Being the "other woman" (or man)
 

You like someone. You're pretty sure they're attracted to you . . . but they already have a girlfriend/boyfriend.

Where do you draw the line of appropriate behavior? Is it fine to flirt with the person you like, as long as it doesn't go beyond that? Is it totally in bounds to pursue them because you have no obligation to the other person? You're not going to initiate things, but you wouldn't throw them out of your bed if they were to make the first move?

Not really looking for "right" or "wrong" answers, as long as you can justify it -- I'm just interested in the difference of opinion.

Screw it. Steal the man

You don't know the other girl. She'll get over this guy anyways.

Also, if you are successful in stealing this guy don't get all pissed if he leaves you for another girl he starts to fancy while you are with him.

Flirt with them all you want, but know that they might just be doing it so they can get turned on to go home to the other girl and give her some hot monkey loving.

Yeppir, it took me THIS LONG to figure that one out.

LOL!!!

I've been that girl before. Flirting with a guy who had a girlfriend. At the time, I didn't really care if he was willing to cheat on her with me. I figured it was his problem and that I wasn't doing anything wrong. In the end I was glad I didn't do it. Karma is a bitch. :)

Re: Being the "other woman" (or man)
 

Fuck it dude, you're worrying about the wrong thing - you don't really owe these specific people anything, and there are no karmic consequences for not doing anything wrong. Rock it hard.

Re: Re: Being the "other woman" (or man)
 

Too long Rob. Too long.

-Rudey

If he's dating someone, then that makes him off limits in my book. I don't want anyone flirting with my guy, and I'm not going to flirt with someone else's.

Are you out to have a fling? Ok, go for it. If s/he's going to leave the other wo/man for you, the other wo/man didn't need them anyway (would you want someone who would leave you for a fling?).

Are you looking for Mr/s. Right? Forget it...if they'll leave their current for you, they'll leave you for someone else.

I agree with dzrose......
no need to type the rest

Re: Re: Re: Being the "other woman" (or man)
 

You're right - I edited.

People say this all the time but it's not necessarily true. Someone will leave you if he's not happy for one reason or another for someone who seems like a better option. If you consistently rock someone's world, he's not likely to go anywhere even if presented with the opportunity.

As to the original question, I'm kind of torn on it. On the one hand, you should do what you want and you owe no duty to the other person's girlfriend/boyfriend/spouse/whatever. On the other hand, it's not exactly a nice thing to do. It's really a balancing equation, and each person should decide for herself in any given situation (that's really a non-answer, but whatever).

Did you know the guy before he had the girlfriend? If that's the case then it's sounds like he's testing the waters and wants to dump her. Wait awhile after their inevitable breakup to see if the feeling is mutual between the both of you. Do not make a move until she's completely off of his radar.

But if he already had the girlfriend and then met you, he's not worth it. The time you are spending with this guy could be better spent meeting a better guy without the extra baggage.

Just say this really fast.

I ain't ever had nobody show me all the things
That you done showed me
In a special way I feel when you hold me
We gon' always be together baby
That is what you told and
I believe it cuz I ain't never had
Nobody do me
LIKE YOU


And shake your titties while doin the roger rabbit.

I agree.

And I would hesitate to go after some other girl's guy just because I'd be afraid it would make me look desperate and sad. If he wants me, let him break up with her and then come to me. :p

Re: Being the "other woman" (or man)
 

Bad Karma. What goes around comes around. Do unto others (the girlfriend) as you would have them do unto you.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Whichever one you want to use.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

Case in point: the Tim situation. And I got Coach, Prada, Chanel sunglasses, Tiffany's, and a bunch of DVDs because I decided to steal the man. If I can do it, so can you.

DO IT NOW!

Since you're just trying to get married and settle down and have kids anyway, I think you should look elsewhere.

Can I emphasize that this is a hypothetical situation and that I hope all of you who are using "you" mean it in the editorial "you" sense? :-)

Anyway, I'm mostly of the school that thinks that flirting is fine (because I flirt with everyone for my own amusement), but probably would not going beyond that. I honestly do think that what goes around comes around, the Golden Rule, blah blah blah. I feel like I DO have an obligation to that other girl not to be an asshole. That said, I'm not always sure where "flirting" ends and "crossing the line" begins and sometimes that gets me into trouble. Haha.

I think valkyrie's point is interesting too. Nine times out of ten (okay, maybe just eight), I think you're wrong, T -- I think that how a guy treats one woman he's with tends to indicate a trend in how he treats most women that he's with. But I certainly don't think that's an unbreakable rule -- you have guys that mature, or learn from their mistakes, or you have guys that just aren't happy with the person they're with but would be with you, whatever. You should tread carefully with these people, but I don't think that they're entirely off-limits.

Everyone's ultimate goal (really at the core of it) is to find somebody to love and love them....even if that somebody was somebody else's somebody first...

so in the end, if you end up with them.....they cheat WITH you, they will cheat ON you.

Don't do it.

OK - I shouldn't let you ladies in on this, but I will. There are two types of 'cheating' for dudes -

1 - Habitual - the dude just cheats on every girl . . . this is the "because I can" cheating

2 - Situational - the dude is locked into something he's not ok with, and cheats as an outlet . . . possibly to break the relationship, possibly for other reasons . . . this is "because I can't" cheating (no further explanation there)

Also, who is assuming this is 'cheating'? Why can't you just 'steal' the dude in the sense of breaking him up w/ his sig other?

I don't know a single guy who goes "I'm gonna do this once and see what happens" or "I'm gonna do this once so I can end things will Sally Mae".

-Rudey

I see nothing wrong with flirting, either. There is a fine line with flirting and being improperly affectionate with someone, but I think most people are aware of when they cross it.

It depends on a lot of things -- how well you know the guy/girl and/or his/her s.o.; if you know what his/her happiness level is in the relationship; what their hotness level is (before and after a few drinks); how you're personally going to feel the next day were something to happen; where your personal motivation comes from; are either of you looking for more than a fun night. Each situation is going to be different.

As far as cheating goes, I don't believe in the "once a cheater, always a cheater" either. I think the Robmeister has it right -- there's habutial cheating (I cheat because I can--it doesn't matter who I'm with) and situational cheating (I cheat because this relationship sucks but I don't have the balls to end it myself, so I'll take the passive aggressive way out). Husband cheated on his long-time college girlfriend because she was a whiny, needy megabitch but at the time he thought that was the best he could do. That relationship finally ended because she eventually cheated on him and he finally got sick of her isht, but he knows if he were to ever do anything like that to me, we would be done. But he won't because I'm not a whiny bitch.

You're telling me you don't know anyone who's only cheated on one girlfriend?

No. But I know plenty of guys that have convinced the girls they were with that the previous girl was awful and that it would never happen again because their current girl is so great - that it is a one time thing.

The best is when the guy gets puntang/putti tang just to be reminded of how much he loves his girlfriend. The guilt afterwards is comparable to being a cutter - and he enjoys the relationship more.

-Rudey

Good point . . .

This might be my favorite thing in the world - it's related to my 'category 2' too, but I'm lazy so i'll leave it as a bizarre generalization like it is now.

The 'cutters' analogy is about right

In the case of situation #2, though, they have to go through some sort of "growing up" between the first relationship and the second. Habitual cheating involves the person "cheating because they can" (it's a trait that they have, etc.). In the second case, of situational cheating, the trait that the person has is not having balls. If you don't give them time to grow those balls, their cheating will be just as habitual as your example #1 -- because every relationship goes through its low points, the person's way of dealing with the bad times is still important. It's not as easy as "She's a bitch and you're not, so I won't cheat on you."

That's why people who say "If s/he will cheat with you, they'll cheat on you" are generally right. If you go straight from relationship #1 to relationship #2 with no time to reflect on what you did and make a change, your behavior will likely be the same in both relationships. What stops people from cheating in the later relationship is growing up and growing some balls, and that doesn't happen overnight.

EVERYBODY'S Workin 4 DA weekEND!

I can see what you're saying, but the s.o. does play a significant part. I mean, if you keep dating needy, whiny bitches then I can see where you're going to become a habitual cheater. But if you start dating someone with a different personality, you may not have those same type of low points because it's a different relationship. It may or may not be that you grew a pair, it's just that with a different person, things may be handled differently. Which leads to your second point:

Quote:

That's why people who say "If s/he will cheat with you, they'll cheat on you" are generally right. If you go straight from relationship #1 to relationship #2 with no time to reflect on what you did and make a change, your behavior will likely be the same in both relationships. What stops people from cheating in the later relationship is growing up and growing some balls, and that doesn't happen overnight.

But not everyone goes straight from one relationship to the next. Granted, I'm probably not the best person to be doling out relationship advice because out of the 4 boyfriends I dated, only one of them made it past three months and he's now my husband. I had a lot of fun and made out with a lot of boys during college (and I'm sure there was a time or two I was the other woman), but I didn't pursue a relationship unless I felt it was worth it, and usually it wasn't. (Saved a lot of stupid boy drama that way--I had enough from my roommate). Likewise, the husband had about a year or so to get over his ex, have fun, realize how shitty the relationship actually was and learn how to not do that with his subsequent gf, me. It helped that I'm the complete opposite of his ex. It doesn't mean we didn't/don't have issues from time to time, but we deal with them differently.

That's just me going from my own personal experience, which is probably not the norm, so...

LOL I don't think I've had a boyfriend who wasn't with someone when we met. I really, honestly don't think it makes a damn bit of difference, but hey, that's just me. I suppose technically the old man and I are both cheaters, so who knows what in the hell will happen. I don't think the fact that neither of us spent much/any time alone after our previous relationships before getting together means that we didn't learn anything. You can learn in any situation, whether you're dating or single.

When it comes down to it, there is no way to know whether the person you're with or will be with someday will cheat on you. I really don't see the point of worrying about it -- if it happens, deal with it, and it's not like worrying about it will make it any less traumatic if it does.

I think this is the first time I've ever agreed with Valkyrie on something.

Quick, someone talk about ISU vs. Iowa.

ISU: Iowa licks balls

Iowa: No ISU does

ISU : NO YOU DO!

IOWA: U!

ISU : U!

IOWA : U!



ETA: and God said let there be light

HAHAHAHawkeyes!!! LOLZ.

I've never understood the idea that many people seem to have that you have to be single to learn/grow/mature/whatever. To me, that's like saying you can't walk and chew gum at the same time.

I don't think you HAVE to be single to learn/mature, but I think it happens much faster that way (at least in terms of the learning processes in question), and much more often that way than not. When you're single you tend to be much more self-focused than when you're in a relationship. (Actually, I do think relationships lead to growth processes as well, but they are different ones . . . )

If you're going from one relationship straight into another, there's far less time to reflect on "what you're doing wrong" before you start getting involved with someone else.

Of course, that doesn't mean that single people necessarily put too much thought into what went wrong, either, so being single doesn't guarantee that someone will become grow up.

This would be longer but I'm off to work.

boo!
 

Even if you don't care about the guy's girlfriend or karma in general, think about this:

if he ended up dating you, don't you think he would cheat on you too?

and

wouldn't you have to cut your future boyfriend some slack for flirting / hooking up with another girl if you did that to a guy with a girlfriend?

There are people who define their self worth based on their significant others and therefore, cannot fathom the idea of NOT having a boyfriend/girlfriend. They tend to stay with a bad bf/gf just to have someone and they aren't ever the ones to break up unless they have someone else waiting in the wings. They end up being needy, clingy and dependent, and those are the ones who need to spend some time alone, to find out who they are on their own, and learn to define their self worth in other ways. It doesn't apply to everybody, in my eyes, just to those who think they are nothing without a SO. Also, the type that I described above tend to morph into what they think the person they like wants them to be instead of being themselves and ending up with someone compatible. It's more important to be with SOMEBODY without real regard for whether that person is healthy for them or compatible with them. Women tend to do this more than men, but I've definitely dated some men who were terrified of being alone too and were just too clingy and dependent.

ETA: As to the original question, I would want to know why the person was still dating someone if they weren't happy in the relationship. If you aren't happy, leave it and then pursue someone else. I would remain in the friend category with the person and when/if they break up with this other person, then seek a new opportunity with them.

Dee

I remember a very good article from Seventeen that said pretty much the same thing. The author said she had gone with the same guy from age 13-18 and after they broke up, she had no clue what she was doing or how to relate to other guys. Everyone wrings their hands about young kids nowadays being in too "casual" of relationships, but I'm not sure this kind of thing (i.e. dating someone forever) wasn't equally hazardous, at least emotionally and mentally.

Some of the people I know are like this - they've NEVER not had a boyfriend for more than 5 minutes - and to be blunt, they're not as interesting as the people who have gone through periods of being single.

So I normally hate it when people quote themselves, but it is necessary to notice the irony.

If karma really IS a bitch.... I think I'm in trouble.

cheater cheater pumpkin eater?

He is.... Not me. ;)