Too fat to recruit: or, DePauw, the Sequel

[lyrelyre]

Originally Posted by PM_Mama00

This statement from you doesn't surprise me, because when it comes to rush you are pretty shallow.

I don't know that calling it like you see it is shallow.

[cuteASAbug]

Originally Posted by kathykd2005

It might not make them think that, but they won't be looking at all of the skits and well-dressed ladies and thinking, this is where I want to be because they are all so super pretty and obviously have TONS of money. And if they think THIS IS A FAT SORORITY, then they are obviously idiots.

I see this as something that sounds good on paper but doesn't work in actuality. Again- you can tell if girls are good looking without decorations or door songs, and the same goes for the amount of money that a sorority or its members have. You can generally tell that by the clothing and jewelry that someone wears. Wearing Chip & Pepper jeans with a Lacoste polo indicates a higher income than wearing American Eagle jeans with a GAP polo does.

[BetteDavisEyes]

Originally Posted by lyrelyre

I don't know that calling it like you see it is shallow.

To judge a sorority based on the reputation it has, the amount of members in the chapter, and how long it has been around IS shallow.

[kathykd2005]

Originally Posted by cuteASAbug

I see this as something that sounds good on paper but doesn't work in actuality. Again- you can tell if girls are good looking without decorations or door songs, and the same goes for the amount of money that a sorority or its members have. You can generally tell that by the clothing and jewelry that someone wears. Wearing Chip & Pepper jeans with a Lacoste polo indicates a higher income than wearing American Eagle jeans with a GAP polo does.

I agree, but it cuts down on HOW MUCH each chapter is spending on recruitment, not how much each member spends on her personal wardrobe. It also makes it easier for chapters to compete, if they have less money.

[BetteDavisEyes]

Hahahaha!!!

I just remembered something that happened my last year at school during recruitment. The pamphlet that was given to all the PNM's had pictures of all the Rho Gamma's. One of the Rho Gamma's was just a real sweetheart but in the picture, she was wearing a cute shirt that said D&G. Some poor PNM's from her group suicided Delta Gamma because they wanted to so badly be her sister but it turns out she was a Tri Delta. Talk about jumping to conclusions. She was just wearing her Dolce & Gabbana shirt.

ETA: I am happy to report that both girls stayed in DG and were happy with their collegiate experience.

[cuteASAbug]

don't college panhellenics already regulate how much each sorority can spend on recruitment?

[BetteDavisEyes]

Originally Posted by cuteASAbug

don't college panhellenics already regulate how much each sorority can spend on recruitment?

Some GLO's don't mind paying the rush infraction fines if it gives them a leg up on other GLO's.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by cuteASAbug

don't college panhellenics already regulate how much each sorority can spend on recruitment?

They're supposed to. I know we have budget limits (I think $2,500 is ours). We also have limits on how much of that can be spent on certain things.

[kathykd2005]

Originally Posted by cuteASAbug

I see this as something that sounds good on paper but doesn't work in actuality. Again- you can tell if girls are good looking without decorations or door songs, and the same goes for the amount of money that a sorority or its members have. You can generally tell that by the clothing and jewelry that someone wears. Wearing Chip & Pepper jeans with a Lacoste polo indicates a higher income than wearing American Eagle jeans with a GAP polo does.

Clarification:
It DOES cut down on how much chapters spend; it's not meant to monitor how much each sister spends on her own personal wardrobe. It makes it easier for smaller chapters to compete in recruitment, and possibly get their numbers up. Like you said earlier, some ladies make their decisions based primarily on outward appearance, and appearance includes decorations and skits. If those factors are not present, smaller chapters have more of a chance to get more new members.

[kathykd2005]

Originally Posted by KSUViolet06

They're supposed to. I know we have budget limits (I think $2,500 is ours).

Yea, see therein lies the problem. I went to a smaller school, granted, but ours was around $200 per party, as I recall. Nothing extravagent, but a few chapters couldn't afford it, or had to ask for help from alumnae.

[UGAalum94]

I don't think that members in good standing should be asked to stay away from recruitment for any reasons. I don't think any members should be assigned a recruitment duty that she doesn't want for a disproportionate amount the other time, either.

We all have strengths and weaknesses, and we should all help figure out where we think we can best serve our organizations, but also be open to doing something else as long as the way duties are assigned is in keeping with the overall values of the organization.

At my chapter, I don't remember any actives not rushing unless they were in a goofy costume for a skit, so I don't remember any nonsense like this.

BUT some of you posting may have no idea what a big Southern recruitment is like. The way we want things to be and the way things actually are often not the same, and chapters feel pressured to do something wrong in terms of sisterhood to ensure that they get a particular outcome all along the return rate spectrum.

Carnation didn't want that organization to go under, I bet, and you misread her if you think it was her point. She was just aware that recruitment can be a game of superficial impressions, and if you don't play along, your group may not be around much longer to enjoy your authentic sisterhood.

ETA: I saw my friend who wasn't Greek who has a Greek daughter today. She takes all the directions about who can wear what and what's allowed and required at recruitment to be generally a reflection of the values of sororities. It breaks my heart what she thinks we're all about, but I also know that most groups that didn't spend time on image for recruitment are going to have a hard time attracting enough new members to fill a new member class. I wish there were a way to get away from it but not having decorations and skits isn't going to do it.

[fantASTic]

Originally Posted by kathykd2005

Actually, National Panhellenic is moving away from Recruitment "parties," meaning that it will be a lot less shallow, and primarily only based on conversation, as opposed to the glitz of decorations, make up, and skits. In the next few years, they just might be holding recruitment events in "warehouses," so to speak, because they won't be allowed to show off; they will only be able to have conversations with PNMs. Of course, this will be difficult for chapters to transition into, but it could be beneficial in the long run for the Greek System.

I realize. It's called no frills, and that's what we do. It doesn't mean that PNMs don't judge on appearance. No frills does not mean no makeup, either.

[Leslie Anne]

I think it's horrible to hide any sister from Recruitment regardless of their shortcomings. I've always felt, and perhaps I'm wrong, that one of the purposes of being a member of a sorority is to learn to be your personal best. If a sister lacks conversational skills, study skills, personal grooming, then help her to improve. Don't pretend she doesn't exist!

The only time I can truly understand the big push for numbers in a chapter is when they need the income to support the maintenance of the house. Otherwise, I think it's ridiculous. Fraternities manage to stay afloat without large numbers. Why can't sororities?

I can't help but think how far we've come from the original purposes that our founders had in mind. Do any of the 26 NPCs mention appearance in their Purpose or Creed? I don't think so. Our founders' had loftier ideals. I wish we could find some way to make Recruitment less shallow. I'd imagine that our founders would roll over in their graves if they knew that a sister was hidden because she was fat. For shame!

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by Leslie Anne

I think it's horrible to hide any sister from Recruitment regardless of their shortcomings. I've always felt, and perhaps I'm wrong, that one of the purposes of being a member of a sorority is to learn to be your personal best. If a sister lacks conversational skills, study skills, personal grooming, then help her to improve. Don't pretend she doesn't exist!

The only time I can truly understand the big push for numbers in a chapter is when they need the income to support the maintenance of the house. Otherwise, I think it's ridiculous. Fraternities manage to stay afloat without large numbers. Why can't sororities?

I can't help but think how far we've come from the original purposes that our founders had in mind. Do any of the 26 NPCs mention appearance in their Purpose or Creed? I don't think so. Our founders' had loftier ideals. I wish we could find some way to make Recruitment less shallow. I'd imagine that our founders would roll over in their graves if they knew that a sister was hidden because she was fat. For shame!

I hear what you are saying, but many groups have policies that instruct (and pressure) chapters to recruit to quota and chapter total. It's not what the founders had in mind, but it seems to be where we are today.

I too wonder if having women's groups be more like the IFC might not be more empowering to genuine sisterhood, but NPC recruitment IS different and creates different expectations for the chapters. A NPC chapter doesn't usually have the option to play by its own rules and be viable.

[kathykd2005]

Originally Posted by fantASTic

I realize. It's called no frills, and that's what we do. It doesn't mean that PNMs don't judge on appearance. No frills does not mean no makeup, either.

I know it doesn't mean NO make up; if you read what I wrote, I said it would be LESS about those things, not that they won't occur at all...