Has someone of the opposite sex ever tried to pledge to your chapter?

[akamie]

I'm wondering if any of you have ever encountered someone of the opposite sex trying to pledge to your sorority or fraternity. Why did they do it? What happened in the end?

We're doing some research at UAA about the role of alternative lifestyles in Greek Life regarding gender, but as far as we know we've never had a man try to join a sorority, or a woman try to join a fraternity. So there aren't any rules about it either.

-Amie
SigmaLove

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by akamie

I'm wondering if any of you have ever encountered someone of the opposite sex trying to pledge to your sorority or fraternity. Why did they do it? What happened in the end?

We're doing some research at UAA about the role of alternative lifestyles in Greek Life regarding gender, but as far as we know we've never had a man try to join a sorority, or a woman try to join a fraternity. So there aren't any rules about it either.

-Amie
SigmaLove

There aren't rules about it where? I'm positive that most organizations clearly state which gender(s) they are open to.

[akamie]

What I mean by there aren't rules is that at least of the 4 fraternities and sororities we have on campus, there isn't anything codified that defines gender as a standard for membership. For example, in our chapter's bylaws it says we can't deny membership to "anyone" on the basis of sexual orientation, and while all the language uses "her" in other rules, we're trying to consider what happens legally when a male, who identifies as a female, tries to pledge.

[Senusret I]

I don't consider sexual orientation to be the same as gender identity. You are discussing the latter. Every social organization's bylaws (I am quite sure) will identify which gender they are open to.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by akamie

What I mean by there aren't rules is that at least of the 4 fraternities and sororities we have on campus, there isn't anything codified that defines gender as a standard for membership. For example, in our chapter's bylaws it says we can't deny membership to "anyone" on the basis of sexual orientation, and while all the language uses "her" in other rules, we're trying to consider what happens legally when a male, who identifies as a female, tries to pledge.

There should be a clause in your constitution or bylaws that states that "membership is open to [insert gender]s enrolled in x hours and [any other requirements]"

If a biological male identifies as a female, she is a female (and vice versa). I remember a thread about this. Do a search.

[akamie]

You're right senusret, they aren't the same. My point is that there's very little regarding what constitutes gender identity- I just used the languaged regarding Tri Sigma's stance on orientation to demonstrate that lack of clarity in the word "anyone".

National Panhellenic has this, but it didn't come around until 1995. Wonder why?
1995

Freedom of Association
The women's fraternities of NPC have the right to confine their membership to women, and their right to exist as single-sex organizations shall not be abrogated by any government agency or action. (In accordance with the provisions of Title IX of the Education Amendments of 1972). Member groups will support the efforts of the United States House of Representatives to protect the rights of students to associate voluntarily in single-sex organizations.

[Psi U MC Vito]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

I don't consider sexual orientation to be the same as gender identity. You are discussing the latter. Every social organization's bylaws (I am quite sure) will identify which gender they are open to.

Actually no. I know Psi U places no limits on membership on the national membership.

[VandalSquirrel]

I think at the point most people have the money and time, and have completely gone through everything (physically in regards to surgery and hormones, and legally regarding name changes), they'd be a bit old for most traditional systems where the students are 18-22. I know of only one, a 16 year old German named Kim Petras, but that's Germany where the whole health care system is different, and in the US there are many issues surrounding the health insurance, employment, housing, and other economic factors of those who are transgendered. I'd guess that many young people in the USA and Canada who are transgendered are not going to have the resources for surgery at a young age, and many have bigger concerns than joining GLOs.

Second to all that I am sure it comes down to membership selection which is private and there may be groups who have a clause about being "a natural born" man or woman and don't advertise that statement. There are all kinds of reasons people aren't chosen for membership that have nothing to do with being transgendered and most of that is never discussed outside of the membership so I doubt gender identity would. I know the state I live in does not legally change birth certificates so

[VandalSquirrel]

Originally Posted by akamie

I'm wondering if any of you have ever encountered someone of the opposite sex trying to pledge to your sorority or fraternity. Why did they do it? What happened in the end?

We're doing some research at UAA about the role of alternative lifestyles in Greek Life regarding gender, but as far as we know we've never had a man try to join a sorority, or a woman try to join a fraternity. So there aren't any rules about it either.

-Amie
SigmaLove

I'm double posting, but "alternative lifestyles" just rubs me the wrong way. That could mean so many things, like nudists, child free people, vegetarians, people who don't have cars, and so on. I can think of people in Fairbanks living in dry cabins as having an "alternative lifestyle" before I'd think of anyone Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, Transgendered, or Queer identifying. If you're talking about gender identity, sexuality, or anything like that, just say what it is you mean.

Oh, and is your research through a particular department or just for a class?

[dreamseeker]

Originally Posted by Psi U MC Vito

Actually no. I know Psi U places no limits on membership on the national membership.

so can a woman join your organization?

[preciousjeni]

Weren't little sister/little brother organizations disbanded, in large part, because they threatened Title IX exemption? If you allow a person of the opposite sex into a single-sex organization, you will lose the exemption altogether.

If you want to intitiate both men and women, it stands to reason that you should voluntarily become a co-ed organization. The only catch is that it's a lot harder to be selective as a co-ed org.

Most co-ed orgs I'm aware of have open membership where anyone can join as long as they meet minimum standards and present no major red flags; whereas in a Title IX exempt org, you have more freedom to pick and choose who joins.

And, there is definitely more than one thread about this issue on Greekchat.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by dreamseeker

so can a woman join your organization?

It appears as though the NIC solely admits male-only organizations. Since Psi Upsilon is a member, it seems logical (at least to me) that Psi Upsilon is restricted to male membership only.

Of course, I'm neither a member of an NIC fraternity nor Psi Upsilon, so I can't comment with any authority.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by dreamseeker

so can a woman join your organization?

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

It appears as though the NIC solely admits male-only organizations. Since Psi Upsilon is a member, it seems logical (at least to me) that Psi Upsilon is restricted to male membership only.

Of course, I'm neither a member of an NIC fraternity nor Psi Upsilon, so I can't comment with any authority.

Answering for Vito, but Psi U is a member of the NIC and is co-ed. Delta Psi (aka, St. Anthony Hall), another NIC member, is also co-ed. Both Psi U and Delta Psi are historically all-male, but allowed chapters to go co-ed starting in the late 60s and 70s.

[Psi U MC Vito]

Yeah MC hit it one the nail. Also to clarify, on the national level Psi U is coed. While we never had language in the constitution specifying that somebody had to be a male to be a member, it was kind of understood that you had to be. Then one chapter was forced to admit female brothers by the school and successfully argued that they did nothing against the constitution at our convention. Now it is up to the chapters to choose whether or not to be coed, though most are all male.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by akamie

For example, in our chapter's bylaws it says we can't deny membership to "anyone" on the basis of sexual orientation, and while all the language uses "her" in other rules, we're trying to consider what happens legally when a male, who identifies as a female, tries to pledge.

What about your national governing documents?