Ladies, beware your perfect nice guy
 

Ok ok ok.

I have been totally dismayed by the way a lot of girls on here say that they are treated by boys.

And it makes me fearful for you.

Here is why.

Boys are supposed to open doors for you. Pick you up. Say nice things. Call you. Send you flowers and buy you gifts. This is the "Role". A traditional approach.

And depending on their background they may seem more or less chivalrous and mannered.

This has to do with the way they were raised or their early influences.

The crowd that I grew up with did all these things. We weren't necessarily nice. We were just raised that way. Some of us were asses.

But we opened doors, picked you up, said nice things, bought you flowers and acted more or less chivalrously.

That is the Basic Male Unit that you have the right to expect. Someone that has been well socialized enough, or at least watched enough Cary Grant . . . to Open Doors, pick you up, say nice things . . . and give you our jacket when you are chilly.

Thats not even an "upgraded male unit", thats the floor model. The upgraded male units are verbally expressive, caring, romantic, emotionally available, and have other skills and facets that make them intrigueing partners.

Think of them as options.

What I see is girls that are getting subnormal models, perhaps they are broken, or had too many defects to begin with. And then when finally you find a basic male unit you are so estatic you rave about it.

Kind of like going from a broken down Pinto to semi new import.

The worst thing is that you can be pathetically greatful for it. Like being given a drink of tepid water after being emotionally parched.

So honestly. When you are test driving your new men and they don't function as well as even a basic male unit . . keep shopping. Because being a nice guy has little to do with opening doors, picking you up, and saying nice things, those are supposed to be "by the ways". Standard factory package.

So if they don't even have the basics down: Move on.

Edited for sense. Thanks Billy.

James seriously please stop posting like Decadence. :) I did a speed read of that and got a couple things.

I think I hold doors just as much for guys as I do girls, old women as young. If my buddy calls me, I will call him back. It's just common decency and not things you do exclusively for girls. The first second you give or get more in a relationship than the other person, it's downhill.

-Rudey
--Most "nice guys" are self-labeled. Ever notice that?

heh not to down your post, I think it's valid and a very good one...

but if you just simply skim the post, the bold faced words jump out...Basic Male Unit and upgraded male unit...makes it sound like a different topic. hahaha :D

Which is the point. Its just common courtesy, even in relationships. Many girls wax rhapsodic over gusy that are just being polite . . like we are supposed to be.

And I don't post as loing as you think by word count. I use a lot more spacing. Old article trick makes it easier to read.

You're welcome. I'm getting tired of these stupid ass bitches on Greek Chat.

It does make it look like an extension of the penis thread lol :p

nice choice of words :P

James, damn, I love your threads... ;)

Anyway...I'm with you on the "basic male unit". However, in society now young boys and men are not being expected to perform these duties as often. You have to open the door for grandma but forget about your date that night getting the same treatment :rolleyes:

But, I am glad that I had a junker first so that I could truely value my Porshe :D

PS: I'm going to send your thread to some of my girlfriends... ;)

I totally agree with you James... I've seen many girls with guys who don't treat them the way they deserve to be treated, yet they continue to go back to them just so they can say they're with someone. I, on the other hand, refuse to settle.

no offense to this thread, but opening a door for a girl and picking her up has nothing to do with whether or not youre a nice guy. i was born and raised in ny, and except for those few times around the holidays, people rarely hold the door open for other people. its just a fact of life around here. and when i went to school in new mexico, everyone holds doors open for everyone. i personally wouldnt choose to date or not date a guy based on if he opened doors, picked me up, or bought me stuff. personality counts too ya know!!!! i think i can handle opening my own door and driving myself places.

i agree

I've told and continue to tell dates who sit in their cars expecting me to come out, or honk the horn for me to come out instead of coming to my front door to get me to hit the road and go and do whatever by himself. I dont tolerate that bullshit from anyone.........I dont care what they drive or how much they got, that's just plain rude.

I have to apologize to you xoheatherxo, I thought I was clearer.

Having manners has nothing to do with being a nice guy.

You can be a kind soul and spray food while you talk, as well as scratch your crack in public and sniff it. :eek: lol

What I was trying to point out is that a lot of women have experience with men that don't seem to know basic courtesies and basic courting behavior.

And that when they do stumble on it, they think it so terific because they are used to the lack and attritube it to being great or nice or whatever. When in reality that should be just normal.

That should be the basic standard of behavior and then you determine whether they are nice or whatever.

Within the past year I have noticed that mny of my friends treat their relationship much like that of their parents. One example is a friend who cuddles with her bf in our chapter room, at the bar, anywhere. It's PG rated, they are always touching and stuff. When I saw her parents, they act the same way. I really believe that one of the major influences of how people take on their relationships is set by example of what they have seen. Anoth one of my pieces of proof is a old roomie, she completly changed once she got a bf, she made it her life mission to have a bf and make him the center of her life. Later I found out that her parents were divorced and each of them were going on their third marriage.

I don't see this as jodging, but as a meer observation. So yeah, if someone sees how their parents interact they will probably expect that dating shoulf be like that. But then there are also people who have common sence and if they did have a "perfect" parent model will know what to expect from society.

Sorry to get off on a tagent, but just something that has intregued me lately.

As for a guys behavor, I expect normal things like opening doors, pushing in my chair, flowers just because. But it's also great when he does something that isn't expected. My theory is that you have to expect the best, at least when it comes to how a guy treats you :)

ThetaPrincess24, i totally agree with you on that. all i was saying is that although i would want him to come to the door to get me if he is picking me up, i wouldnt expect him to open my door once we got to the car.



honestly james, how is sitting in the car after the guy has turned the car off and gotten out normal?? i personally feel really stupid sitting in a car waiting for my date to come around and open the door for me when im perfectly capable of doing it myself. as for opening doors going into some place when youre on a date, if i get there first i get there first. is there something that says that a girl cant hold the door open for a guy if she happens to be standing in front of it?? again i think it looks incredibly dumb to stand in front of a closed door and wait for the man to open it for me when i can just open it and maybe even hold it for him!

It's these no-bra-wearing, door-opening feminisits who ruined it for the rest of us...men aren't raised to do nice stuff anymore and they act put out if you expect it.

Sorry, sometimes the mouth runs away with me...

I have met quite a few decent men who are socially inept and have no idea how to treat a woman like a lady. I have also met "gentlemen" who are not good people. Any day of the week I would choose a good man over a nice guy. Luckily, I am not out there looking anymore.

What you want to look for is overall thoughtfulness and not just to you, but to others as well so then you know it's not just "impressing a date" behavior.

I've never judged someone on opening my car door, but if it's raining or snowing and he unlocks his door, gets in, starts the car and you have to knock on the window to get his attention to unlock YOUR door while you're standing out there, we've got a problem (been there!).

But, ladies should keep in mind that courtesy should go both ways. If a man opens my door and lets me in, I always try to open his door from inside the car.

I can't see ever waiting inside the car for him to come around and open it for me, unless the inside handle is broken or something.

Dee

Reminds me of the film "A Bronx Tale" and the 'test'; to see if a girl is really for you. :)

Decadence, you should specify. Lotsa girls esp. won't know the story.

That's total BS. When do people not hold open doors in NY? If I go into an office building, they hold open doors. If I walk into a department store the person in front of me holds open the door. Most of the time we have revolving doors actually. You must hang out in the lower income sections of ny or something.

-Rudey

A Bronx Tale.
 

When I first saw this movie I was a kid. I remember thinking wow that's really great. And then thinking that central locking was the enemy of love and romance :).

omg!!!! i remember that scene!!! That's why I always look to see if his door is locked!!!

I knew you were one of the good ones. :)

I think I agree w/ Achtung...the feminazis (but NOT feminists...nothing wrong w/ being a feminist) ruined it. Sure I expect to be paid as well as my male counterparts and I expect my opinions to be valued equally, but I will never stoop to the behavior of some so-called "ladies" I've seen. I act in a way to attract the type of people I want to be with. If you act like trash, that's exactly what you'll get. Being feminine or polite does not make you in the least bit weak. It makes you civilized. Likewise, being macho or coarse does not make you strong, male or female. If a guy doesn't open a door for me, he's no good in my book. To me it's a sign of what type person he really is.

Rudey does bring up a good point...what is the etiquette for revolving doors? DBBoy and I had that discussion the other night and came up with nothing.

The etiquette is: "After you" with a polite bow and gesture . . . and then you trap her in the door and SPIN . . . .


:)

James, I agree w you 100%. Why do we settle? I have no idea. Lol. Because there are more substandard models than standard or upgraded out there???

I totally agree (although I realize some of the post was in jest.)
I think that as a society, we have just gotten ruder (more rude?). There are many people that will cut in front of you in a parking lot, not say thank you when you hold the door open for them, etc. Then again, there are still people who will hold the door FOR you, help you pick something up if you drop it, etc.

That being said, James I totally agree with your original idea. Girls if you are upset that your "nice" guy doesn't hold open the door for you....and I'm not even talking about opening it, i'm talking about holding it for you when he walks through it first....that's like, bottom of the barrel, basic manners. It's possible that he was brought up to behave that way, so if you call his attention to it he might change that for you. If not, it's not anything personal...but graduate to the smaller percent of the population that treat each other with respect. That immediately cuts the amount of eligible guys to a minimum but honestly, we all deserve at least that much.....I don't even deal with anyone less.
This is not a guy attack, it works the same way with women. Damn the uncouth!!!

rudey--first let me start off by saying that i think youre incredibly rude. just my opinion though. i think you misunderstood what i was trying to say before. to me, holding a door for someone is when you open the door and then step aside so the other person can go through. what you described before as holding it for the person behind you is not what i meant by holding a door. and how dare you assume that i hang out in low income sections of ny. maybe thats where you are all the time since you know so much about it! i thought these boards were to reply to stuff, not to put other people that you dont even know down. did you ever hear that saying if you dont have something nice to say?? maybe you should try it once in awhile cause this isnt the first time youve posted something like that!

Hey toots, I think you're rude for pretty much saying NY'ers are mismannered. I don't care what definition you like to use for holding a door, I've done it and it's been done for me. And for you to assume that people don't because you were born and raised there, it says that the people you associate with or are around are like that. You can come up with some sort of classification for those people and those neighborhoods - whatever makes you happy - but generally, the people I run into, the strangers going into a building, hold open doors and are very polite in NY.

-Rudey
--Maybe you're from Hunts point. Who knows? Who cares?

I don't care where you're from. There are rude people everywhere.

Rudy, it seems that you have been fortunate enough to not have encountered any rude people in New York.

But I know they are there.

Lady Pi Phi: i agree with you. there are rude people everywhere. and rudey: i never once said that nyers are mismannered--if thats even a word. i guess you live in your own little world where everyone is perfect and does everything the way you want it to be done. thats nice for you, but in the real world not everyone is like that.

Yes I know they're there too. Nobody ever claimed that every single person in NYC is polite. In fact, I made mention of sections in NY that probably have more rude people than others. Heck Heather runs into rude people all the time in NY and I claim she's rude for making that comment about NY. Hence, there are rude people everywhere, I never said there weren't, and your post was basically the equivalent of me saying "I'm breathing air."

-Rudey
--But thank you.

You said "i was born and raised in ny, and except for those few times around the holidays, people rarely hold the door open for other people." That pretty much indicates that NY'ers are rude except on a few occasions around the holidays.

And no, not everybody is perfect in NY. Nobody claimed they were. You can try and step away from what you said and try and change what I said, but at the end of the day you said NY'ers were rude and I said it's the people and neighborhoods you're in.

-Rudey
--Hunts Point.

The way I interpreted your post was that you are saying that people in the area of New York where you work and live aren't rude, but they are where Heather is.

Hindsight is 20/20 they say but you said "there are rude people everywhere." Nobody changed the meaning of everywhere did they? Nope I don't think so. Now back to your regular programming.

-Rudey
--Now off to eat chicken teriyaki just the way mom makes if my mom was a Mexican kitchen worker at a Japanese restaurant.

Good post James.

Also please note that being a nice guy does not mean being a wimp. Nor does it entail repeatedly informing everyone around you how nice you are.

Nice men can have backbones. Nice men can flirt. Nice men can EVEN be good in bed! Nice just means well-mannered and genuinely considerate of the people around you. That doesn't mean not arguing with them or giving in whenever someone disagrees, it just means being able to listen.

And most of the men I have known in my life who like to discuss how incredibly "nice" they are are no such thing. They are WHINERS who are searching for a reason why girls don't DATE them!

I think this goes for alot of things.....those who are rich don't sit around and talk about how much money they have all day, those who are beautiful don't usually walk up to ppl and say, "Hey I'm hot, just so you know...."

If you have to tell me what you are/aren't and I can't tell, there's a problem.

This link to an old thread kind of goes with this one . . . and also goes with lovelivy's analysis of a nice guy:

http://greekchat.com/gcforums/showth...ethically+nice

Especially look where I talk about ethically nice guys lol:

Actually here is the quote:

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Originally posted by James

There are also two basic kinds of nice guys:

1. "That guy" the nice guy cause he is secretly afraid of not being nice. ITs his strategy for being liked. This is the most common type of nice guy, and the one that gets dumped on, and the one the girls described as annoying.

2. The "ethically nice" guy. This is the most rare. He does The Right Thing because its the right thing. Not because he is afraid you won't like him or he is overly worried what you think. He'll treat you like a princess and at the same time will not put up with your shit.

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