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Old 02-18-2008, 09:13 PM
bohdi bohdi is offline
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My response in parenthesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drolefille View Post
No, I'm not comfortable with those who aren't highly trained being armed around me. Soldiers? Fine. Police? Sure. Your average college student who can't be bothered to renew his driver's license is not likely to stay up on his FOID card either.
Considering most states won't allow anyone under 21 to carry concealed anyway, I'll take this as a nod to compromise. People 21 years and older have known to be soldiers, so that qualifies them for your need.


Shooting at a gunman makes you a target in return. (Only if you miss) The more cover you use, the less visibility you will have, the more likely someone could run between you and the gunman, etc. Your chances are not "50/50" so if you base your decision making off of those odds, you're starting from a flawed standpoint. - Actually no I'm not. Wearing a concealed weapon gives you an advantage of surprise.

If your odds are so tiny than even doubling them doesn't make it a viable concern. "Criminals" don't engage in this sort of shooting spree. (Again I disagree. They become criminals the moment they walk onto a campus that doesn't allow firearms) "Whackos" as you classily put it, don't think about the number of guns the people they want to kill have. Whatever purpose the NIU guy, or the Virginia Tech guy, had in his head, it wasn't "I'll shoot them because they don't have guns." It is much more likely to be, "I'll get them back, they deserve it." (VT, sure. Columbine, sure. Colorado springs, not so clear. This one either)

Police officers are never attacked? Shot at first? Gun stores are never attacked? Crime doesn't exist in Texas? (Compared to your average person and situation, it's negligable)

Not this sort of suicide/homicide they don't. Someone disturbed to this level is not thinking like that and they expect to die at the end of it. The man who attacked the churches in Colorado had a previous connection there... there was some reason, in his head, why they deserved it.

How many college students are there? How many have been shot by a gunman. How many have been in a classroom with a gunman? You might be better off playing the lottery than betting on being in that situation, but either one's a stupid bet. (How many never had a fighting chance or option?)

Nothing will help everyone. If everyone in that class room had a gun, people still would have died. Maybe more, maybe less. This sort of gunman usually takes his own life or has the police do it for him. (I actually agree with you here. But that's the point, less loss of life and the means to ensure it.)

No. I'm not a pacifist. I'd stop you if possible, and if not, injure you as much as necessary and/or possible while screaming for help. Fists are not guns. (No but fists are tools, one option. Just like a gun is a tool, like a knife is a tool).

Where did I say "minority students" could carry? You're not actually reading what I'm typing any more. Allowing weapons as a general rule on a college campus means that not only non-traditional, ex-military students can carry, but that Joe Student can as well. So nix that. (You stated older non-traditional students were in the minority, hence they are minority students.)

So you don't trust the police or you only trust them as much as you trust a private citzen? (Not when the Police have absolutely no obligation to respond) http://www.wftv.com/news/15335127/detail.html

So, anyone who shoots a gun is, on average, highly inaccurate. The police, trained in how to enter and handle a situation where a gunman is in a building with civilians, can control their numbers and their method. The average armed civilian has no training nor control over the police or other civilians. If they're all highly inaccurate, I'd rather have the police handle it thank you. Why add another gun firing into the mix? Or two guns? Or a 300 person lecture hall full of them? (In this situation your already in the room, shooter is in front ofyou or behind you. If he's in front, everyone else is already out of your firing range. If he's behind you, most of the students will be too far out of firing range as well. I don't agree with your position.)

Maybe it's just that I don't live in fear of people walking into my classroom and shooting me. (Perhaps you ought to, it's becoming more common place.) I don't feel a need to carry a weapon around wherever I go. And sorry shinerbock, too much practice on line by line quoting on my part.
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