Obama's comments about Pennsylvania

[UGAalum94]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...topnews&sub=AR


In the complete context his comments seem to be a way of explaining why he's not more popular with a certain demographic. Out of context as they are likely to be repeated, he just seems condescending about a group of people who, as long as we have the Electoral College system rather than simply popular vote, one probably can't win the Presidency without.

What do you think?

[macallan25]

I think he's a self absorbed, cocky ass hole. I mean honestly, unfuckingbelievable. He really can't believe that people don't support him....the "anti Obama-ites" have to be crazy, uber religious, gun nuts? I don't think I've seen such a self absorbed human being in my life. He probably thinks he's Jesus.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by macallan25

I think he's a self absorbed, cocky ass hole. I mean honestly, unfuckingbelievable. He really can't believe that people don't support him....the "anti Obama-ites" have to be crazy, uber religious, gun nuts? I don't think I've seen such a self absorbed human being in my life. He probably thinks he's Jesus.

He never said anything about people who don't support him being crazy religious gun nuts. Semi-fair game if you want to say he called small town people crazy, religious, gun-nuts, but he never implied that this was anyone who didn't support him.

Though you probably did not care to read or hear his clarification he specified that the intention of his comment was that when people are feeling as if the government isn't serving them, they get frustrated (and yes, bitter), and instead of focusing on fixing the problem, they focus on the big "issue" of their choice. This would be an example: "I don't think Candidate A or Candidate B will actually get jobs back, but I think B wants to take away my right to bear arms, so I'm voting for A."

Obama is suggesting that you actually vote for someone, not against someone else. JMO.

Of course, feel free to think he's a self-absorbed semi-Messianic figure, it's quite certainly your right.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

He never said anything about people who don't support him being crazy religious gun nuts. Semi-fair game if you want to say he called small town people crazy, religious, gun-nuts, but he never implied that this was anyone who didn't support him.

Though you probably did not care to read or hear his clarification he specified that the intention of his comment was that when people are feeling as if the government isn't serving them, they get frustrated (and yes, bitter), and instead of focusing on fixing the problem, they focus on the big "issue" of their choice. This would be an example: "I don't think Candidate A or Candidate B will actually get jobs back, but I think B wants to take away my right to bear arms, so I'm voting for A."



Obama is suggesting that you actually vote for someone, not against someone else. JMO.

Of course, feel free to think he's a self-absorbed semi-Messianic figure, it's quite certainly your right.

I think in the original context, rather than his restatements and explanations which you seem to be focusing on, Drolefille, Obama WAS explaining why this demographic wasn't likely to support him. So while I think Macallen is a little over the top on Obama generally, he's right about that part.

ETA: From the linked article: "Obama's comments came at the end of a lengthy answer in which he rejected the notion that voters were passing him over simply for racial reasons, saying instead that his campaign of hope and change was having difficulty in 'places where people feel most cynical about government.'"

And if you want to have people vote for you, shouldn't they be able to see clearly where you stand on some concrete issues, say for instance about trade. I was never really in the Obama camp, but he seems more and more like a typical politician with every passing day.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

I think in the original context, rather than his restatements and explanations which you seem to be focusing on, Drolefille, Obama WAS explaining why this demographic wasn't likely to support him. So while I think Macallen is a little over the top on Obama generally, he's right about that part.

ETA: From the linked article: "Obama's comments came at the end of a lengthy answer in which he rejected the notion that voters were passing him over simply for racial reasons, saying instead that his campaign of hope and change was having difficulty in 'places where people feel most cynical about government.'"

And if you want to have people vote for you, shouldn't they be able to see clearly where you stand on some concrete issues, say for instance about trade. I was never really in the Obama camp, but he seems more and more like a typical politician with every passing day.

Yes, I see what you're saying.
The point still stands that he was saying that currently people are voting for an issue, not for someone they think will change the way things work because they don't think anyone will - hence the use of the term bitter. And ideally he'd like people to vote for someone, for him specifically, but in general as a shift in the political spectrum.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Yes, I see what you're saying.
The point still stands that he was saying that currently people are voting for an issue, not for someone they think will change the way things work because they don't think anyone will - hence the use of the term bitter. And ideally he'd like people to vote for someone, for him specifically, but in general as a shift in the political spectrum.

I think you're being too generous because you're fundamentally more optimistic about Obama.

I think his take was dismissive of the genuine beliefs of the people he was talking about. Most people do vote on issues, and conservatives often vote on issues to intentionally avoid changing the way things work.

It may be more cynical to be conservative, especially when it comes to the ability for government to effect positive change, but it's isn't "clinging" to issues because you're economically bad off, which is what he implied in the original statement.

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...topnews&sub=AR


In the complete context his comments seem to be a way of explaining why he's not more popular with a certain demographic.

That's what it seems like to me. I would expect Clinton to say the same thing (or similar) about why she's not as popular among African Americans without making it strictly a race issue.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

That's what it seems like to me. I would expect Clinton to say the same thing (or similar) about why she's not as popular among African Americans without making it strictly a race issue.

It'd probably still make the group talked about kind of angry. To have your political views reduced to the government didn't do enough for you economically in the past has got to be pretty insulting.

If you don't kind of look at life from the Marxist every-issue-should-be-thought-of-economic-struggle-between-classes- and-if-you-don't-see-it-you're-a-chump-lens, you might think your political beliefs were actually valid positions about issues.

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

It'd probably still make the group talked about kind of angry. To have your political views reduced to the government didn't do enough for you economically in the past has got to be pretty insulting.

If you don't kind of look at life from the Marxist every-issue-should-be-thought-of-economic-struggle-between-classes- and-if-you-don't-see-it-you're-a-chump-lens, you might think your political beliefs were actually valid positions about issues.

I wouldn't be insulted, but that's just me.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

I wouldn't be insulted, but that's just me.

Well, maybe it will just blow over quickly. I think most folks are going to be inclined to think he meant someone else.

Who's going to own up to being a bitter, gun-clingin', religious, xenophobe, who but for better economic policies of previous administrations would have been an Obama supporter?

Those of us who find the rhetoric insulting are all offended on behalf of someone else anyway.

[Thetagirl218]

When I heard the comments, I knew that they were being spinned out of context! Isn't that what the Media does for a living? I wasn't really suprised!

This being said, I don't support Obama, but I do like him better than Hillary, so any jab at him and I cringe!