Line Caps

[Senusret I]

Should a university be able to tell an organization how many members they may accept? In BGLOs, this is known informally as a "line cap."

I know NPC orgs have something similar.... I forget the term.

Has any NIC org heard of this?


I don't agree with a university telling an organization how many members they can take. I think it penalizes the organizations -- why be punished if your org is doing everything right and attracts more qualified people than the rest?

I know NPC members have a different philosophy on this generally, so please understand that essentially I'm not talking to you, LOL. Love you, though! LOL..... but seriously, NPC members can respond if they want.

(PS - I am aware that there is another thread on this topic, but I wanted a greater breadth of contemporary responses from NPHC and non-NPHC members.)

[TheEpitome1920]

I've always wondered what the reasons were for university imposed caps. What are they trying to control?

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by TheEpitome1920

I've always wondered what the reasons were for university imposed caps. What are they trying to control?

Glad to see you back, and congratulations.

I have always wondered what they were trying to control as well. I could understand BETTER if the "quota" (thanks AlphaFrog!) was set to ten or 15, but when you set the line cap at 75 and make it an NPHC-wide rule, it really ever only affects two organizations. And that's no slight to ANY other NPHC organization, but it just seems like if your org has 300-400 interested girls and you can only pick 75, that's just not fair.

And if your org has a legacy stipulation, then you're really screwed.

[ladygreek]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

Glad to see you back, and congratulations.

I have always wondered what they were trying to control as well. I could understand BETTER if the "quota" (thanks AlphaFrog!) was set to ten or 15, but when you set the line cap at 75 and make it an NPHC-wide rule, it really ever only affects two organizations. And that's no slight to ANY other NPHC organization, but it just seems like if your org has 300-400 interested girls and you can only pick 75, that's just not fair.

And if your org has a legacy stipulation, then you're really screwed.

Which is one of the reasons we don't have a legacy stipulation.

The cap thing is interesting. I know Howard use to put a cap of 50 on a line (and maybe they have reinstated that,) but it didn't seem a problem because Alpha Chapter didn't select that many anyway--on their own.

IMO if you are as selective as you should be, then a cap does not matter.

[Still BLUTANG]

i promise i will get back in my lane, but i love this statement:

Originally Posted by ladygreek

IMO if you are as selective as you should be, then a cap does not matter.

[KSUViolet06]

I understand total/quota in NPC because we all recruit together & it helps keep things fair.

I don't understand line caps on NPHCs. If you're at a school with very high demand (like hundreds of applicants), then it doesn't seem fair to me for the university to be able to say that you can only take 50 of them.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

I know NPC orgs have something similar.... I forget the term.

Quota (During Rush # you can take, regardless of your total #)/Total (The number you can COB up to if you're under)

[TheEpitome1920]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

Quota (During Rush # you can take, regardless of your total #)/Total (The number you can COB up to if you're under)

Does the university determine this # or does the local NPC come up with the #?

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by TheEpitome1920

Does the university determine this # or does the local NPC come up with the #?

The local NPC, based on "Green Book" guidelines and campus history.

I don't know if a PUBLIC university can force a cap - due to freedom of association rules, but I think a private university can do whatever it wants in that regard.

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

The local NPC, based on "Green Book" guidelines and campus history.

I don't know if a PUBLIC university can force a cap - due to freedom of association rules, but I think a private university can do whatever it wants in that regard.

Interesting.

As a slight tangent..... I know that Title IX affects just about all universities, public and private, because the great majority have students on some kind of federal financial aid program.

I wonder if freedom of association could be applied to private universities for the same reason/loophole.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

Interesting.

As a slight tangent..... I know that Title IX affects just about all universities, public and private, because the great majority have students on some kind of federal financial aid program.

I wonder if freedom of association could be applied to private universities for the same reason/loophole.

A private u doesn't have to recognize GLOs (or any organization). However, if they deny their students the right to belong to an organization that meets off campus, that's where they get into Freedom of Association trouble.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

As a slight tangent..... I know that Title IX affects just about all universities, public and private, because the great majority have students on some kind of federal financial aid program.

I wonder if freedom of association could be applied to private universities for the same reason/loophole.

Short answer -- no.

[jadis96]

To begin with, I am NOT a lawyer (nor would I want too be, too complicated) but I have taken a few educational law classes dealing with campus and school issues.

Originally Posted by Senusret I

Interesting.

As a slight tangent..... I know that Title IX affects just about all universities, public and private, because the great majority have students on some kind of federal financial aid program.

I wonder if freedom of association could be applied to private universities for the same reason/loophole.

Based on my ed law class you're right Senusret. If a school (public or private) takes federal money, they gotta follow federal law. The only difference is privates do not HAVE to take federal money, but if they choose to then they have to follow federal law.

Originally Posted by 33girl

A private u doesn't have to recognize GLOs (or any organization). However, if they deny their students the right to belong to an organization that meets off campus, that's where they get into Freedom of Association trouble.

Part of the issue of freedom of association also deals with if you are secluding a segment of the population. For example, if there are 10 NPC's on a campus and the school does not allow a 11th NPC to get oncampus it's okay, because that segment is being covered legally. The issue would be if the uni has 10 NPC's on campus but does not allow a NPHC sorority. That is a segment of society you are not covering, yet you are not allowing them on campus.

I also believe that freedom of association is mainly used in cases dealing with religious groups. Having a campus crusade, but not allowing a jewish student union for example.

[TheEpitome1920]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

I don't know if a PUBLIC university can force a cap - due to freedom of association rules, but I think a private university can do whatever it wants in that regard.

Well aren't our organizations allowed on campus at the leisure of the univ./college?

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by TheEpitome1920

Well aren't our organizations allowed on campus at the leisure of the univ./college?

I'm sure I've read that at a public uni. they can't deny your right to be there, but they can make it as difficult as possible to get recognition, etc...