I don't care if I offend you, Greek & PNMs- Listen Up!

[DubaiSis]

You guys are missing the point completely! What she has so kindly pointed out is that if you are at (what's the awesome runonsentenceofeverybigschool) Big Super Competitive Rush school and you have to cut 500 girls before midnight tonight, you really need to spend an extra 20 minutes looking over the girl who 1-isn't going to provide the cashflow the girl a year younger than her will 2-for whatever reason didn't have a great rush last year and 3-was maybe offered another chapter and declined it because she's too good for them or did accept the bid and couldn't make the best of it. That you have to deny an invitation to a freshman with excellent grades, great conversation skills and recs from the meany alumnae, and maybe incur a very large fine for being late submitting your lists is beside the point.

Or stating it another way, she's being pompous and know-it-ally and we're supposed to be grateful for that.

And if I were to make a guess, I bet she got into a sorority by way of a colony that needed a few juniors/seniors to balance their roster, and either went through one rush and as the new kids on the block weren't quite as selective (judgy, mean) as the other chapters, or didn't participate in a full formal competitive rush at all. And it's SUPER easy to tell that 250 member Chi O chapter at Arkansas about how they should be more inclusive and open minded.

[carnation]

OP: the problem with raising campus total on competitive campuses is that it can hurt the smaller and/or newer groups.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by carnation

OP: the problem with raising campus total on competitive campuses is that it can hurt the smaller and/or newer groups.

Besides this, TECHNICALLY, in all but a few campi every recruitment (even the monsterously huge ones) has a spot for every PNM. Raising Total doesn't affect Quota. Whether every PNM has grades, recs, an open mind and enough social grace not to be cut by every house is another story.

[MaggieXi]

What I got from the ramblings was:
Everyone should get a spot in a sorority regardless of their grades, class standing, personality, etc. (and that everyone should poop rainbows and own magical ponies).

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by MaggieXi

What I got from the ramblings was:
Everyone should get a spot in a sorority regardless of their grades, class standing, personality, etc. (and that everyone should poop rainbows and own magical ponies).

Yes! Legit reason to post this again!

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by MaggieXi

What I got from the ramblings was:
Everyone should get a spot in a sorority regardless of their grades, class standing, personality, etc. (and that everyone should poop rainbows and own magical ponies).

I would like my own magical pony. I think it would make my daily commute more enjoyable.

[Old_Row]

Originally Posted by MaggieXi

What I got from the ramblings was:
Everyone should get a spot in a top tier sorority regardless of their grades, class standing, personality, etc. (and that everyone should poop rainbows and own magical ponies).

Fixed your post for you.

[CloseMinded]

Originally Posted by MaggieXi

What I got from the ramblings was:
Everyone should get a spot in a sorority regardless of their grades, class standing, personality, etc. (and that everyone should poop rainbows and own magical ponies).

That’s the exact opposite of what I am trying to say! I WANT you to care MORE about their grades, personality (currently, not a year ago), campus involvement, blahblahblah and LESS about the fact they depledged an organization last year. Are you seriously kidding me when you say there are diminishing ROI for making new friends, mentoring a young women or ANY of the other benefits of joining our organizations? I’m not saying Suzie Sorority should get a bid to the most competitive organization at the most competitive school in the country. I am saying that every organization from Chi O to AEPhi should at least give her an equal opportunity. If she doesn’t fit your organization because of her personality or grades, fine – drop her. But you’re not even giving these girls a chance because they didn’t give you a chance first. Straight talk with them, the chances are slim but if you get involved on campus outside Greek Life, meet members of different organizations, do study hours and keep your GPA up, etc those are ways to stand out at recruitment. I’m no better than any other member on this board or in my organization or Greek Life anywhere and I have never claimed to be. I would love this to open up to a discussion, but the same women who are discouraging PNMs are making the chances of a true discussion impossible.

P.S. I know I'm wordy. I also know most people who are going to comment on this will be more worried about my word count than my message.

P.S.S. to Shirely, since your still an active member and might read this, I ABSOLUTELY LOVE what you said in that quote! Sorry you had to get dragged into this though.

[SWTXBelle]

Originally Posted by CloseMinded

But you’re not even giving these girls a chance because they didn’t give you a chance first. .

.

Exactly. Having once offered an opportunity to join a sisterhood an organization would be foolish to extend themselves for someone they know 1.) wasn't interested in them and 2.) has a proven record of dropping out rather than someone who doesn't have those two strikes. There are too many well-qualified pnms who don't have this baggage - it's a competitive system. A freshman who can offer 4 years of commitment and who hasn't proven to be a quitter is of COURSE going to be more attractive to a GLO.

That said, ClosedMinded, you shouldn't assume you know how much weight is given to individual aspects of sorority membership selection. You are making the assumption that you do - and you don't.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by CloseMinded

That’s the exact opposite of what I am trying to say! I WANT you to care MORE about their grades, personality (currently, not a year ago), campus involvement, blahblahblah and LESS about the fact they depledged an organization last year. Are you seriously kidding me when you say there are diminishing ROI for making new friends, mentoring a young women or ANY of the other benefits of joining our organizations? I’m not saying Suzie Sorority should get a bid to the most competitive organization at the most competitive school in the country. I am saying that every organization from Chi O to AEPhi should at least give her an equal opportunity. If she doesn’t fit your organization because of her personality or grades, fine – drop her. But you’re not even giving these girls a chance because they didn’t give you a chance first. Straight talk with them, the chances are slim but if you get involved on campus outside Greek Life, meet members of different organizations, do study hours and keep your GPA up, etc those are ways to stand out at recruitment. I’m no better than any other member on this board or in my organization or Greek Life anywhere and I have never claimed to be. I would love this to open up to a discussion, but the same women who are discouraging PNMs are making the chances of a true discussion impossible.

1) You're making assumptions about our membership selection procedures. Maybe every sorority member here always pushed for the underdog to receive a bid. You don't know, so stop trying to make us sound like we're out to get the girls who didn't take the "easier" road on their way to receiving a bid.

2) You didn't exactly approach this in the best way. I don't know why you're so surprised that people here are confused and/or mad at you.

3) It could have been a rational discussion if you offered to have one. Instead, you're still saying that certain members here (who you fail to point the finger at directly) are discouraging PNMs from rushing.. Which is bs. Again, sorry we tell PNMs the truth.

Actually, no.. I'm not sorry.

[SydneyK]

Originally Posted by CloseMinded

I would love this to open up to a discussion, but the same women who are discouraging PNMs are making the chances of a true discussion impossible.

I don't know about everyone else, but I've found that if I'm truly wanting to have a discussion about something, it's counter productive to open with, "I don't care if I offend you - listen up!" That generally tends to make people a bit defensive.

Also, your username confuses me. Are you close to having a mind (but not there yet!), thus making you Close-Minded? Or did you mean to say you're ClosedMinded? I don't think I'd admit to being closed minded - it's not something to be proud of.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by SydneyK

I don't know about everyone else, but I've found that if I'm truly wanting to have a discussion about something, it's counter productive to open with, "I don't care if I offend you - listen up!" That generally tends to make people a bit defensive.

I agree. I hate disclaimers in verbal and written communication. It sets the tone and shapes how people receive the message. Just say what you need to say and let others determine whether (insert common disclaimers).

I guess you all have decided this isn't a sockpuppet and the discussion is worth replying to. LOL.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

And if I were to make a guess, I bet she got into a sorority by way of a colony that needed a few juniors/seniors to balance their roster, and either went through one rush and as the new kids on the block weren't quite as selective (judgy, mean) as the other chapters, or didn't participate in a full formal competitive rush at all. And it's SUPER easy to tell that 250 member Chi O chapter at Arkansas about how they should be more inclusive and open minded.

My guess was a chapter that had a OHHOLYSHITHALFOURPLEDGECLASSJUSTQUITANDNATIONALSIS GOINGTOHAVEABIRDWENEEDWARMBODIESNOW moment but the part about meeting with "advisors" does kind of tip to a colony. I don't know ANYONE (IRL or on here) who met with an advisor to get a bid in a normal rush situation.