NPHC Secretiveness, Insularity, Etc.

[Little32]

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Per my feelings and convictions about this matter, I will post here what I have to say to combat what I've just written about. If it's not about ritualistic matters (and not just traditions which are just practices that have grown up and are respected) and matters which have to do with proprietary information and intraorganizational gossip, it's should be talked about in public forums.

To my point. There has to be real dialogue and engagement on these issues between all parties for each group to hammer out what the parameters are. It just doesn't go one way! But I do know this:this culture of secrecy, esp. as it relates to hazing has to be changed. First, we have to get into the heads and hearts of members that we have to give up this sense of entitlement about Greek life. All Greek chapters are INVITED GUESTS on every campus. We live in an extremely litigious society and every institution is about protecting their ass(ets). GLOs represent a major matter of exposure to colleges and universities. We have to understand this and realize we exist on their campuses at their behest. We don't have inalienable rights in this matter! I'm cery muc in favor of maintaining the richness of BGLO traditions but they have to be devoid of the physical hazing aspect. Without question, the traditionally white GLOs have done a better job in addressing alcohol abuse issues in a programmatic and real way than we have of hazing, even though there is undergraduate rebellion in their midst and non-compliance too.

Case in point. Amongst NPHC groups, more open dialogue and transparency amongst the rank and file would have been better in crafting a better solution to the wholesale abolition of pledging in 1990. This decision had the result of making pledging a sub rosa activity and teh culture of hazing more more distorted in some ways. This is the reason why my fraternity is exploring bringing pledging back. But this issue does not exist in a cultureal vacuum. We are not simply accountable to our groups and the sometime secretive cultures that exist in them at different levels (just like in police depts., the military,etc. where exposure of misconduct or certain apects of its inner workings of the institution can be viewed as a betrayal of the group); we are accountable to the our hosts educational institutions and, increasingly, the legal and penal system. This will increasingly become the case if we act as we do now.

A few random thoughts on the fly!

Thanks. This clarifies, for me, parts of your earlier post.

[AKA_Monet]

To the OP: As a moderator for the AKA Ave Forum, I am dictated by our International HQ to NEVER DISCUSS MEMBERSHIP INTAKE with prospectives beyond "Hello and go to AKA1908.com"

I can NOT have my dues increase because random people tell prospectives crazy things. The GC AKA Ave. has over 2-3 posts per week regarding membership that are deleted. We even have a clear statement that we will NOT discuss membership. We will not discuss it and it will NEVER happen. We are holding our membership to ONE ACCORD for legitmacy as known by the Corporate Office to our member assumed to be lifelong members...


Wolfman: While I believe you all are quite eager to change the climate of your membership, have you all sustained the monetary blows to be of service to your communities?

The issue is the transition state between Undergraduate to Graduate Chapter does not translate. We lose members who wear the badge but fail do the work they commited themselves to do as "youth". We might have reactivation very late in one's life but the Sorority had dramatically changed from their initiation. We, as African Americans, cannot afford the loss...

What one sees on a college campus is NOT what is observed in the community by the Alumni. While we serve our respective communities, the undergraduate students do not have funds to maintain superior PR as the graduate chapters. It costs money to place ads in newspapers these days. Most universities student governments fail to include even IFC/NPC greeks, much less NPHC or MCGLO's. And universities NEVER give their rooms out to hold events as required by my International HQ. And we are a city-wide chapter.

There other issues, such as youth failing to understand the commitment. Yes, an re-introduction of an above ground pledge period that can misconstrued as hazing would be nice. But I know for a fact that Alpha Kappa Alpha Sorority, Inc. buried those thoughts in more ways than one...

[ChildoftheHorn]

Hmm..

I know of a few people(NPHC, NPC) thought having an "All-Greek" event where it would be a big cookout on the lake with people from every GLO on campus (IFC, NPC, NPHC, MGC). There would also be a tag football game with 1-2 people from each org.

It was kinda late in the year when we thought of it, but we hope to start it next year.

The big reason is that there is a huge division between the councils and there is no sense of unity within the Greek System.

I understand the D9 *hush*, but the point is also that many people are confused and mislead by lack of knowledge.
They hear about the hazing and assume that it is going on badly in every org on campus! no joke.....although I laughed when someone I knew said it.

Quite frankly, how would anyone know differently without taking out a portion of their day to do so (99% of people wouldn't)? There are none of the information meetings or discussion at all about the organizations (to the best of my knowledge).

Why not have an open hall during New Student Week where evey org has a few people and a sign/banner/board where they talk about their philanthropy/values/history for a couple of hours?

Both of these events would be good for the new students, current actives, and the system itself (everyone could use good exposure).

Sometimes, it is good to talk about (certain) things.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by ChildoftheHorn

Hmm..

I know of a few people(NPHC, NPC) thought having an "All-Greek" event where it would be a big cookout on the lake with people from every GLO on campus (IFC, NPC, NPHC, MGC). There would also be a tag football game with 1-2 people from each org.

It was kinda late in the year when we thought of it, but we hope to start it next year.

The big reason is that there is a huge division between the councils and there is no sense of unity within the Greek System.

I understand the D9 *hush*, but the point is also that many people are confused and mislead by lack of knowledge.
They hear about the hazing and assume that it is going on badly in every org on campus! no joke.....although I laughed when someone I knew said it.

Quite frankly, how would anyone know differently without taking out a portion of their day to do so (99% of people wouldn't)? There are none of the information meetings or discussion at all about the organizations (to the best of my knowledge).

Why not have an open hall during New Student Week where evey org has a few people and a sign/banner/board where they talk about their philanthropy/values/history for a couple of hours?

Both of these events would be good for the new students, current actives, and the system itself (everyone could use good exposure).

Sometimes, it is good to talk about (certain) things.

Several campi do have "Meet the Greeks". Some include all the councils, many don't... Also, the fact the many campi admins are "antigreek" overall, suggests that intervention by elders may be required. However, young people fail to ask us or ask us at the last minute--especially when matters are worse...

My undergraduate chapter that my graduate chapter oversees, has interacted with 2-3 different non-NPHC GLO's.

[Senusret I]

Child, some campuses do those things. On those campuses where the lack of information seems to be detrimental to the system, then talk to your greek affairs people -- seriously!

[ChildoftheHorn]

Yeah, on my campus there is a small thing that is done by a few of the councils individually - but not a collective....not a place where a student could explore all of their options.

There is not unity. There are quite a few people pushing for it, but IMO people have retained many of the prejudices against the Orgs. (this is a two way street).

As stupid as it seems....
-We follow the same guidelines
-Have similar structure (positions, philanthropy, tradition)
-Go to the same School (Go to class together)
-Have friends in each others' org.
-Belong to the same non-Greek groups

Why does it seem like such a strech for a lil' Greek unity too? - What council may be right for your friend, may not right for you.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by ChildoftheHorn

Yeah, on my campus there is a small thing that is done by a few of the councils individually - but not a collective....not a place where a student could explore all of their options.

There is not unity. There are quite a few people pushing for it, but IMO people have retained many of the prejudices against the Orgs. (this is a two way street).

As stupid as it seems....
-We follow the same guidelines
-Have similar structure (positions, philanthropy, tradition)
-Go to the same School (Go to class together)
-Have friends in each others' org.
-Belong to the same non-Greek groups

Why does it seem like such a strech for a lil' Greek unity too? - What council may be right for your friend, may not right for you.

Part of the issue is the inherent segregation placed on the campus. You met these "other greeks" in your classes and maybe an occassional view of a "yard show". Your greek life office failed to foster unity, probably because the ADULTS are not unified...

We cannot ask our young people to show unity when we, as a adults, aren't unified... During your parties at your house, have you invited any of the ethnic GLO's to assist you?

Moreover, there is a historical reason why many in the NPHC do not own houses near a large university...

At San Diego State University, I hooked up with 2-3 IFC's to inherently assist them in their classes. As a result, I started get my own Sorority undergraduate members assistance that I have never observed before. The kids came back to me and told all kinds of things.

Also, San Diego State University, was building a new greek row. They reorganized their greek life office and all GLO's started having the administration assistance in student affairs and perpetuating philathropy. I do not know how it now. But it I was involved in the early workings to see the changes taking place.

[ChildoftheHorn]

You know, the whole greek thing is funny on my campus.

Overall:
Fraternities are being rung out by the university.
Sororities could not be stronger!

BTW: Annual step show is SOLD OUT+ every year. You will see a lot of the MGC groups there, some people from the PNC, and very few IFC.

No one hates anyone else, there is just this distinct division. Granted, many of the orgs on campus have history going on 75 years + at that school for NPC and IFC. Houses make a big exporsure difference too, I think. Since all the greek houses are on campus, people see them very often. (Even I live in the Fraternity Quads - small dorm.) It is hard to break into that. Some of the Multi-cultural orgs. are extremely cliquish(w/hazing) and by doing so harm the others who are not. Since the NPC and IFC orgs are larger numbers per group, there is a more heavily enforced regulation.

Scenario: 30 XYZ pledges are hazed and 8 ABC pledges are hazed. It is a lot easier to get 1 XYZ to tell than 1 ABC based purely on numbers.

A lot of the *hush* is not just D9 stuff - or even the secrecy.

Its really a number run IMO.
i.e. They are smaller. there has to be a reason why they are smaller, must be hiding something, something weird must be going on.

Not to mention the prejudices/experiences of some people's parents that were in college 20-30 years ago (two way street - remember).

Org's will never be looked at the same way b/c they are inherently different (from their beginning) anyway...

[nwu43]

[quote=ChildoftheHorn;1495595]

There is not unity. There are quite a few people pushing for it, but IMO people have retained many of the prejudices against the Orgs. (this is a two way street).

Hmmm... do you remember that "famous" NU daily article written awhile back?

Mocking Diversity's Promise
(and everyone else should take a look at this too.. it's.. interesting)

"The lead article in The Daily's final issue of fall 2006 focused on declining black enrollment since the 1970s. Apparently NU is in some sort of crisis - there aren't enough blacks here. For now, this isn't our crisis. Our crisis is that blacks and other minorities do not spend enough time in any context with other races (and vice versa). Increasing the enrollment ratio of any race will not increase the interaction between different races and backgrounds. If NU were to eliminate social groups that construct themselves on race or a "cultural history," it would be the first step to resolving this crisis."

This article was written by a member of an IFC fraternity, basically calling for NPHC and MGC greeks to disappear, and from what I remember he wasn't the only one that held this opinion. Besides one guy from his fraternity that joined "our" cause in protest, most of the guys in his house totally agreed with him.

The NPHC and MGC greeks held a unity rally to protest, and apparently the guys in that house called our rally "bullshit" (this is a direct quote from the fraternity member who sided with us and overheard it). Other IFC greeks seemed to hold similar feelings about us. Of course, that is just from what I hear... but still, I'm pretty sure there's some truth to that. At end of our rally we held an event at Norris where everyone could discuss the issue and make speeches etc..., and some ignorant **** dressed in a bunny costume ran by trying to distract us and mock us.

It's kind of hard for us to want to work toward unity with mainstream Greeks when it seems like they really don't like us

[nwu43]

Btw, I know that he was writing for unity and more interaction between different races, but his definition of unity is much much different.. (kinda like the perfect Greek world would be all races in IFC frats). Although in a strange way I feel like not 100% of his article is completely bs, and I feel terrible about it...

[nwu43]

Sorry, I'm not trying to hijack this thread. But just for fun, I'd like you guys to note the irony of his final paragraph.

[ChildoftheHorn]

Tehe -- there are a lot of member here who are from NU....I didnt think there were many -- but I was surprised!

[DSTRen13]

[QUOTE=nwu43;1496293]

Originally Posted by ChildoftheHorn

Hmmm... do you remember that "famous" NU daily article written awhile back?

Mocking Diversity's Promise
(and everyone else should take a look at this too.. it's.. interesting)

"The lead article in The Daily's final issue of fall 2006 focused on declining black enrollment since the 1970s. Apparently NU is in some sort of crisis - there aren't enough blacks here. For now, this isn't our crisis. Our crisis is that blacks and other minorities do not spend enough time in any context with other races (and vice versa). Increasing the enrollment ratio of any race will not increase the interaction between different races and backgrounds. If NU were to eliminate social groups that construct themselves on race or a "cultural history," it would be the first step to resolving this crisis."

This article was written by a member of an IFC fraternity, basically calling for NPHC and MGC greeks to disappear, and from what I remember he wasn't the only one that held this opinion. Besides one guy from his fraternity that joined "our" cause in protest, most of the guys in his house totally agreed with him.

The NPHC and MGC greeks held a unity rally to protest, and apparently the guys in that house called our rally "bullshit" (this is a direct quote from the fraternity member who sided with us and overheard it). Other IFC greeks seemed to hold similar feelings about us. Of course, that is just from what I hear... but still, I'm pretty sure there's some truth to that. At end of our rally we held an event at Norris where everyone could discuss the issue and make speeches etc..., and some ignorant **** dressed in a bunny costume ran by trying to distract us and mock us.

It's kind of hard for us to want to work toward unity with mainstream Greeks when it seems like they really don't like us

So basically the only way to be unified is to all be the same???

[SWTXBelle]

To interject another perspective here - one of the things I valued about my sisterhood was the fact that I was NOT in a group where we were all the same. I had sisters of different races, majors, ages, interests, and I think it was a very good thing.

[DSTRen13]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

To interject another perspective here - one of the things I valued about my sisterhood was the fact that I was NOT in a group where we were all the same. I had sisters of different races, majors, ages, interests, and I think it was a very good thing.

I wasn't trying to say that everyone in an NPC/IFC group is all the same. I was responding to the article, and anyone else who believes that there is no need for NPHC, MGC, or any other groups outside of NPC/IFC groups - that these groups are the key to unity and the existence of other groups detracts from it.

We can be unified without all being the same. If you can do it within a sorority, you can do it within Greek life in general.