Sexual orientation and MS

[macallan25]

Originally Posted by DeltAlum

Maybe, but in the real world there are always secrets between brothers, sisters, siblings, married couples, parents and children, etc.

I think a persons sexual orientation is important to the person and his or her partner (or potential partner) and nobody else.

I just find it hard to believe that you wouldn't be the least bit irritated if you lived with a guy who didn't tell you he was gay...........and then you had to find out about it randomly.

Maybe you would, but it seems like you wouldn't have a problem with it.

[ladygreek]

Originally Posted by macallan25

I just find it hard to believe that you wouldn't be the least bit irritated if you lived with a guy who didn't tell you he was gay...........and then you had to find out about it randomly.

Why? You can't catch it by breathing the same air. And if you didn't know, then he obviously was not displaying the "behaviors" you find disgusting.

[macallan25]

Originally Posted by ladygreek

Why? You can't catch it by breathing the same air. And if you didn't know, then he obviously was not displaying the "behaviors" you find disgusting.

Yes......but If I walked in to my room and he was banging his friend Chuck.....he would be displaying the "behaviors I find disgusting."

....and yes, I know I can't catch gay. But I could catch a glimpse of him being gay relatively close to my parameter, which wouldn't fly. Sorry, I have a dislike of all things gay for several reason. I would have a major problem with a roommate who hid something like that from me and the other men in the house.

[ladygreek]

Originally Posted by macallan25

Yes......but If I walked in to my room and he was banging his friend Chuck.....he would be displaying the "behaviors I find disgusting."

....and yes, I know I can't catch gay. But I could catch a glimpse of him being gay relatively close to my parameter, which wouldn't fly. Sorry, I have a dislike of all things gay for several reason. I would have a major problem with a roommate who hid something like that from me and the other men in the house.

I understand what you are saying, but your statement was if you didn't know and heard it somewhere else. That would imply, to me, that he wouldn't be banging Chuck in your room. He would be discreet enough that you had to hear it elsewhere. That's the point I was addressing.

Very honestly, I would hope that you wouldn't walk in on a hetero roommate banging Charlene. In both cases those are inappropriate behaviors regardless.

[Little32]

^^I had a friend in college whose roommate used to have sex with his girlfriend while he was in the room. Blech! That is disgusting behavior regardless of the gender of the partner.

[Senusret I]

I mean.....shit happens when you're 19 and it's 3am.... and your boo is lookin right....



You gotta listen for your roommate breathing patterns.... if he snores, screw some more!

[Little32]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

I mean.....shit happens when you're 19 and it's 3am.... and your boo is lookin right....



You gotta listen for your roommate breathing patterns.... if he snores, screw some more!

My friend just started wearing headphones...to drown out the spanking noises.

I think this is one of those things that women and men see different. For most women I know, the thought of their roommate getting it on, while they are in the room, is gross. Dudes seem to take it a little more in stride, and then talk about their roommate after the fact.

[macallan25]

Originally Posted by ladygreek

Very honestly, I would hope that you wouldn't walk in on a hetero roommate banging Charlene. In both cases those are inappropriate behaviors regardless.

Not near as bad. Not even within the same realm actually.

[ladygreek]

Originally Posted by macallan25

Not near as bad. Not even within the same realm actually.

Why not? Beacuse you can get off watching them?

[macallan25]

Originally Posted by ladygreek

Why not? Beacuse you can get off watching them?

Hey, try to tone down the bitch attitude. That would be great. Evidently you have a problem with me having a problem with living with a gay man who hid from me the fact that he likes to pack fudge.......which I highly disagree with and don't approve of.

To answer your question.......no......pretty much because I am a strait, non-homosexual, woman loving male. I wouldn't care if I walked in on my roommate wearing out a hot sorostitute in my dorm room. I'd leave and give him a five later, when he's done. Voyeurism isn't really my thing.

[shinerbock]

I always find this debate interesting. If some fraternities want to welcome gay members into their organization, by all means, they should feel comfortable doing so. However, I think many are reluctant to do this, and I think that is understandable for a couple of reasons:

1) A lot of fraternities value Christian ideals. Many see homosexuality as immoral, and may be hesitant to endorse that lifestyle. Of course, some will likely see such an objection as hypocritical, considering other practices that are common in fraternities. That being said, tolerating or even encouraging some morally questionable activities isn't a persuasive reason to accept or encourage other objectionable activities.

2) Inviting someone into your fraternity usually leads to significant and extended contact with that person. In my opinion, doing so requires more than the level of "tolerance" that is often trumpeted in the workplace or other organizations. Many or most of these people will live together, take trips together, and experience social lives that are intertwined. A lot of guys get uncomfortable around overt homosexual activity. In my opinion this is usually natural, and not indicative of any conscious intolerance.

-I have a problem with the idea that fraternities are expected to be places of diversity. Fraternities, at least the ones I was around, did not intend to be microcosms of society. They were places for like-minded people to join together to pursue common interests and goals. If you like a potential member overall, then take him. However, I don't think fraternities should necessarily abide by the reasoning that they should take a potential member because they like him in every aspect except for his homosexuality. One's sexual orientation may be a big deal to an organization, and I don't have a problem with it being a deal breaker (nor do I have a problem with religion or ideology being one).

[SydneyK]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

1) A lot of fraternities value Christian ideals. Many see homosexuality as immoral, and may be hesitant to endorse that lifestyle. Of course, some will likely see such an objection as hypocritical, considering other practices that are common in fraternities.

Right. I find your last sentence to be true. I don't understand why some supposedly Christian-based fraternities welcome potential brothers who drink excessively, do drugs, or have premarital sex, but then also use their faith as a justification for rejecting potential brothers because of their sexual orientation. Also, welcoming a potential brother who happens to be gay does not mean the organization "endorses" homosexuality.

I've also noticed a strong (perhaps unrelated, but we'll never know) correlation between the groups who openly reject potential brothers (justified by their "values") and those groups which haze.

So again, I agree with your last sentence that some will see this excuse as hypocritical. You can't have it both ways. Either use your faith-based values as justification across the board, or don't appeal to those values as excuses at all.


2) Inviting someone into your fraternity usually leads to significant and extended contact with that person. In my opinion, doing so requires more than the level of "tolerance" that is often trumpeted in the workplace or other organizations. Many or most of these people will live together, take trips together, and experience social lives that are intertwined. A lot of guys get uncomfortable around overt homosexual activity. In my opinion this is usually natural, and not indicative of any conscious intolerance.

I guess my question here is what you mean by "overt homosexual activity". By simply professing one's sexual preference, does that count as "overt"? I've known several homosexual men in my life, and never have I actually witnessed homosexual activity from those men. In fact, I find homosexual men to be much more private with their sexual endeavors than their hetero counter-parts.

I can see your points, shiner, but I think they're relatively flawed. If your fraternity doesn't have a clause that addresses this specifically, then just say that. Don't appeal to reasons that don't hold water to make your case. And if your fraternity does have an official policy for this, and your chapter chooses not to adopt it, then just say that. It doesn't do any good when organizations lie about their policies, or even worse, just make things up to try to justify what they're doing.