"Why Did You Decide to Join ...That?"

[ladygreek]

Originally Posted by RozRochelle

I founded my organization because I feel there is a need for it. Non-traditional students really don’t have a place in the traditional NPHC sororities. Sure, older students and single parents who otherwise meet membership criteria can and do join. However, there is no place for the student who must earn her degree online because her nearest college is too expensive and/or doesn’t offer night classes and/or is too far away to commute. And what about the working student who does take campus-based classes, but can only enroll part-time? She has no place, either.

I’ve met many non-traditional women who were very interested in belonging to a sorority but couldn’t because the above (and other) reasons made them ineligible. I don’t think the opportunity should be denied by omission. I don’t have anything against the NPHC sororities, and I’ve never tried to join any of them, so my motivation is not fueled by feelings of rejection. It’s just that times have changed, and those changes have created new needs to be met. Unfortunately, I don’t see these particular needs being met by any of the established organizations.

Your reasons are very valid. The issue of online students has been discussed and I am sure will continued to be discussed as that population increases.

As for the part-time student, my view is that they are part-time for a reason--usually working full-time, or taking care of children, or just can't afford full-time enrollment. Thus I would rather they wait until alumnae chapter and put all of the energy, time, and money they have to spare into furthering their education and graduating.

[RozRochelle]

Originally Posted by ladygreek

Your reasons are very valid. The issue of online students has been discussed and I am sure will continued to be discussed as that population increases.

As for the part-time student, my view is that they are part-time for a reason--usually working full-time, or taking care of children, or just can't afford full-time enrollment. Thus I would rather they wait until alumnae chapter and put all of the energy, time, and money they have to spare into furthering their education and graduating.

I'm glad to hear that there is ongoing dialogue regarding distance learning students (not all students are in "online" programs, some degree programs are 100% guided independent study). But, I have to say that the online student population is growing exponentially. Distance learning is in full effect and going strong, especially now that it's been proven that a classroom environment is not always necessary for a quality education.

Having been both a full-time and part-time student, and having known others who were doing the same, I can say from my experience that there really is not that much difference between the two groups. I don't think part-timers should have to wait and join an alumnae chapter for the reasons you mentioned because, if that's the case, the same can be said for the non-traditionals who are attending full-time. They do a balancing act, if not moreso, too.

Yes, some balance better than others, but the bottom line is that these women are ADULTS (my sorority is for women over 24 years old, btw) and it is not my place to tell them what they need to focus on in their lives outside of the sorority. That would be condescending.

[ladygreek]

Originally Posted by RozRochelle

I'm glad to hear that there is ongoing dialogue regarding distance learning students (not all students are in "online" programs, some degree programs are 100% guided independent study). But, I have to say that the online student population is growing exponentially. Distance learning is in full effect and going strong, especially now that it's been proven that a classroom environment is not always necessary for a quality education.

Having been both a full-time and part-time student, and having known others who were doing the same, I can say from my experience that there really is not that much difference between the two groups. I don't think part-timers should have to wait and join an alumnae chapter for the reasons you mentioned because, if that's the case, the same can be said for the non-traditionals who are attending full-time. They do a balancing act, if not moreso, too.

Yes, some balance better than others, but the bottom line is that these women are ADULTS (my sorority is for women over 24 years old, btw) and it is not my place to tell them what they need to focus on in their lives outside of the sorority. That would be condescending.

You make waiting and joining an alumnae chapter sound like a punishment. In the NPHC it isn't. Our members have the rest of their lifetime to be involved in their sorority. The collegiate years are few, the alumnae years are many.

Oh and btw, being an adult in age does not always translate to being an adult in mind.

[RozRochelle]

Originally Posted by ladygreek

You make waiting and joining an alumnae chapter sound like a punishment. In the NPHC it isn't. Our members have the rest of their lifetime to be involved in their sorority. The collegiate years are few, the alumnae years are many.

I didn't make it sound like anything. That's just the way you chose to interpret what I wrote. But, that's fine. Now, in the context in which I was speaking, I would understand why a woman in this situation would feel as if she were being punished or penalized for not being a full-time student.

Generally speaking; however, waiting to join an alumnae chapter is not a punishment and may actually be a better option for older women. But, the point I'm trying to make is that if someone has genuine interest in an org, and but for them being a part-time or online student, they would be accepted into the organization, GET THEM WHILE THEY ARE GUNG-HO.

Give that enthusiasm time to wane, due to life changes and et cetera, and you may never get them back. No matter how much admiration and interest a woman may have in any particular org, the sacrifices she is willing to make to become a part of that organization will change or fluctuate over time, depending on what is going on in her life. If someone is made to wait to join an alumnae chapter, there may come a point where even though her interest is still strong, the re-arrangements she would have to make in her life to join, X number of years later, may not be worth it. Many women get to the point where they say, "bump it", and toss that dream into the "dried up like a raisin in the sun" pile. That would be a needless loss for an organization that needs new members to perpetuate itself.

Edited to add: But, if that's the route the established orgs decide to go, more power to them. Theta Gamma Pi will be here to accept those women - if they meet our criteria - that don't want to wait to join an alumnae chapter. There's room for everybody.

Oh and btw, being an adult in age does not always translate to being an adult in mind.

Yes, I know that being an adult in age does not translate to being mature. However, I chose a minimum age of 24 years old for a reason that had nothing to do with mental maturity level. I was trying to be fair by staying in line with the age cutoff most colleges and universities use to identify non-traditional students. My personal preference is an older minimum age, but this is not a "vanity" project and it's not all about me. Principle won over preference.

[mccoyred]

Originally Posted by RozRochelle

I didn't make it sound like anything. That's just the way you chose to interpret what I wrote. But, that's fine. Now, in the context in which I was speaking, I would understand why a woman in this situation would feel as if she were being punished or penalized for not being a full-time student.

Generally speaking; however, waiting to join an alumnae chapter is not a punishment and may actually be a better option for older women. But, the point I'm trying to make is that if someone has genuine interest in an org, and but for them being a part-time or online student, they would be accepted into the organization, GET THEM WHILE THEY ARE GUNG-HO.

Give that enthusiasm time to wane, due to life changes and et cetera, and you may never get them back. No matter how much admiration and interest a woman may have in any particular org, the sacrifices she is willing to make to become a part of that organization will change or fluctuate over time, depending on what is going on in her life. If someone is made to wait to join an alumnae chapter, there may come a point where even though her interest is still strong, the re-arrangements she would have to make in her life to join, X number of years later, may not be worth it. Many women get to the point where they say, "bump it", and toss that dream into the "dried up like a raisin in the sun" pile. That would be a needless loss for an organization that needs new members to perpetuate itself.

Edited to add: But, if that's the route the established orgs decide to go, more power to them. Theta Gamma Pi will be here to accept those women - if they meet our criteria - that don't want to wait to join an alumnae chapter. There's room for everybody.

Yes, I know that being an adult in age does not translate to being mature. However, I chose a minimum age of 24 years old for a reason that had nothing to do with mental maturity level. I was trying to be fair by staying in line with the age cutoff most colleges and universities use to identify non-traditional students. My personal preference is an older minimum age, but this is not a "vanity" project and it's not all about me. Principle won over preference.

I am going to have to disagree with you here. If a person has the desire to join an org, they will still have the desire when/if the time comes for them to join. True desire does not wax or wane.

Also, some of my NPHC sister orgs have affiliates of women who do not have a college degree so that is always an option as well. I am not sure if these affiliates extend to distance or part-time students, though. If someone from one of said orgs wishes to speak further on this, they will.

[BlueReign]

Originally Posted by mccoyred

I am going to have to disagree with you here. If a person has the desire to join an org, they will still have the desire when/if the time comes for them to join. True desire does not wax or wane.

Also, some of my NPHC sister orgs have affiliates of women who do not have a college degree so that is always an option as well. I am not sure if these affiliates extend to distance or part-time students, though. If someone from one of said orgs wishes to speak further on this, they will.

If you are enrolled in a 4 year degree program you are not eligible for Philo affiliate membership.

Wait a minute, I should have addressed the poster above you McCoy Red, cause her statements are getting on my nerves. If you have a desire to be a part of SOMETHING GREAT, that should never wax or wane. I did not become a member until I was 36 years old AND I had children. But it works out well for us because my sorority has functions and service opportunities that my children participate in since several of our national programs are youth-based.

For the new groups that have been posting on here I don't understand their founding and focus. Please don't get me wrong and and begin a barrage of attacks for my statements here because I would love to help. I tried to help the originator of this thread with real live opportunities and people I could connect him with and through PM I didn't see his real desire to do so. It just seems that these groups are started with an antagonistic purpose and an insecurity about not being part of the D9. As my fellow greeks and Sorors have stated in this thread, it takes years to build. I can understand the new groups members' defensiveness cause you do get tired of explaining yourself but some of us would like to genuinely be of assistance.

[RozRochelle]

Originally Posted by BlueReign

If you are enrolled in a 4 year degree program you are not eligible for Philo affiliate membership.

Wait a minute, I should have addressed the poster above you McCoy Red, cause her statements are getting on my nerves. If you have a desire to be a part of SOMETHING GREAT, that should never wax or wane. I did not become a member until I was 36 years old AND I had children. But it works out well for us because my sorority has functions and service opportunities that my children participate in since several of our national programs are youth-based.

For the new groups that have been posting on here I don't understand their founding and focus. Please don't get me wrong and and begin a barrage of attacks for my statements here because I would love to help. I tried to help the originator of this thread with real live opportunities and people I could connect him with and through PM I didn't see his real desire to do so. It just seems that these groups are started with an antagonistic purpose and an insecurity about not being part of the D9. As my fellow greeks and Sorors have stated in this thread, it takes years to build. I can understand the new groups members' defensiveness cause you do get tired of explaining yourself but some of us would like to genuinely be of assistance.

I'm glad you were able to accomplish your dream and goal of membership in your organization. But, just because you did it doesn't mean everyone else can. And, just because you waited doesn't mean others should wait. All circumstances are not the same. What works for you may not work for someone else, and until now non-traditional women had no other options. They either waited or gave up the dream. Now at least they have another option.

I can't speak for the other new organizations, but my sorority's focus is clear (and clearly stated in my first post). I don't have an antagonistic purpose and I'm not insecure about not being in a D9 org, because I could have been, and still can, if that's what I wanted to do. I feel for those who are, but I'm not a D9 reject. That being said, I would love the help of someone who knows more about how to do things in GLOs.

[RozRochelle]

Originally Posted by mccoyred

I am going to have to disagree with you here. If a person has the desire to join an org, they will still have the desire when/if the time comes for them to join. True desire does not wax or wane.

Also, some of my NPHC sister orgs have affiliates of women who do not have a college degree so that is always an option as well. I am not sure if these affiliates extend to distance or part-time students, though. If someone from one of said orgs wishes to speak further on this, they will.

I didn't say desire would wane. In a nutshell, I said enthusiasm and willingness to make sacrifices for membership (rearranging her and her FAMILY'S lives for however long or short a time) might wane due to life circumstances. Don't forget, I'm ONLY talking about non-traditional aged women who are interested in joining a sorority, not all women.

That affiliate thing is not the real thing. Only the real thing is the real thing, LOL. That's like when I had to quit law school due to Lupus, and was dealing with the loss of that dream, people would tell me to become a paralegal. It's NOT the same thing.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by RozRochelle

I didn't say desire would wane. In a nutshell, I said enthusiasm and willingness to make sacrifices for membership (rearranging her and her FAMILY'S lives for however long or short a time) might wane due to life circumstances. Don't forget, I'm ONLY talking about non-traditional aged women who are interested in joining a sorority, not all women.

Our organizations aren't missing out when people's enthusiasm and willingness wane for whatever reasons. They either come back around when they are a willing and able undergraduate or graduate, or they don't.

While it's a good thing that your sorority exists, your marketing technique should place more emphasis on the qualities of your organization and less on the perceived "inadequacies" of other organizations for the nontraditional student. And your eagerness to accept women who WISH they could join an NPHC organization but just don't want to wait for alumnae chapter is interesting. This is why there are some organizations that will always play the background and they are content with that.

Originally Posted by RozRochelle

That affiliate thing is not the real thing. Only the real thing is the real thing, LOL. That's like when I had to quit law school due to Lupus, and was dealing with the loss of that dream, people would tell me to become a paralegal. It's NOT the same thing.

I agree with you there. But is your organization the real thing? If not, these women aren't getting the real thing by not pursuing an NPHC sorority and they are settling for a knockoff that fits their schedule.

But they can always change their mind after they join your organization and join an NPC or NPHC sorority. There's always hope.

[RedefinedDiva]

Originally Posted by RozRochelle

That affiliate thing is not the real thing. Only the real thing is the real thing, LOL. That's like when I had to quit law school due to Lupus, and was dealing with the loss of that dream, people would tell me to become a paralegal. It's NOT the same thing.

While becoming a paralegal is no replacement for being an attorney, if becoming an attorney is in your heart, you will complete your coursework in order to attain your degree. Thus, it is the same with joining a sorority. As it has been stated previously, if something is TRULY in your heart, you will see it through, regardless of how long it takes.

I, like many others, waited for my time came. Though it may have taken longer than the time spent in my undergraduate institution, the goal was achieved. For someone to say that they "don't have time to wait" or "might lose interest over time" or some other bogus excuse along those lines, shows that they just want to belong to something. THOSE are the people that often give newer orgs. a bad name. If your org. is truly filling a void or reaching out to an "untapped market," more power to you. However, to state that you were founded to give women who don't want to wait an option, you've basically pegging yourself as a "backup plan" org.

What happens with your members when their interest "reappears" or an opportunity to join presents itself to them?

[rhoyaltempest]

Originally Posted by RozRochelle

I didn't say desire would wane. In a nutshell, I said enthusiasm and willingness to make sacrifices for membership (rearranging her and her FAMILY'S lives for however long or short a time) might wane due to life circumstances. Don't forget, I'm ONLY talking about non-traditional aged women who are interested in joining a sorority, not all women.

That affiliate thing is not the real thing. Only the real thing is the real thing, LOL. That's like when I had to quit law school due to Lupus, and was dealing with the loss of that dream, people would tell me to become a paralegal. It's NOT the same thing.

This depends on how you define "real thing" and IMO if the sisterhood is real, than it's the "real" thing. I just want to clear something up here because I don't want any of our Philo members to be offended by this and I know that some of them are on greekchat. You should really know what you're talking about before you make such a statement.

The Philo Club of Sigma Gamma Rho functions much like a sorority although they are not greek. These women have a long and illustrious history of supporting and assisting Sigma Gamma Rho in serving the community and they believe in our goals and mission. They have their own sisterhood, officers, by-laws, colors, theme, flower, etc. and head community service projects on their own, although they are under the advisement of the Sigma Gamma Rho grad chapters. These women do not have 4 year degrees and are not enrolled in 4 year college programs, but they are successful and accomplished in their own right. They are proud to be members of their sisterhood and just like us, many look forward to being active for a lifetime. These women are a part of our family and we don't see them as not being able to take part in the "real" thing.

A sisterhood such as the Philo Club could be a viable option for SOME non-traditional students. These women have more history and service under their belts than ANY of these new organizations, so please do the research before making uninformed statements.

For more on the Philo Club of Sigma Gamma Rho, go to www.philoclub.org.

[ladygreek]

Originally Posted by RozRochelle

I didn't make it sound like anything. That's just the way you chose to interpret what I wrote. But, that's fine. Now, in the context in which I was speaking, I would understand why a woman in this situation would feel as if she were being punished or penalized for not being a full-time student.

Generally speaking; however, waiting to join an alumnae chapter is not a punishment and may actually be a better option for older women. But, the point I'm trying to make is that if someone has genuine interest in an org, and but for them being a part-time or online student, they would be accepted into the organization, GET THEM WHILE THEY ARE GUNG-HO.

Give that enthusiasm time to wane, due to life changes and et cetera, and you may never get them back. No matter how much admiration and interest a woman may have in any particular org, the sacrifices she is willing to make to become a part of that organization will change or fluctuate over time, depending on what is going on in her life. If someone is made to wait to join an alumnae chapter, there may come a point where even though her interest is still strong, the re-arrangements she would have to make in her life to join, X number of years later, may not be worth it. Many women get to the point where they say, "bump it", and toss that dream into the "dried up like a raisin in the sun" pile. That would be a needless loss for an organization that needs new members to perpetuate itself.

Edited to add: But, if that's the route the established orgs decide to go, more power to them. Theta Gamma Pi will be here to accept those women - if they meet our criteria - that don't want to wait to join an alumnae chapter. There's room for everybody.

Yes, I know that being an adult in age does not translate to being mature. However, I chose a minimum age of 24 years old for a reason that had nothing to do with mental maturity level. I was trying to be fair by staying in line with the age cutoff most colleges and universities use to identify non-traditional students. My personal preference is an older minimum age, but this is not a "vanity" project and it's not all about me. Principle won over preference.

My,my,my. I started off trying to compliment you on your decision by saying your reasons were very valid, and you jumped defensive. What's that about? Just do you.

BTW: MANY non-traditional students have joined NPHC orgs while in college at all ages. Don't make it sound like your org is the great non-traditional hope.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by ladygreek

My,my,my. I started off trying to compliment you on your decision and you jump defensive. What's that about?

I thought her sorority was a good idea, too.

Reading along, it seems as though she may be a disgruntled NPHC hopeful. Will she find herself at an NPHC alumnae chapter sometime? Maybe.

[RozRochelle]

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

I thought her sorority was a good idea, too.

Reading along, it seems as though she may be a disgruntled NPHC hopeful. Will she find herself at an NPHC alumnae chapter sometime? Maybe.

I am not a disgruntled NPHC hopeful. I never tried to join. However, I did notice that part-time and online non-trads had no options, other than waiting for grad chapter. I thought they should have the same opportunity, as undergrads, as full-time campus-based non-trad undergrads had.

Seeing as how my sorority is not an NPC or NPHC org, and has no plans to pursue membership in either in the future, membership in an alumnae chapter is not an impossibility. I don't see how I can give 100% to two organizations, but I have learned (the hard way) to never say never. I'll just say it's unlikely.

[RozRochelle]

Originally Posted by ladygreek

My,my,my. I started off trying to compliment you on your decision by saying your reasons were very valid, and you jumped defensive. What's that about? Just do you.

BTW: MANY non-traditional students have joined NPHC orgs while in college at all ages. Don't make it sound like your org is the great non-traditional hope.

I didn't get defensive, and if that's how I came across, I do apologize. If you could hear how I meant it, you'd know I wasn't trying to be rude. Was that barb about my org being the "great non-traditional hope" really necessary? We have the same purpose, just different membership target groups. I already said that there was enough room for everybody.

Anyway, I think you are letting your irritation get you off focus. In this thread, I am talking about online and part-time students, not campus-based, full-time non-traditionals - whom I have already addressed as being eligible to join the traditional GLOs. So, for the online and/or part-time female student who doesn't want to wait for post-grad status to join a GLO, Theta Gamma Pi just might be her great non-traditional hope.