CNNs Black in America w/ Soledad O'brien: July 19-27

[I.A.S.K.]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Where young people usually turn to... Each other--like minded individuals--that may be unsavory.

I think it is. The blind can't lead the blind to safety. Or anywhere positive for that matter.

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Mentoring and mentorship have fallen by the wayside.

In a million and one ways! Mentor's are a scarcity. At my school only the kids with behavorial problems (as in they showed out and did what they wanted when they wanted, but were not really bad kids) got mentors. Accelerated (black) kids didn't get anything. You either had to have the highest grades in the school or be the badest kid in the school to get attention. I mean in 6th grade my reading tests showed that I was reading on a second semester high school senior's reading level, but I wasn't in an advanced literature class until my mom and I decided I was either going to get into one or change schools. I constantly got the best grades, but was never tested for advanced placement in school. Since we moved a lot and my grades were really good my mom didnt press the subject. When I was in elem. school in a predominately white area I was in advanced writing classes. Coincidence? Hell NO! I think the lack of attention to accelerated black students was because of CIB mentality and low expectations of people in and around the public school system.

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

I wonder what city do you reside? Or what region? Because it is a "crabs in a barrel mentality that is killing us.

OMG! CIB mentality should be illegal! I've lived in different areas, but for most of the bad educational experiences I was in Georgia.

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Some of us older folks feel similarly The more things change, the more they stay the same.

That is why many of us say: keep yourself "educated" and always under study... The reason why we say this because you must NEVER stop learning because the Truth sets you free.

I feel you. I vowed to never stop learning when I heard two things:
1. If you want to hide something from [expletive deleted] put it in a book because [expletive deleted] don't read.
and
2. The world can take whatever it wants from you. It can take life and limb, but what's up here (pointing to brain) No one and nothing can take that. Its yours forever.


This one was supposed to be short...my bad.

[knight_shadow]

I saw half of the "Black Women and Family" segment (haven't gotten around to watching the rest yet). I agree that it didn't say anything that I didn't already know, but it did open up the floor for communication between my friends and I (watched it with a black/filipino girl, haitian/lebanese guy, and chinese guy). Just that first half caused a 3 hour conversation about how "real" the situations depicted were.

I'm looking forward to watching the rest.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

In a million and one ways! Mentor's are a scarcity. At my school only the kids with behavorial problems (as in they showed out and did what they wanted when they wanted, but were not really bad kids) got mentors. Accelerated (black) kids didn't get anything. You either had to have the highest grades in the school or be the badest kid in the school to get attention. I mean in 6th grade my reading tests showed that I was reading on a second semester high school senior's reading level, but I wasn't in an advanced literature class until my mom and I decided I was either going to get into one or change schools. I constantly got the best grades, but was never tested for advanced placement in school. Since we moved a lot and my grades were really good my mom didnt press the subject. When I was in elem. school in a predominately white area I was in advanced writing classes. Coincidence? Hell NO! I think the lack of attention to accelerated black students was because of CIB mentality and low expectations of people in and around the public school system.

All kids need mentors, often the your mentor is not your ethnic group. Personally, if they are earnestly interested in your success, it should not matter. But that's why you "diversify" your "repertoire"--because you NEVER know who you learn from. Sometimes, you can get an education on the streets... LOL.

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

I feel you. I vowed to never stop learning when I heard two things:
1. If you want to hide something from N***** put it in a book because N******s don't read.
and
2. The world can take whatever it wants from you. It can take life and limb, but what's up here (pointing to brain) No one and nothing can take that. Its yours forever.


This one was supposed to be short...my bad.

First you put "red" up in the AKA Ave... LOL... Then you say the N-word on GC. I really am not liking that kind of profanity on the AKA Ave. So slow your roll or I start deleting posts.

This thread is about the CNN special and how the show was pretty much an "and" moment... There were some parts that were clarified, some parts folks will be forever talking about, and some parts that we all want to forget.

Can you help me tie in your experiences with the CNN special? How do they connect? Do you wish to clarify?

[SummerChild]

Um, unfortunately, I am not sure if the bad educational experience in Georgia is a result of CIB. It might be just b/c Georgia has one of the worst educational systems in the country. Um, that might be it. I know of others who moved to Georgia who also performed very well in Georgia whom were simply average or good students in other states. This is from someone whose beau is an elementary school teacher in Georgia. His school performs well but in general, ... well, I think that much of the south leaves something to be desired in terms of public education. Ok, now everyone from the south can jump on me. But that seems to be reality. He thinks that it's b/c much of the south has traditionally focused more on agriculture than traditional education and now things are changing but they are still playing catchup to some extent relative to the north, which was industrialized earlier.

SC

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

I think it is. The blind can't lead the blind to safety. Or anywhere positive for that matter.



In a million and one ways! Mentor's are a scarcity. At my school only the kids with behavorial problems (as in they showed out and did what they wanted when they wanted, but were not really bad kids) got mentors. Accelerated (black) kids didn't get anything. You either had to have the highest grades in the school or be the badest kid in the school to get attention. I mean in 6th grade my reading tests showed that I was reading on a second semester high school senior's reading level, but I wasn't in an advanced literature class until my mom and I decided I was either going to get into one or change schools. I constantly got the best grades, but was never tested for advanced placement in school. Since we moved a lot and my grades were really good my mom didnt press the subject. When I was in elem. school in a predominately white area I was in advanced writing classes. Coincidence? Hell NO! I think the lack of attention to accelerated black students was because of CIB mentality and low expectations of people in and around the public school system.




OMG! CIB mentality should be illegal! I've lived in different areas, but for most of the bad educational experiences I was in Georgia.





I feel you. I vowed to never stop learning when I heard two things:
1. If you want to hide something from [expletive deleted] put it in a book because [expletive deleted] don't read.
and
2. The world can take whatever it wants from you. It can take life and limb, but what's up here (pointing to brain) No one and nothing can take that. Its yours forever.


This one was supposed to be short...my bad.

[SummerChild]

HC the females are children and the males are adults in your post?
SC

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

I saw half of the "Black Women and Family" segment (haven't gotten around to watching the rest yet). I agree that it didn't say anything that I didn't already know, but it did open up the floor for communication between my friends and I (watched it with a black/filipino girl, haitian/lebanese guy, and chinese guy). Just that first half caused a 3 hour conversation about how "real" the situations depicted were.

I'm looking forward to watching the rest.

[I.A.S.K.]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

All kids need mentors, often the your mentor is not your ethnic group. Personally, if they are earnestly interested in your success, it should not matter. But that's why you "diversify" your "repertoire"--because you NEVER know who you learn from. Sometimes, you can get an education on the streets... LOL.



First you put "red" up in the AKA Ave... LOL... Then you say the N-word on GC. I really am not liking that kind of profanity on the AKA Ave. So slow your roll or I start deleting posts.

This thread is about the CNN special and how the show was pretty much an "and" moment... There were some parts that were clarified, some parts folks will be forever talking about, and some parts that we all want to forget.

Can you help me tie in your experiences with the CNN special? How do they connect? Do you wish to clarify?

First I apologize for the Nword. That is my error and thank you for correcting it. Also, the red was for distinction only. I appologize for that as well. My mind's color sensor was not on.

To clarify,

I did not mean to imply that all kids did not need mentors. Nor did I mean that the mentors needed to be black. Any mentor would be great. I think it would be awesome if young kids could get a mentor of another race who can open their minds to different cultures and ways of thinking. The world would be a much better place. I just meant that the black kids who weren't at the absolute top of the class did not get mentors. To be completely accurate all students who did not spend a lot of time in front of admins (for good or bad) were left out. I distinguished between advanced black kids and others because they did not get any extra attention. Almost every white (or other) kid who showed a little potential was tested for advanced classes, but most of the black kids were not. As it relates to CNN's duh moment that they called Black In America... In black women and the family part of it focused on the education of young black people. In this mediocre coverage of the black woman and the family the idea of mentorship was not explored directly and neither were many other things. The lapses of CNN sparked this discussion which is how my experiences came into play. They relate to CNN because they are the problems of the black woman and the family as well as the black man that were not covered, but could and should have been.



SummerChild,
I would have to agree with you about Georgia's public education system being one of the worst. It is very bad. I went to schools in other states and it was entirely different. CIB mentality was a part of it because of the way the shcool system was run then and still is now. CIB mentality is definitely at play when it comes to decision makers in the school system and the election of them. Also, the expectation was that students would not do well. I mean if your goal is to have less than half of your students pass the graduation exam (which was maybe a an increase of 2 or 3 percent from the last year [a total of 9 more students out of 300] ) then there is a serious expectation problem.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

To clarify,

I did not mean to imply that all kids did not need mentors. Nor did I mean that the mentors needed to be black. Any mentor would be great. I think it would be awesome if young kids could get a mentor of another race who can open their minds to different cultures and ways of thinking. The world would be a much better place. I just meant that the black kids who weren't at the absolute top of the class did not get mentors. To be completely accurate all students who did not spend a lot of time in front of admins (for good or bad) were left out. I distinguished between advanced black kids and others because they did not get any extra attention. Almost every white (or other) kid who showed a little potential was tested for advanced classes, but most of the black kids were not. As it relates to CNN's duh moment that they called Black In America... In black women and the family part of it focused on the education of young black people. In this mediocre coverage of the black woman and the family the idea of mentorship was not explored directly and neither were many other things. The lapses of CNN sparked this discussion which is how my experiences came into play. They relate to CNN because they are the problems of the black woman and the family as well as the black man that were not covered, but could and should have been.

But the that's the thing in a "Gaussian Distribution" or a "Bell shaped curve". The dunces who act out will get the beat down mentors to save face--think of them like "pre probation officers"... LOL. And the super geniuses who "they" think can make them lots of money will get "coaches" and "counselors"--think of them like Guantanamo Bay interrogators.

To truly mentor Black children takes several types of people. One to be a coach, one to "motivate to accelerate", and one be that mental health worker, etc. But NO ONE DOES that for free and with the breakdown of the Black family, it will not happen anytime soon.

CNN does not comprehend the Black family dynamics. And the goal of the documentary was to give folks a tasting of it is like in the day and life of kneegrows in America. That taste was bitter and foul. The stats were enough. America has problems that need to be fixed. "A country's success is how the least of their countrymen are treated..." (Forgot who said that)

Your other issue of who gets tested and who does not for advance placement classes, that is called the issue of tracking. And tracking usually is ensured by parents who are on it with their kids. If parents are not queued up, then no matter how smart "Johnny" tests, he is not going to get a fair shake. Period. Now parents should not be "helicoptering", but many are and that is how "affirmative action" is done these days...

So, know that your past formed you to who you are today and you have learned to question (which is a good thing, in some cases). But, you also have to search for your own answered by asking direct questions that can be tested by a process, rather than using "circular logic".

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by SummerChild

HC the females are children and the males are adults in your post?
SC

What the hell are you talking about? I hope you don't mean the "girl" and "guy" thing. If so, you're doing too much...

[SummerChild]

Ok, first of all, you're going to have to slow down and use the appropriate language when speaking to a woman. That kind of language is inappropriate when addressing a woman. I know that Summerchild may seem unisex but it's really not.

Ok, yes, I'm talking about the "girl" and "guy" thing. This has been an ongoing debate since the 60's. Is this the first that you're hearing of it? At any rate, whether it is or it isn't there are studies that show that the way of addressing a human is either indicative of the way that one thinks of the human or maybe it's the other way around. I'm not sure.

It would be like me referring to you or any other man as a "boy." This is analogous to an adult woman being referred to as a "girl."

SC

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

What the hell are you talking about? I hope you don't mean the "girl" and "guy" thing. If so, you're doing too much...

[DSTCHAOS]

Gender equality means that knight_shadow's gender-neutral way of typing to you is appropriate whether you're a woman or a man. All is fair in love and message boards.

knight_shadow, "guy" is typically used to refer to men. "Boys" are referred to as "boys." You (perhaps subconsciously) typed "girl" and "guy" which implies a nonadult female and an adult male. The question that Summerchild asked and her follow-up explanation are exactly right. However, this is a subconscious thing and that's why you'd think she was nitpicking. This isn't the worst thing in the world because "guy" is slang but it's almost as bad (or worse, depending) as referring to a group of males and females as "guys."

Yay! Woohoo!

[RedefinedDiva]

*standing up*

My name is RD and I am guilty of this.

*covering face*

OK, seriously, I do still refer to men and women, in coversation, as "girl" and "boy." I don't know why. In conversation, as a quick retort, I usually spout "Girl/boy, please!" I don't mean it was a means to belittle any man or woman, but it's just force of habit. I have been making a meaningful attempt to correct it since a guy I was conversing with "checked" me on it. I didn't even realize it until he got all loose and stated, "I'm not a boy. I'm a man." For a moment, I was confused as hell. Once he told me what I said, I apologized and began to make a conscious effort to correct it.

I don't think it's a subconscious means to put someone or myself down. I find that lots of folks that grew up in N.O. still refer to men/women as boys/girls just out of habit. Of course, out of respect for elders, we would never use those terms in reference to them. But if we are the same age, expect to be called a boy/girl. Another big one is to call them chicks/dudes.

I only use those words in very informal conversation and if anyone were to ever express discomfort with being referred to as such, I'd make every effort to correct it. It truly isn't intended to offend anyone.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by RedefinedDiva

*standing up*

My name is RD and I am guilty of this.

*covering face*

OK, seriously, I do still refer to men and women, in coversation, as "girl" and "boy." I don't know why. In conversation, as a quick retort, I usually spout "Girl/boy, please!" I don't mean it was a means to belittle any man or woman, but it's just force of habit. I have been making a meaningful attempt to correct it since a guy I was conversing with "checked" me on it. I didn't even realize it until he got all loose and stated, "I'm not a boy. I'm a man." For a moment, I was confused as hell. Once he told me what I said, I apologized and began to make a conscious effort to correct it.

I don't think it's a subconscious means to put someone or myself down. I find that lots of folks that grew up in N.O. still refer to men/women as boys/girls just out of habit. Of course, out of respect for elders, we would never use those terms in reference to them. But if we are the same age, expect to be called a boy/girl. Another big one is to call them chicks/dudes.

I only use those words in very informal conversation and if anyone were to ever express discomfort with being referred to as such, I'd make every effort to correct it. It truly isn't intended to offend anyone.

I generally don't, either, unless it is accompanied by a condescending tone. My N.O. friend still says "boy/girl" a lot, too.

Only black men correct me when I've jokingly said "boy, please."

Random "guy" encounter:
I tend not to respond to people who say "hey guys." When they wonder why I'm ignoring them I say "oh...I'm a woman so I knew you weren't talking to me." That makes some people mad, especially men who think that male is the gendered standard. My friend and I had 2 black men try to holla at us at an event. The men prefaced their pick up lines with "hey, guys, my buddy and I have a question." I immediately said "oh, you're talking to us? well, are you ladies doing alright today?" The guy was like "what are you talking about? Are you calling us ladies?" I said "are you calling us men?" The dude was mad and said that everyone's a guy because male is the standard, but not everyone's a lady because female isn't the standard. I guess I was supposed to be thrilled at that male-centric logic. Instead, I saw that it was hopeless and said "have a great day" and walked away. While my friend (forever the patient diplomat--eventhough we're equally feminist) stayed behind to explain to his slow behind what just happened. Too bad she also had to listen to the rest of their horrendous pick up lines.

This actually fits the topic in a very patterns-of-behavior way.

[LRobinson]

I've been guilty of saying 'you guys' when talking to a group of women. I was called on it and have tried hard to eliminate it from my vocabulary.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by SummerChild

Ok, first of all, you're going to have to slow down and use the appropriate language when speaking to a woman. That kind of language is inappropriate when addressing a woman. I know that Summerchild may seem unisex but it's really not.

Ok, yes, I'm talking about the "girl" and "guy" thing. This has been an ongoing debate since the 60's. Is this the first that you're hearing of it? At any rate, whether it is or it isn't there are studies that show that the way of addressing a human is either indicative of the way that one thinks of the human or maybe it's the other way around. I'm not sure.

It would be like me referring to you or any other man as a "boy." This is analogous to an adult woman being referred to as a "girl."

SC

I just went back and re-read my reply to your original post. I did come off a bit harsh, and for that, I apologize.

I was a little put off because I didn't see the point in interrupting a discussion regarding the series with a lesson in gender equality. I could understand if I had posted that "two gentlemen and one broad" had watched the show -- there's no excuse for that. But to come after me for "guys and girl" seemed nitpicky. In any event, I'll try to be more mindful from now on.

Back to our regularly scheduled programming...

[SummerChild]

I wasn't "coming after you." It's cool. I was just making a random observation. I'm fairly laid back and don't tend to "come after people" on the internet. The real world is much more fun for me to dwell in so I am very selective about where I comment on Greekchat in any case. Don't get upset, KS. It's cool. My smiley faces are real smiley faces, not attempts to be facetious or usually anything else. I actually consider myself to be a pretty funny person so alot of times my smiley faces are me laughing while I'm typing - like the "Summerchild" unisex comment above. I was actually being funny...or at least I thought.

SC

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

I just went back and re-read my reply to your original post. I did come off a bit harsh, and for that, I apologize.

I was a little put off because I didn't see the point in interrupting a discussion regarding the series with a lesson in gender equality. I could understand if I had posted that "two gentlemen and one broad" had watched the show -- there's no excuse for that. But to come after me for "guys and girl" seemed nitpicky. In any event, I'll try to be more mindful from now on.

Back to our regularly scheduled programming...