Obama Youth

[KSigkid]

Originally Posted by Kevlar281

So I’ve heard some criticism about the involvement of youth participating in the presidential campaign. I’ve always been of the mind set that anything that gets kids interested in the political process was/is a good thing. Now normally I wouldn’t post something like this but since it has such obvious GLO references I was hoping we could have some discussion about it. Sorry if it has already been posted.

Obama Youth - Junior Fraternity Regiment

Seriously? I haven't heard a bit of criticism of youth involvement, and I've been paying a lot of attention to the election.

[Alpha Sig Scott]

You be the judge.

Hitler
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdPSqL9_mfM


Lenin
http://www.jillstanek.com/archives/2...s_and_can.html

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

I still don't see how basically stating that working as a community organizer does not serve as preparation to be president of the United States is an attack on ALL organizers or human services personnel.

I lost count... could you please tell me how many community organizers are currently running for President?

That group (I'm sure it's close to all of them) is the only group those comments could be fairly attributed to.

[ThetaDancer]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

No, I heard her say that she was Mayor, which was sort of like being a community organizer. . . Will try to hunt up the transcript - I heard it on NPR, and it wasn't PTA, I'm pretty sure.

eta - here you go. Still looking for the insult to the general group. Let me know where it is in the speech, jeni.eta - AH - you are talking Rudy - I'm talking Palin. Sorry. I hate Rudy, so there you go. He's an ass, and I didn't listen to his speech.

I guess a small-town mayor is sort of like a "community organizer," except that you have actual responsibilities. I might add that in small towns, we don't quite know what to make of a candidate who lavishes praise on working people when they are listening, and then talks about how bitterly they cling to their religion and guns when those people aren't listening.

And for the record, I'm not a Palin fan. I'm just sick of BOTH candidates having their words twisted, misquoted, and the other side heaping scorn on them for things that didn't even happen. The whisper campaigns get on my last nerve, too.

OK OK OK! You're right. It was mayor. I wasn't trying to misquote, twist words, or heap scorn...or anything else that makes you sick, for that matter...I simply made a mistake. Thank you for correcting me so graciously.

I still don't understand how you could hear her quote and not take that as directed to all community organizers but I frankly don't care about trying to explain that.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

Honest question - what is the definition of a community organizer? Is it more of an informal grouping ( one in which you get to define what it means to be one - and they are all independent of one another), or do they have an umbrella group to which you can belong if you are one? And how many are there?

GC Thread on "Community Organizer"

Originally Posted by Kevin

I lost count... could you please tell me how many community organizers are currently running for President?

That group (I'm sure it's close to all of them) is the only group those comments could be fairly attributed to.

C'mon counselor. Palin and Giuliani's comments at the GOP convention weren't as limited as you'd like to make them. I could give them the benefit of the doubt and say the meant for them to be that limited (but I don't think that's the case), but they certainly didn't come out that way.

[CrackerBarrel]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

GC Thread on "Community Organizer"

C'mon counselor. Palin and Giuliani's comments at the GOP convention weren't as limited as you'd like to make them. I could give them the benefit of the doubt and say the meant for them to be that limited (but I don't think that's the case), but they certainly didn't come out that way.

It doesn't really matter to them how they came across. "Community organizing" by its very nature tends to be politically liberal (registering low income and homeless people to vote, getting people all stirred up over social programs, etc.). There weren't many community organizers voting Republican anyways, so they can say whatever they want about them.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

GC Thread on "Community Organizer"

C'mon counselor. Palin and Giuliani's comments at the GOP convention weren't as limited as you'd like to make them. I could give them the benefit of the doubt and say the meant for them to be that limited (but I don't think that's the case), but they certainly didn't come out that way.

And taking something which is mere hyperbole, which in its context is in a political speech smearing a particular person to mean something far beyond what it was intended to mean is, at least in my world, unreasonable.

[KSig RC]

Wait, we're really concerned that the all-important "community organizer" vote is being disparaged by a group that, for all intents and purposes, doesn't cater to the community being organized?

Obama's background as a community organizer is fair game, as is Palin's PTA experience/exceptionally short rise to governor. Especially when you consider the cozy relationships between many of the organizations that use COs and political parties, it really doesn't seem all that different from a community-based lobbyist, or a party-level worker. That can be worthwhile experience, or it can be grooming for future positions, or any variety of things.

I simply can't see rhetoric attacking Obama's background as causing some sort of uprising among community activists against McCain - foremost, because those who would be most upset likely aren't voting for him, and on a shallower level, because of cognitive dissonance and the fact that many people won't personalize the comparison unless they're already looking to be upset.

It actually seems like a relatively safe play by the GOP, because it's tough to combat - "no, seriously, I did great work in the community" . . . see how disingenuous that sounds? It's the "I'm a good driver" corollary - if Obama has to say it for himself, it's likely not true, so he won't, and he'll (correctly) hope his record speaks for itself. It gives a somewhat solid, certainly unopposed soundbite, one that is ultimately high in calories but low in substance. I just don't see any risk - similar to Obama using a youth movement, something that has incredibly high upside (both in terms of utility and cost/benefit) and only insipid potential for downside in the eyes of people who wouldn't vote for him anyway.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by CrackerBarrel

It doesn't really matter to them how they came across. "Community organizing" by its very nature tends to be politically liberal (registering low income and homeless people to vote, getting people all stirred up over social programs, etc.). There weren't many community organizers voting Republican anyways, so they can say whatever they want about them.

I don't know that I'd agree with that -- seems like a purposefully limited description of "community organizing." Conservatives do their fair share of registration and get out the vote efforts. Then there are the right-to-life movements, the taxpayers groups, etc.

Originally Posted by KSig RC

Obama's background as a community organizer is fair game, as is Palin's PTA experience/exceptionally short rise to governor.

That, I agree with. I was only responding to the suggestion that Palin and Giuliani's remarks were specifically focused on Obama. They weren't, because Palin and Giuliani knew that targeting (and making fun of) "community organizers" generally would have an energizing effect on their base.

[CrackerBarrel]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

I don't know that I'd agree with that -- seems like a purposefully limited description of "community organizing." Conservatives do their fair share of registration and get out the vote efforts. Then there are the right-to-life movements, the taxpayers groups, etc.

But they don't call themselves community organizers. The people who could even conceivably be offended by it weren't voting Republican to start with.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by CrackerBarrel

But they don't call themselves community organizers.

Some that I have dealt with among the pro-life groups do indeed call themselves that. (Well . . . maybe not so much anymore, but they did before the current campaign.)

The people who could even conceivably be offended by it weren't voting Republican to start with.

Which is consistent with my point -- that Giuliani and Palin were not limiting their comments to Obama, but were slamming community organizers as a whole because they knew the base they were speaking to would eat it up.