same things. I am girly and classy and fun. I take care of myself and I pride myself in looking good. I know I would be a great fit in several of the houses. I just don't know what else I could have done. It's all I saw in my college vision since forever" And let's face it, this is happening to many. many girls, not just mine.

Please don't dismiss what these girls are going through. I think the biggest piece of the puzzle here is they all know the system is set up for many to fail and it seems so arbitrary, but they just don't think it's going to happen to them and when it does it's devastating. They hear stories about how you have to "game the system" but they don't know how to do that.

I already apologized for wrongly using the word "club" but feel free to keep throwing that around.

The house culture at IU is real and it stinks. None the less it is real.

[HQWest]

Purdue is looking pretty good right now...

[cinder1965]

Originally Posted by HQWest

Purdue is looking pretty good right now...

Boiler Up!

[Maman]

[QUOTE=Sigmapsimom;2256248]

How do you answer this question sent to me today by my daughter as a text?
"Mom, I'm not strange. I'm not mean. I'm involved. I like the same things. I am girly and classy and fun. I take care of myself and I pride myself in looking good. I know I would be a great fit in several of the houses. I just don't know what else I could have done. It's all I saw in my college vision since forever" And let's face it, this is happening to many. many girls, not just mine.

QUOTE]

Daughter you are girly, and classy and fun. Some of the chapters take pledge classes as small as 40. That is just two percent of the PNMs that start the process. There are simply too many qualified PNMs for the spots available.
I looked back at an old thread for a past year and someone said they were 100 legacies at a house that accepts a pledge class of about 40. No one would take an entire class of legacies, but you get the idea.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by Sigmapsimom

Don't assume that we moms are not "doing our jobs." I have been on the phone with my daughter for hours today talking and texting. I encouraged her to go to the parties today, which she did. We've had the life isn't fair discussion - talked about sisterhood. We have discussed pros/cons, scenarios, what ifs - you name it. I've been honest with her and told her it is unlikely she will get in a sorority if she doesn't do this. I can't tell her to rank them. That's entirely her decision. Mine is only to advise.

Don't discount their feelings and make comments they should be grateful. They're 18 year old girls who had certain dreams of sorority life and they are mourning those dreams and that's ok. As someone said earlier, "Cry, eat chocolate, cry some more." It's up to them and only them to decide if they want to try it out or not. By no means, should anyone feel that they have to accept a bid just because it's the only option, even if it doesn't feel right to them. I think those not connected to IU do not understand the house culture of Greek Life. You don't know what it's like to be on a campus with many Greeks and GDI's alike putting down these 2 sororities. You are a second class citizen. It's incredibly unfair and some of it is false, but let's face it the opinions and acceptance of our peers at that age is incredibly important. And one last thing, even if she did rank them there is still no guarantee of a bid. That is the last thing she needs is to be rejected yet again. No idea what to expect from them.

How do you answer this question sent to me today by my daughter as a text?
"Mom, I'm not strange. I'm not mean. I'm involved. I like the same things. I am girly and classy and fun. I take care of myself and I pride myself in looking good. I know I would be a great fit in several of the houses. I just don't know what else I could have done. It's all I saw in my college vision since forever" And let's face it, this is happening to many. many girls, not just mine.

Please don't dismiss what these girls are going through. I think the biggest piece of the puzzle here is they all know the system is set up for many to fail and it seems so arbitrary, but they just don't think it's going to happen to them and when it does it's devastating. They hear stories about how you have to "game the system" but they don't know how to do that.

I already apologized for wrongly using the word "club" but feel free to keep throwing that around.

I just saw your post about your daughter going to the last party and making a go at it. Good job.

None of us dismiss the feelings of hurt that PNMs feel in this process, but we also know that for many people the issue is that they feel "too good" for the groups they have left. If you start looking at some of the posts in this thread wondering how groups could reject this PNM or that PNM, it comes down to a value judgement that the women in the unhoused groups are somehow "less than." There are many reasons why women are released and don't make the cut. Is it fair? I don't know. Is it fair to say a PNM is any more worthy than the chapters she thinks she's too good for? They may not be the ones she had her heart set on, but honestly they may be the ones best suited for her in the end. There are many parents that honestly can't step away from the friend and commiserator role long enough to be the voice of reason for their daughters.
I am very glad you were able to play that role for your daughter. I hope it all works out for her. IU is brutal. There is no doubt about it. Please don't take my last post as an indictment of you as a parent but as a suggestion for the situation. Like I said, if these women with only unhoused groups left on their list want to be Greek, this is their only chance. It's time to make lemonade out of lemons. Having a mom who can put that into perspective is a real gift.

[suzy88]

Don't be too hard on Sigmapsimom. I have been where she is at. It is incredibly hard to see this happen to your daughter. When your child is in pain, you fight back, it is what moms do. I applaud all that she is doing for her daughter. She sounds like a great mom.

[Mom64]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

I just saw your post about your daughter going to the last party and making a go at it. Good job.

None of us dismiss the feelings of hurt that PNMs feel in this process, but we also know that for many people the issue is that they feel "too good" for the groups they have left. If you start looking at some of the posts in this thread wondering how groups could reject this PNM or that PNM, it comes down to a value judgement that the women in the unhoused groups are somehow "less than." There are many reasons why women are released and don't make the cut. Is it fair? I don't know. Is it fair to say a PNM is any more worthy than the chapters she thinks she's too good for? They may not be the ones she had her heart set on, but honestly they may be the ones best suited for her in the end. There are many parents that honestly can't step away from the friend and commiserator role long enough to be the voice of reason for their daughters.
I am very glad you were able to play that role for your daughter. I hope it all works out for her. IU is brutal. There is no doubt about it. Please don't take my last post as an indictment of you as a parent but as a suggestion for the situation. Like I said, if these women with only unhoused groups left on their list want to be Greek, this is their only chance. It's time to make lemonade out of lemons. Having a mom who can put that into perspective is a real gift.

The unhoused sororities are viewed as "less than", the PNMs all basically know to rank them last as getting an invite back is easier.

I am tired of hearing of this mutual selection process. It is not! PNMs rank their choices but are basically given what they get. Why should they have to make "lemonade out of lemons", they are better than this.

In my daughter's case she received invites back from #18, #20 and #21. Guess what, she did a pretty good job of ranking them as after revisiting them she felt no connection and decided to opt out of the process. Frankly, I think these houses may "take what they can get" (there are bills to be paid) which is why they end up with a somewhat "hodgepodge" of a membership.

She has friends who thought they were "top tier" and were quite upset to get invites back from houses they thought were less than that, these were houses my daughter would have loved to have been a part of and ranked accordingly. She is sad to hear them complaining of their invites to these houses and some were her top choices. One of my daughter's friends told me that she found one house to be snobby today but it's really her only choice so she'll take it if she can get it.

And for all of those who feel that they can call our posts "entitled" or "snobby" I dare you to spend one minute if not the many hours we have spent consoling our daughters and reassuring them of their self-worth.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by Mom64

The unhoused sororities are viewed as "less than", the PNMs all basically know to rank them last as getting an invite back is easier, Rho Gams have told them as such.

I am tired of hearing of this mutual selection process. It is not! PNMs rank their choices but are basically given what they get. Why should they have to make "lemonade out of lemons", they are better than this.

In my daughter's case she received invites back from #18, #20 and #21. Guess what, she did a pretty good job of ranking them as after revisiting them she felt no connection and decided to opt out of the process. Frankly, I think these houses may "take what they can get" (there are bills to be paid) which is why they end up with a somewhat "hodgepodge" of a membership.

She has friends who thought they were "top tier" and were quite upset to get invites back from houses they thought were less than that, these were houses my daughter would have loved to have been a part of and ranked accordingly. She is sad to hear them complaining of their invites to these houses and some were her top choices. One of my daughter's friends told me that she found one house to be snobby today but it's really her only choice so she'll take it if she can get it.

And for all of those who feel that they can call our posts "entitled" or "snobby" I dare you to spend one minute if not the many hours we have spent consoling our daughters and reassuring them of their self-worth.

What I've highlighted above DOES sound entitled (if you mean that they're better than the chapters that invited them back). I'm going to ignore most of your post which insinuates that some of these chapters "take what they can get" and are essentially made up of the "losers" of the Greek system and say this:

We all understand that you're frustrated, but please don't lash out at us because of that. Keep in mind that we're all Greek here, and we're each members of one of the 26 NPC sororities. We hate reading stories where PNMs go bidless just as much as we hate the term "bottom-tier sorority." We feel for both the PNMs and the sororities involved. We want PNMs to fall in love with the sorority from which the receive a bid, whether that's on bid day or years later.

The situation sucks. And in every recruitment situation at every school there are disappointed PNMs. It doesn't get easier to hear, as all of us have to imagine that at least once, that disappointed PNM received a bid from our sorority. And we each love our sorority and we want to share our sisterhood and have others love it as much as we do.

I hope that your daughter can make it through this with her head held high and a bid in hand.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by Mom64

Frankly, I think these houses may "take what they can get" (there are bills to be paid) which is why they end up with a somewhat "hodgepodge" of a membership.

Well, actually, without a house...there AREN'T bills to be paid.

[AZTheta]

Originally Posted by Mom64

In my daughter's case she received invites back from #18, #20 and #21. Guess what, she did a pretty good job of ranking them as after revisiting them she felt no connection and decided to opt out of the process. Frankly, I think these houses may "take what they can get" (there are bills to be paid) which is why they end up with a somewhat "hodgepodge" of a membership.

...

And for all of those who feel that they can call our posts "entitled" or "snobby" I dare you to spend one minute if not the many hours we have spent consoling our daughters and reassuring them of their self-worth.

That bolded statement is why you sound "entitled" or "snobby". It is, frankly, judgmental at best, and it is your opinion. It has nothing to do with consoling a disappointed child. I think perhaps you may wish to step away from the keyboard for a while.

[ADPiEE]

It almost sounds as though a lottery system may have been the best plan this year?

Originally Posted by Mom64

Frankly, I think these houses may "take what they can get" (there are bills to be paid) which is why they end up with a somewhat "hodgepodge" of a membership.

I know emotions are high right now. I'm a mom of a daughter too and I can only share what I would/will tell my daughter when the time comes:

"Sorority membership really is a lifetime gift no matter what chapter offers you a bid. First, you had to work hard and make grades just to get accepted into college. Then you had to make the grade cut just to go through recruitment. Then you had to make to cuts just to be offered a bid. That puts you in a pretty small group of elite (hate that word) girls."

I would really discourage my daughter from dropping out of recruitment and encourage her to at least try her new member period. She can't see that far into the future but, as a mom, you can. I think you said you were in a sorority? You know the lifelong friendships you've made and the benefits of sorority life. I think these benefits can be found in the majority of chapters of every sorority regardless of popularity on campus.

[Dtjb]

Originally Posted by Sigmapsimom

Don't assume that we moms are not "doing our jobs." I have been on the phone with my daughter for hours today talking and texting. I encouraged her to go to the parties today, which she did. We've had the life isn't fair discussion - talked about sisterhood. We have discussed pros/cons, scenarios, what ifs - you name it. I've been honest with her and told her it is unlikely she will get in a sorority if she doesn't do this. I can't tell her to rank them. That's entirely her decision. Mine is only to advise.

Don't discount their feelings and make comments they should be grateful. They're 18 year old girls who had certain dreams of sorority life and they are mourning those dreams and that's ok. As someone said earlier, "Cry, eat chocolate, cry some more." It's up to them and only them to decide if they want to try it out or not. By no means, should anyone feel that they have to accept a bid just because it's the only option, even if it doesn't feel right to them. I think those not connected to IU do not understand the house culture of Greek Life. You don't know what it's like to be on a campus with many Greeks and GDI's alike putting down these 2 sororities. You are a second class citizen. It's incredibly unfair and some of it is false, but let's face it the opinions and acceptance of our peers at that age is incredibly important. And one last thing, even if she did rank them there is still no guarantee of a bid. That is the last thing she needs is to be rejected yet again. No idea what to expect from them.

How do you answer this question sent to me today by my daughter as a text?
"Mom, I'm not strange. I'm not mean. I'm involved. I like the same things. I am girly and classy and fun. I take care of myself and I pride myself in looking good. I know I would be a great fit in several of the houses. I just don't know what else I could have done. It's all I saw in my college vision since forever" And let's face it, this is happening to many. many girls, not just mine.

Please don't dismiss what these girls are going through. I think the biggest piece of the puzzle here is they all know the system is set up for many to fail and it seems so arbitrary, but they just don't think it's going to happen to them and when it does it's devastating. They hear stories about how you have to "game the system" but they don't know how to do that.

I already apologized for wrongly using the word "club" but feel free to keep throwing that around.

Originally Posted by Mom64

The unhoused sororities are viewed as "less than", the PNMs all basically know to rank them last as getting an invite back is easier, Rho Gams have told them as such.

I am tired of hearing of this mutual selection process. It is not! PNMs rank their choices but are basically given what they get. Why should they have to make "lemonade out of lemons", they are better than this.

In my daughter's case she received invites back from #18, #20 and #21. Guess what, she did a pretty good job of ranking them as after revisiting them she felt no connection and decided to opt out of the process. Frankly, I think these houses may "take what they can get" (there are bills to be paid) which is why they end up with a somewhat "hodgepodge" of a membership.

She has friends who thought they were "top tier" and were quite upset to get invites back from houses they thought were less than that, these were houses my daughter would have loved to have been a part of and ranked accordingly. She is sad to hear them complaining of their invites to these houses and some were her top choices. One of my daughter's friends told me that she found one house to be snobby today but it's really her only choice so she'll take it if she can get it.

And for all of those who feel that they can call our posts "entitled" or "snobby" I dare you to spend one minute if not the many hours we have spent consoling our daughters and reassuring them of their self-worth.

Boy...I have to pipe in... I went to IU and went through the process and was Greek and so I do KNOW what it is. I did it and lived it and it's a lot. It is mutual in the sense that the rankings have to match up. It sucks if they don't but she does get to rank her choices. Sounds like she might be making decisions based on "reputations" and "what people think" and that's her prerogative, but not the sororities' fault. I have a family member going through rush at this very moment and so I'm also aware of the grueling process (gotten all the texts, etc) for which women can choose to take personally and measure their self-worth by it, or understand it's a lot of timing, luck, and chemistry. Women do this for lifelong friendships and sisterhood, not a house, not a "reputation", not a label, not just to wear certain letters. No one wants moms to hurt for their daughters, but I've read unbelievable things in here...one mom saying her daughter won't get a bid bc of religious affiliation (not true), one saying if her daughter didn't feel it went great at a party assume the house didn't either....this is bad advice. Ultimately, women have to follow their heart and if that's the reason they don't pledge a particular place, then so be it. But if the reasons are all this other garbage, these girls really need to be looking inside themselves more.