E-Mails Suggest Paterno Role in Silence on Sandusky

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by 33girl

Will everyone stop jumping down ASTAlumna06's throat if she qualifies her statements with "In the Northeast"?

Thank you!

Originally Posted by Greek_or_Geek?

I think you need to get out more then. Start with maybe visits to Alabama and Mississippi. Then you might be able to comprehend how spectacularly commonplace Penn State's relationship to its public is.

I need to get out more? In the last 10 years, I've lived in 4 different states, and in just the last 2 years, I've traveled to 10+ others for both business and pleasure. "Getting out" isn't a problem for me.

Originally Posted by AXOmom

The sorority analogy wasn't actually directed at anything you said - it was directed more at what several PSU posters in this thread and another on this same subject have said over the past few months. I don't think this means any of them or you condone the actions taken by Penn State's administration - I'm just saying that on some level - the "it's just different here" or "our relationship to our school is special" can be dangerous and can lead to those actions.

.....

As Greek or Geek suggested, you need to spend some time in a state where the opposite of your Boston experience is true - a state where the university and specifically the university's football program is pretty much all there is for many reasons (once again I offer up Nebraska). Or they're raised in a culture where college football qualifies as a religous belief system (Texas). What seems unique and unusual to you would seem expected and standard for them.

Originally Posted by thewasher418

May I introduce you to my home state (Louisiana), where people who have NEVER SET FOOT in Baton Rouge, never went to ANY college or went to another one (like I did), live and breathe LSU football. This is not unique.

Originally Posted by AXOmom

.....
Instead I would hope that if many pointed out to us a particular situation we believe is unique to us really isn't and we should broaden our horizons a bit before drawing that conclusion - we would consider that our previous assumptions might be incorrect and adjust them.

.....

She said she grew up in the northeast and she stated that the type of relationship between Pennsylvania and Penn State doesn't exist there. That I understood, and I stated that I could see where that would be the case. All I suggested was this probably explained why the situation in Pennsylvania seemed unique to her, but if she had spent time in another part of the country she probably wouldn't find that to be the case, and she should probably do that before making the assumption that it is a unique situation.

Can someone please point out to me where I said that Penn State's situation is unique? Where did I say that there are no other schools in the country that can compare to PSU?

I originally agreed with als463's response to this:

Originally Posted by AXOmom

There may be some players who have always dreamed of playing at Penn State and who will choose to go there, walk-on, and play there even if it means going into debt, and if so, hey, kudos to them, but honestly I can think of very few instances, outside of a Harvard or Yale or a school with a religous emphasis (Notre Dame, BYU) where a talented kid with other good options would choose to go as a walk on, particularly if it meant four years of student debt, rather than take a scholarship offer to another school and I can't think of many parents, regardless of how many generations went to that school, that would let them. Now, if the only other offers they had were to much smaller programs or vastly inferior schools and they knew they had no NFL potential, they just wanted to try and play football while they were in school because they love playing - then I could see that scenario, but that player is unlikely to be of much help to Penn State in the Big 10.

... and basically said that with the Penn State pride I've seen among students, alumni, and PA residents, I wouldn't be so quick to assume that every parent of a football player would turn their child away from playing at PSU.

[thewasher418]

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

Thank you!
Can someone please point out to me where I said that Penn State's situation is unique? Where did I say that there are no other schools in the country that can compare to PSU?

The statement I quoted in my previous post, with the bolded part I added myself for emphasis, is not those exact words but implies it very strongly. I hate quote-fests so I won't quote it again.

And I think what everybody is trying to say is not that you or any Penn Stater is provincial/narrowminded/whatever, but rather that the 'mystique' that keeps being mentioned over and over- bonding alumni together, bonding the whole state's residents together, making the school an integral part of their lives whether they attended or not- is not as rare and unique as imagined. Nothing you couldn't find in Oklahoma, West Virginia, Louisiana, Georgia, Ohio, etc. And it's possible that blind belief in that not-actually-so-special 'mystique,' left unchecked, allowed such terrible things to happen. Could it happen elsewhere? Sure, because we humans can be terrible like that.

[als463]

Okay, for the sake of reasoning and not to make anyone feel the least bit slighted (since that is definitely not what I intended), the point that I was trying to make--thank you ASTAlumna06 for helping me try to explain and agreeing--was that when you have such a strong alumni base, many times a family may choose to go into debt before sending their child elsewhere. Let me use LSU, Alabama, Michigan, whatever school we want to use that is super into football (or that university for whatever reason).

If Matthew Michigan comes from a long line of Michigan Alumni and a big scandal like what is going on now happened there, I believe that he may stay at Michigan because his family is all about the generational pride in the university. That is the only point I was trying to make. You can change that to Louis LSU or Adam Alabama (or whatever you want--it doesn't matter--just pick a school) and that may happen. That is the point I was making. If my future child chose Penn State over many other schools, I would be over the moon because I bleed blue and white (not for the sports, either). It's just something to think about when talking about students leaving the team. That's all I was trying to say. I hope I explained it without offending/ upsetting anyone.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by als463

Okay, for the sake of reasoning and not to make anyone feel the least bit slighted (since that is definitely not what I intended), the point that I was trying to make--thank you ASTAlumna06 for helping me try to explain and agreeing--was that when you have such a strong alumni base, many times a family may choose to go into debt before sending their child elsewhere. Let me use LSU, Alabama, Michigan, whatever school we want to use that is super into football (or that university for whatever reason).

If Matthew Michigan comes from a long line of Michigan Alumni and a big scandal like what is going on now happened there, I believe that he may stay at Michigan because his family is all about the generational pride in the university. That is the only point I was trying to make. You can change that to Louis LSU or Adam Alabama (or whatever you want--it doesn't matter--just pick a school) and that may happen. That is the point I was making. If my future child chose Penn State over many other schools, I would be over the moon because I bleed blue and white (not for the sports, either). It's just something to think about when talking about students leaving the team. That's all I was trying to say. I hope I explained it without offending/ upsetting anyone.

Isn't this a massive strawman though? Like, this point literally doesn't matter to this discussion, at all - and nobody really argued against it with any real aplomb.

The point you were making is that Penn State will still be able to field a football team? OK, acknowledged.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

Isn't this a massive strawman though? Like, this point literally doesn't matter to this discussion, at all - and nobody really argued against it with any real aplomb.

The point you were making is that Penn State will still be able to field a football team? OK, acknowledged.

That is why als463 comes in these threads.

(((als463)))

[als463]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

Isn't this a massive strawman though? Like, this point literally doesn't matter to this discussion, at all - and nobody really argued against it with any real aplomb.

The point you were making is that Penn State will still be able to field a football team? OK, acknowledged.

WOW. You.Are.A.Jackass. It was brought up in the discussion about how some people won't leave the team simply because they may have family members who attended Penn State and feel a sense of tradition. If you didn't see that in this thread at all, then maybe you should get your eyes checked.

You sure had me pegged! I'm a HUGE football fan! I live and breathe football! In fact, I graduated from a major basketball university and I literally breathe that sport too! Let's hope that no big scandals happen because I would hate for my beloved sports to be tarnished at that university too! Clearly, I attended Penn State for the football team! That's all us inbred Penn State rednecks have going for us. We don't do no book-learnin' or anything remotely important. Who cares about academics or raising money for philanthropy? Not us! We are too busy worryin' about whether or not we can play ball!

I'm pretty annoyed by the fact that I am expected to apologize for my university over and over again. I didn't do anything wrong. Frankly, I don't really care what you think.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by als463

WOW. You.Are.A.Jackass. It was brought up in the discussion about how some people won't leave the team simply because they may have family members who attended Penn State and feel a sense of tradition. If you didn't see that in this thread at all, then maybe you should get your eyes checked.

You sure had me pegged! I'm a HUGE football fan! I live and breathe football! In fact, I graduated from a major basketball university and I literally breathe that sport too! Let's hope that no big scandals happen because I would hate for my beloved sports to be tarnished at that university too! Clearly, I attended Penn State for the football team! That's all us inbred Penn State rednecks have going for us. We don't do no book-learnin' or anything remotely important. Who cares about academics or raising money for philanthropy? Not us! We are too busy worryin' about whether or not we can play ball!

I'm pretty annoyed by the fact that I am expected to apologize for my university over and over again. I didn't do anything wrong. Frankly, I don't really care what you think.

LOL. Does it hurt you that much? Really?

You kind of seem like a jackass in these threads. You are absent from any discourse but show up for discussions like this. You were definitely not this visible, passionate, and clearly outraged when discussing the details of the allegations, trial, and conviction.

We get it! You give a darn about your alma mater and are silent until it comes time to express how much you give a darn. We get it!

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by thewasher418

The statement I quoted in my previous post, with the bolded part I added myself for emphasis, is not those exact words but implies it very strongly. I hate quote-fests so I won't quote it again.

All I said was that I've never experienced anything like it before. And I haven't. Maybe if I moved to Alabama, or Texas, or other states that people threw at me, I might.

And I think what everybody is trying to say is not that you or any Penn Stater is provincial/narrowminded/whatever, but rather that the 'mystique' that keeps being mentioned over and over- bonding alumni together, bonding the whole state's residents together, making the school an integral part of their lives whether they attended or not- is not as rare and unique as imagined. Nothing you couldn't find in Oklahoma, West Virginia, Louisiana, Georgia, Ohio, etc. And it's possible that blind belief in that not-actually-so-special 'mystique,' left unchecked, allowed such terrible things to happen. Could it happen elsewhere? Sure, because we humans can be terrible like that.

Again, I never said it was rare.

Maybe we misunderstood each other somewhere in there, but again, it wasn't my intention to suggest that Penn State is a special and unique snowflake.

I'll leave all of that kind of talk to the handful of super-fabulous PNMs who are sure to show up on this site in the near future.