Facebook Parenting: One pissed off dad!

[AXOmom]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

I saw the thoughtfulness of your post until you got to this. WHAT?! This wouldn't be humiliation. It would be a crime. Parents don't get to hold guns to their children's heads and call it "humiliation". That's assault and child abuse. I just went back and saw the part where this actually happened to one of your students. I sure hope you reported this. It IS your duty to report this type of incident to the police, CPS or related agencies. This could prevent further abuse of this poor child.

AOII Angel - I apologize if it sounded in like I felt or believed that humiliation was the only issue in my student's experience. It certainly wasn't. My mention of this event was not meant in anyway to imply otherwise. I just wanted to make clear that the laptop situation in no way compares to this which, as you quite correctly pointed out, was indeed a crime and abusive in addition to being humiliating.

This girl was one of my students that I taught in juvenile corrections. It was one in a long series of events her father had perpetrated. In this case, the incident had long since been reported, he had been dealt with (don't remember how) and this was in her file so there was nothing for me to report. I am very aware of my professional duty and moral obligation as a mandatory reporter. In fact, it was reported, according to her, by one of the migrant farm workers whom he made the offer to.

SWTXBelle, I think the issue I have with your point is that saying he was using a gun to discipline a child implies an action that didn't occur here. The child wasn't present, he didn't threaten her, he didn't suggest the same would happen to her, and she clearly doesn't in anyway seem to fear him or feel threatened by him.

Do I think it was the best way to dispose of a computer? Absolutely not - but your initial statement implies that because he shot up a piece of equipment he owned this somehow implies he is abusive. I'm sorry but I wholeheartedly disagree with that and I guess that is where we'll have to leave it since I doubt we will change each other's viewpoints on the subject.

I just feel strongly (I know this isn't your intent) that it belittles the experiece of children like the young woman I mentioned whose parents do actually threaten them with weapons and who are truly abusive.

Again, maybe working so long with kids who were abused has hardened me, but I don't see this father's actions being even remotely in the same category as what those kids lived through, and I don't think they should be lumped together.

[DZsis&mom]

Originally Posted by AXOmom

AOII Angel - I apologize if it sounded in like I felt or believed that humiliation was the only issue in my student's experience. It certainly wasn't. My mention of this event was not meant in anyway to imply otherwise. I just wanted to make clear that the laptop situation in no way compares to this which, as you quite correctly pointed out, was indeed a crime and abusive in addition to being humiliating.

This girl was one of my students that I taught in juvenile corrections. It was one in a long series of events her father had perpetrated. In this case, the incident had long since been reported, he had been dealt with (don't remember how) and this was in her file so there was nothing for me to report. I am very aware of my professional duty and moral obligation as a mandatory reporter. In fact, it was reported, according to her, by one of the migrant farm workers whom he made the offer to.

SWTXBelle, I think the issue I have with your point is that saying he was using a gun to discipline a child implies an action that didn't occur here. The child wasn't present, he didn't threaten her, he didn't suggest the same would happen to her, and she clearly doesn't in anyway seem to fear him or feel threatened by him.

Do I think it was the best way to dispose of a computer? Absolutely not - but your initial statement implies that because he shot up a piece of equipment he owned this somehow implies he is abusive. I'm sorry but I wholeheartedly disagree with that and I guess that is where we'll have to leave it since I doubt we will change each other's viewpoints on the subject.

I just feel strongly (I know this isn't your intent) that it belittles the experiece of children like the young woman I mentioned whose parents do actually threaten them with weapons and who are truly abusive.

Again, maybe working so long with kids who were abused has hardened me, but I don't see this father's actions being even remotely in the same category as what those kids lived through, and I don't think they should be lumped together.

This was First Class!!!

[SWTXBelle]

AXOmom, you are correct that I cannot see ever thinking using a gun in any way, shape or form to discipline a child is going to send the right message. What he did was in order to discipline her. Is it the equivalent of holding a gun to her head? No. But we don't know - and can't - what she took away from the incident in terms of fear or threatening. I don't mean to intimate that this is the equivalent of obvious and unquestionable abuse. I do think that the celebration of his actions ignores the potential for it to be abusive.

How many times after the fact do family and friends of abuse victims see the warning signs only AFTER it has escalated? Destroying property (and whoever bought it, it seems to have been "her" computer; just because he paid for her underwear would you say it was "his"?) in a violent manner would certainly raise concerns in my mind. It may be a one-time thing; it may not.

At the very least, he chose a poor way to instill his lesson.

[PM_Mama00]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

Let's see . . . indicators of abuse . . .

-Displaying weapons
-Destruction of (victim’s) property
-Humiliation (of victim)
-Monitoring and controlling the victim

Damn I should've been put in CPS if this is the case.

-I got threatened with a wooden spoon. A WOODEN SPOON OMG! That would be child abuse these days. Back then it was discipline.

-Eh nothing was ever destroyed because my parents bought it and didn't feel like buying me another one.

-My mom used to show up places I was to see if I was doing anything or to pick me up, etc. It was pretty embarrassing that I couldn't walk home from dances, go to so and so's house after, and get high or drunk. I was really humiliated.

-My mom set a curfew for me and drove around town one night looking for me when a friend decided we were walking home from another friend's house, who lived across town. Pretty controlling.

I don't do drugs. I don't drink (anymore. Partying in college got old after graduation) You know why? My parents instilled the FEAR OF GOD in me. Any of the things my parents used to do while I was growing up to be sure I wasn't getting in trouble, could be considered child abuse these days. It's really sad. This father was humiliated by his daughter to her friends on FB. Don't you realize that probably really hurt him? Yes, kudos to him! And like Dee said, it looks like an empty laptop case.

And for pete's sake, he didn't point the gun at her or even use it in her presence. Seriously?

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by AXOmom

AOII Angel - I apologize if it sounded in like I felt or believed that humiliation was the only issue in my student's experience. It certainly wasn't. My mention of this event was not meant in anyway to imply otherwise. I just wanted to make clear that the laptop situation in no way compares to this which, as you quite correctly pointed out, was indeed a crime and abusive in addition to being humiliating.

This girl was one of my students that I taught in juvenile corrections. It was one in a long series of events her father had perpetrated. In this case, the incident had long since been reported, he had been dealt with (don't remember how) and this was in her file so there was nothing for me to report. I am very aware of my professional duty and moral obligation as a mandatory reporter. In fact, it was reported, according to her, by one of the migrant farm workers whom he made the offer to.

SWTXBelle, I think the issue I have with your point is that saying he was using a gun to discipline a child implies an action that didn't occur here. The child wasn't present, he didn't threaten her, he didn't suggest the same would happen to her, and she clearly doesn't in anyway seem to fear him or feel threatened by him.

Do I think it was the best way to dispose of a computer? Absolutely not - but your initial statement implies that because he shot up a piece of equipment he owned this somehow implies he is abusive. I'm sorry but I wholeheartedly disagree with that and I guess that is where we'll have to leave it since I doubt we will change each other's viewpoints on the subject.

I just feel strongly (I know this isn't your intent) that it belittles the experiece of children like the young woman I mentioned whose parents do actually threaten them with weapons and who are truly abusive.

Again, maybe working so long with kids who were abused has hardened me, but I don't see this father's actions being even remotely in the same category as what those kids lived through, and I don't think they should be lumped together.

Thanks for addressing that, AXOmom. That really bothered me. You'd be surprised how many mandatory reporters would look at something like that and think, "That's not something I should report." In my 6 years of residency, I saw way to many cases of severe child abuse. I have almost PTSD style flash backs sometimes when someone brings up child abuse. It's really disgusting what humans can do to children.