Definitions Required
 

In the document openly published on the Beta web site, the following requirements are part of those needed to obtain a charter:

I am intrigued by the bold, italicized and underlined words above (I added the B, I and U). No where on the Beta site can I find these words defined.

Yet I can find them defined on several University web sites to include all tobacco products and at some smaller, religious based schools, even includes caffine.

What is the "will be blessed by the US Supreme Court, can not be legally challenged" Beta definition of these words?

Based on the substance abuse education program at my son's middle school, all household cleaning products and aerosoles that are "huffed" would fall into the catagory requiring a Beta chapter to keep them out of the living environment.

If the chapter did not have a house and the members were living in a dorm and the school used cleaning products that fell into this category, the chapter would be in violation.

Also, if the members lived in a dorm and a there was booze or drugs any where in the building (even if not in the Beta's room), this could be viewed as a violation.

Just something to consider.

Again, just more draconian rules. Unless something changes, Beta will just be a gay honor fraternity.

Ok, that was really not necessary coramoor.

Oldest-Pledge, that is interesting, and it up for interpretation, as you proved. I think though that they were talking about the chapter house, not the dorm of individual betas who live outside the house.

Substance-free means no alcohol or illegal drugs. Yes, things like caffeine can be misinterpreted under this, but that assumption is a little drastic. The chapter house is suppose to be a meeting place for the fraternity to gather, a place where rituals take place, a place were business is taken care of. Drugs or alcohol shouldn't take place there anyways, ESPECIALLY if the chapter does their ritual in the chapter house.

News to me- and thanks for posting this. "Where applicable" is what I am interested in figuring out.

But in Beta terms, a substance-free house means no illegal drug use (meaning no illegal use of legal drugs and no use of illegal drugs), no alcohol use and no tobacco.

by tobacco, i assume you mean in doors.

I think the "where applicable" is in regards to those who do not own a chapter house, or those who own one but do not live in their chapter house.

Indoors or out- the concept, at least as it has been put in practice at some chapters, applies once you cross the property line.

You may be right on the "where applicable" part. I was thinking along those lines plus also in situations where alumni built/bought a house and wanted to make it substance-free.

The document is posted on the Colony Education page at the bottom. It is a Word Document titled "Chatering Requirements." See "Home - Go Beta - Expansions - Colony Education."

As far as my extension of the interpretations, it only takes on incident, one lawyer and one judge. And actually, it was my law class that brought up the "huffing" cleaning supplies.

And the "where applicable" protion of the statement can be read to mean where ever a Beta lives. So even if you are 21 you could not be found with booze in your living quarters (even if it is the non-Beta roommates).

Things that make you think about how crazy the world it getting. I would not been upset if I was told by the AO that my house (if we had a house) had to be drug free and tobacco free when I was an undergrad. And I could accept the no booze rule as well. But if members were truely Betas, the under 21 one crowd would not have problem with those that are of legal age having a drink in the house and the underage members would leave the stuff alone.

That is what Beta Theta Pi needs to be teaching....

This blows my mind!

If I rushed a house and the brothers told me that they don't allow tobacco or alcohol...and used that as a selling point I would have laughed in their face and left them at the front door!

Alcohol and tobacco is not illegal. I don't smoke, but as long as people clean up their butts or spit cups there isn't a problem. I might swear off alcohol when I wake up dehydrated and with a throbbing headache...Rather than ban alcohol, fraternities should promote responsible consumption of alcoholic beverages. If you go into just about any industry you will be expected to attend social events-which will have booze. If you make an ass of your self there...well, there goes your career.

Hell, I'd bet anything that during the meetings in which Knox and Marshall set down the founding principles they were drinking some cognac and smoking a cigar!

this is exactly what i have been arguing fro my chapter. i dont alcohol or drugs are bad, and i dont think beta is in the position to tell us what we can and cannot do. they really should be promoting responsible drinking, not treating us like little kids. i dont understand how we will learn "responsible social conduct" in beta if they try to hold our hand for 4 years.

and yeah, it definitely hurts us in recruiting. and what oldest pledge is referring to about chartering requirements...this has caused a lot of distrust and corruption within the brotherhood. certain people dont trust other brothers because theyre afraid they will drink in the house and fuck it up for everyone. so in turn, everyone is hiding stuff from one another.

I believe most laws, and the courts they are argued in, are based on what a reasonable person would think or do in a situation. Given this premise, I would think that you all have taken that little piece of rule to its furthest extreme.

Where applicable means exactly that. It signifies that this rule does not apply to 100% of situations in Beta's broad domain.

Ok, well I am a fan for drinking and smoking if one wants to, and if its responsible.

HOWEVER, Your chapter house is not the place for it. The chapter house is where you meet in brotherhood, do rituals, and live under the letters we value. I think it makes perfect sense for this to be in our code. Our chapter houses represent who we are. They are an image of who we are to the outside world. They see our letters above our door, I don't want them to see those letters and then see a bunch of people drinking. Why? Well, not because there is anything wrong with drinking. If responsible, drinking is totally ok in my book. I don't want them to see it under those letters, because I don't want them to think thats who we are. There is this 'frat' stereotype that goes back to 70's and 80's and with movies like Animal House where fraternity members are drunken bums who eventually get kicked out of college. That isn't who we are, and quite frankly, I don't think everyone will connect this, but really, I don't want anyone to.

When they look at the chapter house with the letters above our door they should see a place of brotherhood, FUN, and integrity. I don't think they should have any room to think that there is a bunch of drunken fools, cause then only drunken fools would want to join. I dont think we should act like we dont drink, hell, we should totally be straight forward when they ask, and I dont mind them seeing us drink outside the chapter house. The chapter house is not the place for it, thats like drinking in church (besides the little cup of wine for communion).

^ well said.

How does drinking or smoking take away from brotherhood or rituals? How does it take away from the value of our letters?

Beta is a fraternity...it's not a religion.

Drinking is FUN and does nothing to take away from brotherhood nor does it mean you have no integrity. Hell, how does smoking and drinking even have an impact on one's integrity? That makes no sense.

Dude, it makes perfect sense, its just not what you want to hear...

Ok, first off, drinking CAN take away from the brotherhood and the integrity of our fraternity if mishandled.

Secondly, I was talking about perception. When people see a bunch of guys drinking in their chapter house, then its going to be categorized as a stupid frat. People are going to join, cause they think they are joining the stupid party frat, etc. Well, we are not the stupid party frat, well I hope we are not, and we def. do not want the guys attracted to the stupid party frat image.

The image they should see around our house is a bunch of well respected men with principles but also have a strong sense of friendship and fun. That is the image we want to show forth, so that those are the guys we get in the future.

you can be principled, have fun, and maintain great relations even if you drink and smoke. i would say some of the best times ive ever had were while drinking, and if id want to share those times with anyone, id want it to be with my brothers. and living by principles means not getting shitfaced 7 nights a week and making a fool out of yourself in front of a sorority and have the cops arrest you. if we are principled, dont you think we can manage to keep ourselves under control and not exceed our limits? thats what i dont understand, we are principled men, but half the reason is because we are forced to follow these rules. i think it would make a greater statement to everyone else if we had the capability of drinking, but just didnt take it overboard like some of the other frats.

I agree with you TOTALLY... unfortunately, we are trying to kill an age old reputation that fraternity men are stupid hazing drunks, and therefor, we need to take it upon ourselves to ruin that reputation by going above and beyond that reputation. Drinking under the house letters just does not help that reputation... its not about what we are, but how the outside perceives us. We are an organization that relies on recruiting quality future members like every fraternity, and we need to go above and beyond the call of duty to make sure that happens. If that means making a few sacrifices like not drinking in our chapter house, well, damn it, I think its worth it.

"Where applicable" is key to this discussion. If you joined a chapter that is substance free (either by choice or by re-org rules), then you should not blame anyone other than yourself.

It's kinda like buying an SUV. You love it, it looks great, rides great, has a sweet stereo system and rims, and then that person complains about bad gas mileage. Well, that just comes with the territory.

These are things you guys can change. Go to convention, lobby the other Chapter presidents - start this venture 6 months before Convention so you can make some headway. Make change. That's what's great about Beta, we govern ourselves (as much as you guys think we don't). Rules in place today are there for a reason, not for fun.

I'll never forget when I was chapter counselor and I was woke up at 2:00 AM by my chapters Risk Manager during their Beta Week, he stated that a pledge got 'cleaner in his eyes' and needed to seek help. I immediately went over to the house and found a big Gatorade cooler filled with Captain and Coke and a bunch of drunk idiot 19 year old kids.

Don't tell me alcohol in chapter houses 'is a good thing'.

If you guys hate Beta so much, why continue with it?

Oh yeah, I want to add this as well. Drinking under the age of 21 is illegal, that is US law, not Beta's law. We must follow US laws before Beta's rules. I personally have ZERO issue with alcohol being consumed in a responsible manner (LEGALLY) within a chapter house. HOWEVER, if a chapter is dry (either by choice or re-org/sanctions), then it shouldn't and CAN'T be in the house. A rule is a rule, is a rule, is a rule. If you can't follow it, then move on....if you chose to join even with these stipulations, then that's your own fault and you shouldn't be bitching about it.

And Oldest_Pledge, why so bitter towards Beta as of late?

yeah, what he said

Interestingly enough the tobacco issue was a big deal this past semester in my chapter. The issue came up, several hours were spent discussing it in chapter, with what I'm told was pretty acrimonious conversations, and then failed to pass.

In the end though, our current RM is also the IFC RM and so he just went and talked to the Vice Chancellor for Student Affairs and got language put into the agreement for University Approved Housing that all the chapters have to sign and comply with.

From a risk stand point, I guess it could be argued that it's a good idea (though candles and the like also need to be more closely monitored)...and the dorms on campus are smoke free now too, so it's really not that big of deal.

Alcohol is not going to bring any thing to the surface that is not already there. If a chapter acts like a bunch of drunken assholes, even when sober they will be assholes. The only thing this rule is doing is pushing many potential good guys away because they do not want to rush a house that is dry or pushes the no-alcohol clause so harshly.

When you see people drink in their homes or at a family gathering...do you automatically assume them to be drunken rednecks? Why would you make the same assumption about seeing a guy drink on the front porch of his frat house?

Along those lines, if someone is going to judge me purely for that reason and not join my frat...well, chances are I wouldn't have offered them a bid even if they did come and rush. Guys like that are not the men I want in my chapter. We had brothers that did not drink or smoke and there was no problem with that.

The SUV example was awful. Not the same thing at all. I didn't join when it was dry and I think that it is a terrible idea to place so much pressure on this single issue. I know that the GF has to protect itself, yet making it's members give up lawful privileges of age is wrong.

Can you give me a real-life example of a Beta chapter undeservingly getting 'substance-free' living put on them?

How about every chapter that has been re-colonized in the last few years.

They may have been shut down for various reasons; hazing, low numbers, finances, alcohol/drugs. The re-colonized chapter is all new brothers that were not guilty of making the mistakes that shut down their chapters in the past.

So you can't give any real-life examples and all you can do is complain about the way things are?

Good chapters aren't shut down for no reason. 'Bad' (or shall I say troubled?) chapters are given chance after chance and they basically shut themselves down. IE, look at Lambda...I'd rather see chapters shut down, then have someone die and their lawyers take our GF to court and put all of us out of business due to lawsuits.

Re-colonized chapter (or colonies) come on campus, recruit and publicly tell people what they're about, how their house will be, how they're motivated to succeed and not the typical 'animal house'. When members choose to join that said chapter KNOWINGLY when it's substance free, and then complain about it (see some general chit chat within the Beta forum) then they're fucking idiots. Those are the guys who should have kept walking to the next frat house....

Again, the guys who don't like it and hate Beta so much, should just quit. Nobody's going to listen to them anyway.

Dude, I very much doubt that anyone here hates Beta. If that was the case, why would we care what is going on at the national level. I strongly disagree with some of the policies and actions it has taken over the last several years, and see a need for a change, but that hardly means I hate it and want to quit being a Beta.

New brothers do join under the idea of a dry house.

Beta does a great sell when going to a new campus. That much is obvious. What I do not know is how much they stress certain aspects of being a fraternity once a chapter is established.

I see that from some of the posts of the guys here that are part of a new chapter and how many problems they are having with brotherhood, sorority relations, recruitment, and the social aspects of being in a fraternity. All that without having alcohol present...so maybe these problems are not caused by alcohol but by the men Beta is recruiting.

You asked for an example and I gave one. A chapter that just started is under that policy-yet they were not the ones that did whatever it was that shut the chapter down.

Getting back to the point, once again I see no convincing arguments that alcohol takes away from brotherhood or ones integrity. All I see is deflections pointing towards 'it's the rule' or 'we don't want to be animal house'.

Hell, if a chapter is newly re-charted and has shown that it is in good standing and decides that they want to allow alcohol...why not let them? They are of age and legal adults. It makes no sense to me that being a Beta and being active enough to live in the house should take away from my freedoms.

Is it a policy today that new chapters and re-orgs are substance free? My thoughts are they are not, only substance free housing is one of two reasons. A. The chapter voted this in themselves or B. It was a requirement of the GF and/or the HC Board of said chapter for re-colonizing (IE, Nebraska).

Challenge the policy, not the people upholding them. These things can be changed during conventions.

Change the policy not the people....that makes no sense.

Would you continue to vote for the President of the US even if you didn't like his policies? Maybe if he was voted in again he would change...

Well, the people upholding the policy (the AO) are not the people who make or change the policy... so, he makes perfect sense.


If you were trying to fit your example into what he was saying... its more like... You wouldn't change the judicial system cause you dont like the policy... you WOULD change the president and senators etc ... thats what he means if we were adapting it to your example

I finally had some free time to go through and read the entire document, and I agree with your assessment. The "checklist"- as I would describe it- is fairly clear and it seems to me that this line may be worded to encourage substance free housing, but it certainly does not indicate it is required.

It has never been a requirement of Men of Principle in any form that a chapter have a substance free house- and in my experience that is the number one misunderstanding out there in the brotherhood, for whatever reason.

I personally do not like the idea of required substance-free houses. Too much babysitting at a time when young men should be making their own decisions and living with the consequences.

If a chapter is so bad off that they need to be policed to this extent, there is a serious problem that no rule such as this (which is not easily enforced if a chapter does not want it in place) is going to address.

And some of the most grave RM violations and willful damage of property we have seen in recent years happened in substance-free houses.

That said, there are legimitate arguments that form the basis for substance-free houses which I think could take a better aligned form.

For example, it is not a bad idea to prohibit organized parties in chapter houses. These are the times when strangers come in and do bad things, when houses get torn up, when furniture gets damaged and when guys like me who actually studied at night were kept up to 4 in the morning (though it did not bother me- I tuned it out- it certainly did not make for a very scholastically supportive environment.)

With a policy like this, you do not police and babysit the actives- avoid a significant number, if not the majority, of risk management nightmares.

Better still, you cut way down on damage to the house. In the past 30 years, my chapter's previous house had 2 major renovations to the tune of several hundred thousand dollars.

Considering the costs of even acquiring a new house today on many campuses, alumni are even less interested in (or likely to) write checks to do 6-figure renovations to torn up houses every 10-15 years. And with rising property taxes and costs of occupancy, rent and chapter dues are less able to offer a share towards a long-term fund to do those renovations every decade or so.


A few months ago, I printed out a map of West Campus here at the University of Texas and made a few copies.

On one copy, I marked where all the major fraternity and sorority houses are today.

And on other copies I marked where those same houses were 10, 20 and 30 years ago.

Plus I reflected on events in my time at college and talked with alumni about major events in their time.

If you compare the maps, over time the sororities have remained in place- many of them in prime locations within a block or two of campus.

The fraternities on the other hand, have gradually moved further away- plus the number of houses has been reduced. And in MOST cases, I was able to trace a chapter house movement to the chapter having been shut down due to a serious risk management incident.

And today with all the redevelopment and West Campus going condo- there are not many more places for a fraternity to move anymore. This story is very powerful at UT, but it plays out in some form at many other colleges too as cities become more dense and university enrollment rises.

I am not going to be a hypocrite and babysitter and say all chapters need to be substance-free. I do not see that as the answer.

But we have to do something in a way that makes today better than yesterday and also prepares us for a present and future environment that is different from the past.

Stereotypes about the old days are just that- stereotypes. Texas is full of decades of men who were Greek at UT and are major leaders, businessmen and property owners who have achieved enormous success.

If you want to say the past was all bad, then you are disparaging a pretty illustrious list of our alumni at any school- and prepare to suffer the same fate when a new generation decides you did it wrong.

The answer is, I think, to preserve self-governance and choice- but also provide certain basic rules (like no organized parties in chapter houses) which will make sense to the actives and which they can endorse without feeling like they are giving up their right to learn from experience as did those who came before them.

And again- if a chapter and/or Housing Corp want to go substance-free, more power to them. I cannot think of a single reason why that is a bad idea if the men whose work and effort will sustain the chapter want to do it.

^ great post.

Point of information - Nebraska never re-colonized. We were reorganized, but the chapter has remained open since it's founding on September 13th 1888. We were reorganized as alcohol and drug free living, though the actual enforcement of the alcohol rules didn't become serious until the fall of 1999, and even then, there were multiple violations on through to the fall of 2000, with a few tapering off into the spring of 2001. By the time I was a freshman in the fall of 2001, the rules had been set that it was rare for violations. That said, I'd guess that close to 90% of the chapter (of those who drink) since i pledged has drank in the house on at least one occasion.

just curious, what is the penalty if you are caught drinking? and how strictly have they tried to enforce the dry house rule on you?