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First of all let me send some love to Shalom, dejavu, Monique and chAKAalate......... I am glad yall feeling me 100%. Too Poplife (this is no diss)...... What you said is partly what saddens me about me about my people girrrrrrrl you say that "in 1895 you would not be able to work in Nordstom" I mean YOU say that as if it is a PRIVILAGE!! Thats no dam privilage!!!!!! Fuck That! I am tired of my people feeling like that because now we are so called "allowed" to be where WHITE people are at we should be happy! sweetie thats that slave mentality!!!! WE SHOULD HAVE NEVER NOT BEEN ALLOWED TO BE WHERE THEY WERE IN THE FIRST DAM PLACE!!!!! FUCK THEM!!!! THEY THINK THAT WE SHOULD BE THANKFUL NOW THAT WE CAN SHOP WHERE THEY SHOP AND ALL THAT SHIT !! HELL NAW I AM NOT GREATFUL CAUSE THAT IS JUST NORMAL EVERYDAY SHIT THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN THERE FOR US TO DO FROM DAY ONE. WE ARE PEOPLE TOO AND WE ALWAYS HAVE BEEN! BUT IN THE CONSTITUTION WE WERE ONLY STATED AS 2/3 RDS OF A PERSON AND TO ALOT OF WHITE PEOPLE WE ARE STILL THAT!!!! AND THEY THINK WE SHOULD FORGET ABOUT THE THINGS OUR PEOPLE WENT THROUGH AND ARE GOING THROUGH BECAUSE NOW WE GET TO BE AROUND THEM "LEGALLY" PLEASSSSSSSSSSEEEE FUCK THAT SHIT!!!!!! WE WERE PEOPLE THEN AND WE ARE NOW AND BEING ABLE TO WORK NEXT TO A WHITE PERSON DO NOT MAKE ME FEEL HAPPY OR PRIVELEGED CAUSE THEY DO NOT MEAN SHIT TO ME!!!!!!! Originally the question was about interracial dating and I gave my feelings about that some of the dum asses like (observer, fellow greek) turned this into a fuckin race war!!!!! Calling me racist cause i do not agree with interracial dating among whites and blacks hell if that makes me racist so be it then. AS FAR AS JUST AN OBSERVER GOES.........LOOK YOU IGNORANT ******* WHAT LIFE DO I OR MY PEOPLE HAVE THAT IS SO DAM GREAT THAT SLAVERY GOT US INTO!!!! WHO THE FUCK SAID WE WANTED TO BE HERE YOU SAY THAT STUPID SHIT LIKE WE GOT IT SO DAM GOOD IN AMERICA WE SHOULD THANK ALL THE SLAVE MASTERS FOR BRINGING US HERE!!!!! GRAND DRAGON OF THE KKK MOTHA FUCKA PLEASE!!!!! YALL WOULD NOT BE HERE IF YALL HAD NOT HAVE TAKEN THIS COUNTRY FROM THE INDIANS EVERY THING YALL CLAIM TO HAVE RIGHTS TOO YALL TOOK FROM SOMEONE YALL HAVE NOT WORKED FOR SHIT AND GOT IT ON YOUR OWN!!!! AS FAR AS FELLOW GREEK IS CONCERNED I DO NOT REALLY CARE WHAT KIND OF PERSON YOU ARE AND HELL NO I DO NOT SCOFF AT WHITE PEOPLE ON THE STREETS!! I HAD SAID ONCE BEFORE THAT I WAS NOT "HATING" ALL WHITE PEOPLE LIKE YALL MADE IT SEEM.... I JUST DO NOT GET CLOSE TO THEM!!!! I DO NOT GIVE A FUCK ABOUT THEM ONE WAY OR ANOTHER. I DO NOT REMEBER WHICH PERSON POSTED THAT "AS A WHITE MAN HE FEELS DISCRIMINATED AGAINST" OH MY GOD!!!!!!!!!! NOW I KNOW EVERYONE HAS TO AGREE THAT THAT IS A CROCK OF BULLSHIT!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!!! I CAN SAY THIS MUCH I DO NOT GIVE A DAM WHO IS OFFENDED OR WHO DISAGREES.....WHITE "MEN" ARE A PART OF THE REASON THAT EVERYONE FROM EVERY ETHNICITY AND ALSO WHITE WOMEN HAVE IT SO DAM HARD SO HOW COULD YOU EVEN FIX YOUR MOUTH TO SAY THAT DUM ASS SHIT. YALL REALLY RUN THE WORLD AND YALL DO A DAM GOOD JOB IN MAKING SURE THAT IT STAYS THAT WAY SO KISS MY ASS!!!!! AND AS FAR AS WHOEVER SAID "I AM BITTER AT WHITE PEOPLE FROM KEEPING ME FROM ACHIEVEING MY DREAM" PLEASE NO WHITE PERSON IS GOING TO KEEP ME FROM DOING WHAT I GOT TO DO I DO NOT GIVE A FUCK ABOUT YALL!!! BELEIVE THAT. I WILL GET MINE!!!! I AM NOT REALLY CONCERNED WITH THE WHITE PEOPLE THAT POST ON THIS TOPIC I EXPECT THEM TO TRY AND DEFEND THEMSELVES WITH NAIVE IGNORANCE. WHAT HURTS ME IS THE BLACK PEOPLE WHO ARE WILLING TO FORGET SLAVERY, AND EVERYTHING UP TO RIGHT NOW ENUFF TO FORGIVE WHITE PEOPLE ENUFF TO MARRY AND HAVE CHILDREN WITH THEM!! BLACK PEOPLE I NEVER SAID TO HATE THEM....... I AM JUST SAYING LOVE YOURSELF, YOUR PEOPLE AND SEE THEM FOR WHAT THEY REALLY ARE!!!!! REMEBER WHEN YOU MATE WITH A WHITE A PERSON THEY CAN LEAVE YOU AT ANY TIME AND ENTER BACK INTO THEIR WORLD AND YOU AND YOUR MIXED KIDS WILL ONLY HAVE BLACK PEOPLE TO TURN TO BECAUSE WE ARE MORE ACCEPTING OF MIXED PEOPLE!! ITS NOT WORTH IT! YOU CAN GET ALONG WITH WHITE PEOPLE AND ASSOCIATE WITH THEM(BEACAUSE YOU HAVE TO) BUT WE DO NOT HAVE TO INVITE THEM INTO OUR FAMILIES OR OUR ORGS. WE CAN ALL TRY AND LIVE TOGTHER BUT WE DO NOT HAVE TO BE "TOGETHER"!! WE HAVE FOUGHT TO HARD FOR THE LITTLE THINGS WE HAVE WHY SHOULD WE SHARE WITH THE PEOPLE THAT WE HAD TO FIGHT TO GET IT!!!!!!( THIS IS WHY I AM AGAINST WHITES IN BGLOS) THIS TOPIC WAS STARTED ABOUT KOBE BRYANT AND HIS CHOICE OF A WIFE AND I WILL END EVRYTHING I HAVE TO SAY IN REGARDS TO THAT!! IT BOTHERS US BECAUSE AS A BLACKMAN KOBE WOULD HAVE HAD IT HARD AS HELL IF HIS DAD WAS NOT A PRO BALL PLAYER AND IF HE WAS NOT SO WHY SINCE HE HIT IT BIG DOESN'T HE WANT TO SHARE THAT WITH A BLACK WOMAN? I MEAN AFTERALL HE IS THE PRODUCT OF A BLACK MARRIAGE!!!!!!!! FINALLY FOR ME ENUFF HAS BEEN SAID!!! MUCH LOVE TO MY BLACK BROTHERS AND SISTERS!!!!! AND AS SPIKE LEE ONCE SAID:"PLEASE WAKE-UP" CAUSE THIS HAPPY GO LUCKY GET ALONG EQUALITY SHIT ONLY EXIST IN THE MINDS OF THOSE WHO ARE ALLOWING THEMSELVES TO BE BLINDED AND WHO ARE SETTLING FOR LESS! CAUSE LESS IS ALL WE AS BLACK PEOPLE IN AMERICA HAVE THANKS TO WHITE PEOPLE AND LESS IS ALL WE WILL CONTINUE TO HAVE UNTIL WE STAND "TOGETHER" AS A PEOPLE AND NOT FEEL THE NEED TO BE ON A WHITE PERSONS GOOD SIDE OR BE THEIR FRIEND OR THEIR LOVER!!!!!
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I think it's important for people to understand that I am not trying to say that Black people don't deserve any respect or that what they have gone through is any less than anyone else, but we also need to realize that these terrible acts do not stand out alone for just black people. Terrible acts have been committed to many people of different colors, religions, beliefs, etc. etc. The Jewish faith for instance. The holocost(sp) was no easy task to overcome and many are still trying to overcome. Millions of people were tortured and murdered and put in concentration camps. They were separated from their families and the german army could and would rape many jewish women right on the street. Some were skinned and their skin was used to make lampshades, like a prize to be won. If any of you have read Ann Frank's diary, you know how they constantly lived in fear while in hiding. During that same time, many people from other countries that imigrated or were visiting the US were put into camps within the US. Most of the camps treated these people well, but some were not. I "rank" these terrible crimes right up there with slavery. As I mentioned before in another post, Irish peoples within the US were treated as dogs, and most people/books will tell you worse than black people. At the dawn of Christianity, and it's rise to popularity, many peoples, estimated from thousands to millions were tortured and burned at the stake for not being Christian and practicing witchcraft and paganism. Their families were ripped apart, their towns and houses were burned to the ground, their livestock killed or taken, their children beaten, burned, or sold.
I'm not saying that these things are any worse or less than what Black people have suffered. But let us not forget that there are other people out there that have suffered as well. I think all these crimes are right up there together as being some of the most devestating crimes in history, and most of the descendants today of those crimes that I have listed feel the impact still today, they feel the discriminating eyes of the rest of the world as well. Let us remember that there are other people out there that have suffered and feel the blows of the past. |
Really wrote:
...non violent man like Martin Luther King Jr..." I just thought of that quote from Chris Rock's "Bring the Pain" when he was talking about how Martin Luther King stood for non-violence, and now every major city in the country has a Martin Luther King Blvd. and there's always violence going on there. I'm not taking any sides in this debate, but I thought this quote was funny. Chris Rock is one of my favorite comedians. |
A few observations:
1.) Actually, blacks were considered only 3/5 of a person in the Founding Fathers' eyes, the same men who proclaimed that this country was free for all and that all were equal... 2.) While it is true that many groups, like the Jewish people, have been discriminated against, killed, beaten, etc., I think that Native Americans and Africans, brought to America FOR THE EXPRESS PURPOSE OF LABOR (first as indentured servants, then as slaves) are the only groups who have been enslaved through both legal and de facto means IN THIS COUNTRY, THE ONE THAT PRIDES ITSELF ON FREEDOM, EQUALITY, AND JUSTICE FOR ALL. That's a shameful history, one that was/is reinforced through Jim Crow laws (that were in force not so long ago), restrictive convenants (in which whites agree not to sell their homes to blacks, EVER), redlining (banks refusing to loan money in the same minority communities in which they receive deposits), steering (real estate agents making concerted efforts to steer blacks into only certain neighborhoods), job discrimination (having senior business executives make not only disparaging remarks about blacks while in board meetings, but carrying out discriminatory policies-Texaco), and the list goes on and on and on and on and on and on..... 3.)It's disengenous for anyone to try and absolve themselves of the responsibility to work toward change by saying their nor their ancestors owned slaves. Clearly, discrimination, racial violence (hey, whites burned up whole black towns in OK and FL in THIS CENTURY, just cuz they felt like it), and racial intolerance have all lingered with us (meaning ALL Americans) long after slavery ended. 4.)To those who asked what you can do: stop whining about how put upon you feel about having to read/hear about blacks' pain and hostility-talk to my sharecropping grandparents who could barely read but yet built a successful business and sent their kids to school, all while being discriminated against, then tell me how 'silly' this all is; read/watch historical pieces about the struggle/achievements of blacks in this country; form personal relationships with those different than you; participate in civic and social organizations that are working toward change; and admit that as an American, you were raised with at least SOME type of prejudice. This will go a long way toward understanding/helping the situation. Peace and God speed to all! DG |
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i am sorry that racism has died in some of your minds, but it lives everyday True. It lives everyday because people refuse to let it die. Once the whole concept of racism is gone once and for all, then the world will be a much better place. |
first, I never said anything was silly. second, I have openly admitted that my parents dont believe that races should be mixed (brought up with that predjudice), I have had relationships with many people of different races--including dating behind my parents backs, third, I've take classes in black history, I've run races (road races) to raise money for scholarships for underpriviledged children, women's cancer research, children's hospitals, National breast feeding week, black history month (feb.) awarness of black history, and many many more. I've done a lot of support for many organizations, including those that are black awareness related. My home town has a bit of the underground railroad in one home and I've helped raise money to keep that bit of history perserved. So what Have I done? I haven't contributed to all the negativity. After reading a lot of the posts in this forum, I do feel that most of the work I HAVE done is completely unappreciated. Because from what I've read, a lot of people seems to agree here that all white people think n****r in the back of their heads when they walk by a black person. Well we don't, I don't, and I have made an effort to learn a bit about what people have gone through and are still going through.
As for slavery being a different issue than the rest of the incedents I mentioned. Yes, each one is different. But just because they are different doesn't mean any one is less important or more justifiable. Nobody can justify slavery, as nobody can justify Adlof Hitler trying to wipe out an entire religious group--just because he didn't follow their beliefs, just because HE didn't consider them an elite group of people. People are sheep. We follow others. People will follow whoever gets up and takes hold of the raines. They crave to have a leader, someone to follow, to show them the way. Lots of times those people who get up to lead a group are terrible people, and they gain followers, and they do terrible things. When they are brought down and all is done and over with. . .alot of the followers feel guilty, sorry for what they did. We need good leaders to follow. To lead us into good times. |
[QUOTE]Originally posted by mgdzkm433:
[B]I think it's important for people to understand that I am not trying to say that Black people don't deserve any respect or that what they have gone through is any less than anyone else, but we also need to realize that these terrible acts do not stand out alone for just black people. Black people haven't forgotten that others have been wronged as well, but this particular thread focuses on BLACK people. When people in a Majority can rationalize in their minds that people who are of another race,ethnicity,nationality, etc. aren't human, it makes it a whole lot easier to justify the things they do. Especially when there is $$$ to be made at the expense of somebody else. But many of you feel that problems associated with the other classes are not your problem, you want no responsibility as long as your life is not affected. But when the drugs,gangs, guns, school shooting come into your upper middle class neighborhoods it a Damn National Crisis!!! Noone cared when Junebug and Skeeter was shooting up the inner city school but when it happened to John and Jessica action needed to be taken, gun laws changed, blah blah blah. The sooner we all figure out that our brother's problem should be our concern as well the better off we'll all be...but people in general(regardless of race) are selfish so that's not going to happen so I'm done wasting my time on this issue and I encourage others to do the same. [This message has been edited by deja vu (edited June 01, 2000).] |
This topic doesn't focus on just black people. It focuses on Black people and White people both. "Black men and White women Is it a Problem?"
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mgdzk433
I wanted to respond to you because you seemed to be upset, you seem to feel like you get characterized as one of those quote on quote "bad white people". You ticked off a list of positive things you have done to improve racial situations. That is great. But I wanted to make a point of saying that you should be doing these things not for recognition but because it is the right thing to do. Once again what makes us different me as a Black women and you as a white person is that you can make a conscious choice to fight opporession or choose to do nothing. I as an African-American I have no choice. I am forced to combat oppression because of the skin color I wear everyday. Poplife you made a comment to the effect that when you see yourself in the mirror, you see a person not necessarily an African-American woman. Well, I differ that when I look in the mirror and see my chAKAlate skin and kinky hair. I am happy and proud. I don't want to be seen as just a person. I want to be seen as an African-American woman. I am immensely proud of that heritage. Because I know that I am a person, if someone else can't see that then that is their problem. The same thing no matter what your race, you should be proud of what you see. What a boring world this world would be if we were all the same color and looked alike. My problem is not with difference but with hierachy being placed onto that difference. That one person's difference is better than someone elses. To the person that said this is a race war. It is not it is a dialogue. I think dialogue like this is important if we are ever going to be able to change the situation. We need to understand and recognize how each other feel. 433 I commend you for staying in the conversation. I know it must be hard in a way to be a White person in these type of conversations. But you also are the benefit of an immense amount of privilege because of your white skin. If you are Greek or even if not I hope that you share your commitment with eradicating racism etc. with fellow frat and friends. And to the person in the middle east making the comment about the atrocities going all over the world, don't forget Africa: the AIDS epidemic and approaching famine. I am aware of those problems and I feel overwhelmed and I believe that the whole world has a responsibility to alleviate these problems. I am trying to prepare myself with my education to one day help combat these atrocities. You challenged us. What are you doing? Also, Why are African-Americans always being challenged when we "bitch" about racism but when Jewish people talk about their issues no one ever comes down on them. Give our issues the same respect. Prettygyrl, you're angry sister. Don't let these problems eat you up. Girl holding such pain and anger inside will eat you up. I feel you but you have to let go of some of it, for your own health at least. ------------------ Aim for the moon,.... if you miss you'll be among the stars. [This message has been edited by chAKAlate (edited June 01, 2000).] |
You know. . .thank you. That is about the best post I've read. No offense to anyone else. You are right, I do feel like I have been stereotyped as one of these so call "bad white people." I guess it is beacause of all the negativity brought on by both sides. I do want to make one thing clear, you did point out that I shouldn't do things for recognision. You are right, and I don't. The only thing I've strived for is to raise the money and get the job done. Running a race is hard work (we aren't talk about track races here--we are talking half marathons). I'm never one of the people that finish first--I'm far from that good, but it makes me feel good to cross the finish line no matter if I were the first person or the last, because I know I've made a difference. I just wanted to let you know that I don't do these for my own personal glory.
I also wanted to point out that you are right about everything you said. There are differences between the two of us, and I don't think that I ever said there weren't. You do have to live with the opression that has taken place throughout time, that is a fact, and I commend YOU for being the strong people you are for working to overcome that. I do benifit because of my color, and I don't try to pretend that I don't, and if I came off as seeming this way, I'm sorry. My original thought of this topic is that instead of feeling so much hate or anger toward each other, we can use that energy to toward making things better. In our lifetime, we will probably not see much of a change, but can we really take the risk of giving up? I don't want people to forget the past--black or white or ANY color or background. I want us to move forward. Yes, we are all here together, some people might not like that nor did they ask for it, but that's the facts, we can either work together, grow together and move on, or we can stay angry, hateful, and yes segragated (because come on, is that what we are not doing--pointing out differences and defining each other as separate groups) and stay the same or regress. The choice is up to us, and the only way to make things better for EVERYONE is to find a common ground. Maybe I'm not realistic, but I'd rather TRY to create a better world to raise my children in than to settle for the one I'm in now. |
chAKAlate, you made a lot of good points & I understand (& agree with) much of what you said. About not seeing any white people in Compton... why do you think that is? I've never been to Compton so I do not know from first hand experience, but, there are areas where white people do not feel safe and areas where black people do not feel safe (another person posted this as well). Maybe Compton is one of those types of areas?
chAKAlate wrote: "And please stop saying that slavery does not matter. History, does not matter?" Not everyone is saying this. I think the majority of people in this conversation are saying that we need to remember the past, learn from it and use that knowledge to help create a better today & tomorrow. Poplife wrote: "but anger has no place in progress." I totally agree. Discogoddess wrote: "It's disengenous for anyone to try and absolve themselves of the responsibility to work toward change by saying their nor their ancestors owned slaves." That wasn't the point of those comments. The comments regarding slavery were in relation to some certain people in this discussion having great anger/hatred towards ALL white people because some white people in the past did very bad things. The comments were that some white people did bad things, but there were many more who did good (it's all in my previous messages). My conclusion was that NOONE should hate another person because of the color of their skin and had nothing to do with absolving the responsibility of working towards a more positive future. Yes, we all need to work towards a more positive future, for all people. |
Kimmy posted
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Many small people, who in many small places, do many small things can alter the face of the world ------------------ SilverTurtle@greekchat.com Phi Beta Fraternity Phi chapter |
Here we go again with the discussion of race. As an African-American female majoring in education with a specialty area of history I have had the fantatstic advantage of truly "understanding" history. I attend a HBCU (Black college)and have been taught history from both sides of the coin so I feel educated enough to comment on this from three perscpectives a historian, an African-American, and a woman. I will try to keep the post short as possible. Since this whole thread stared about interracial dating my personal opinion is NO I don't like to see a black man with a white woman, and thats simply how I feel. Now for the white respondents. No matter how good your intentions are in your heart you will never understand or for that matter should understand where we as African-Americans are coming from. Its unfortunate but its reality. I think that it's prettygryl (sp)"tone", not the message, that has so many people fired up. I understand completly what she is saying and agree with a lot of it, but she will find that on the internet tone is everything in a message. Are all white people evil? Of course not, I think that is how alot of white are interpretting these posts. White people have done some evil things (like every other race) but no one has systematically set out to conquer and exploit every race on this earth except those of European descent. So collectively as a whole alot of non-Whites view you in a negative light. You know what I am sorry too that your ancestors conquered, raped, murdered, enslaved, and exploited the races of the world, but hey thats the past right. Well no actually its not. The result of those actions has effected every African-American in this country and in Africa as well. Think about this and I would love an educated repsonse. What would happen if for example China decided to take the smartest, strongest, people we have in America (for hundreds of years) take them to work the rice fields in China and then ban English, Christianity, and strip us of human rights. You know what kind of country you would have hundreds of years later? A continent much like Africa where the basic problems are finding something to eat, not serving your country four years so you can go to COLLEGE! So you know what lets agree we can not UNDERSTAND the experience and try to atleast get along.
Responses always welcome! |
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And what's wrong with accepting good intentions regardless of where or who it comes from? In the long run it's to the benifit of all. I've seen a lot of EXCUSES on this post that are feeding into keeping race relations the way they are, sour. I am doing my part to better my country for my friends, my family AND YOU. What are you doing? |
Gyrl:
Actually my comment was more towards people who complain about the status of blacks without bothering to stop and think about how it was. I'm not speaking as if it were a privilege. You say you're not grateful???? You're not grateful for everything your ancestors tried and died for??? You're not grateful that you can do what you what when you what if your really want to???? If that's true then that's just too bad for you. Your shades of anger discolor my words. I am grateful BUT it's not for the fact that I can now work with white people. I'm grateful because I don't have to choose between being a washerwoman and a mammy. I am grateful because everyday I am recognized for being a good sales person and an all around descent human. I am grateful because I can go to any school I want. It doesn't matter who I am with while I do these things. What matters is that I can actually do them. Damn, you are one angry sista!!!!! ChAKAlate: I understand you seeing black/being proud to be black when you look in the mirror. I am too!! The reason I say that it's not the FIRST thing I see when I look in the mirror is MOST of the things that define me as a person cannot necessarily be linked to my race. I can't say I want everyone to see a black girl first (and when you wear an afro like me that's hard...lol). I'd rather have them see an intelligent female with a wonderful creative side and a wild sense of humor. But if they see black that's cool too...being black definitely influences me but it doesn't totally define me. :-) I see it this way: I got more stuff in life to deal with. I can talk about it for years but it won't change anything. I'm happy with who I am and joyous when I think of the things I will become. I've been weighed down by anger, hate, and frustration before and I won't let myself be pulled into the vortex again. Quote:
[This message has been edited by Poplife (edited June 01, 2000).] |
Hello all,
The original post discussed the pending marriage of Kobe Bryant. Anyone that hoped this wouldn't become an issue of race was living with blinders on...sorry http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/frown.gif. To answer the question, yes, black men and white women will be a problem and will continue to be one for years to come. As we all see from the posts, people have some very strong opinions. I too would like to offer mine. I could care less what Kobe does cuz he is not paying my bills particularly my tuition...lol. Why is this even an issue? There are so many other things in this world, in this country that are far more important. We have people in this country who live in towns with no government representation. There are African-American children who are living in the adoption system who will probably remain there until age 18. There are also interracial and non-interracial children in foster care because they are too old. There is slavery, poverty, lack of human rights in Africa. Women being circumcized in Africa. The AIDS crisis there has also worsened and we are concerning ourselves with Kobe and his lovelife? I mean no disrespect to the initiator of the thread or to the people who have posted, but I hope that you think about the bigger picture. I also think about what my ancestors went through, not as far back as 1895 but 1916 before my grandfather was born. My great grandmother was threatened by the Klan because of the beliefs of my great grandfather. By the grace of God was she not killed nor my grandfather, yet to be born. Thinking of that makes me appreciate the fact that I don't have to deal with something like that. NO it doesn't make me greatful to white people because everything I have was earned through hard work and blessings from the Creator. I also do keep in mind that had this been the 1800's I may not have the opportunities as I do now OR I may have the flipside because I am light skinned. To ignore that fact will make me a very lost and ignorant person. For me it is fuel to persevere and excel so I can change the slave mentality that many of us have. Prettygyrl, I understand your anger but I think you may have misinterpreted what Pop was saying. Peace. ------------------ Never cast your pearls before swine Matthew 7:6 |
FIRST OF ALL........I will respond to Poplife I am not going to get it into to a heated discussion with anyone of my people here in this forum. But I do want to say this much.... I do not know what world you live in that you can do whatever you want to when you want. Girl please come this way and i would like to see you walk through a number of cities and make it out alive. Hell I would like to see you with a college degree be amongst many making more than a white person without one! You misunderstood what I was saying sweetie.... of course I am glad that we are able to DO some things that were not accessible to us before BUT AT THE same time dear.... as i said those were things that never should have been off limits to us in the first place. So no I do not feel a whole lot of joy about the fact that so many of my people had to lose their life for JUST for me to be able to go to a good school, or sit down and eat with a white person. HELL NO I AM NOT GREATFUL OR HAPPY ABOUT THE FACT THAT SO MANY OF MY PEOPLE HAD TO DIE JUST SO I COULD BE TREATED HUMAN! You said there are so many other things you have to worry about than things of this nature or that you do not see yourself as Black first......I say this just because you do not talk about these issues do not mean they will go away. If you do not see BLACK first then let me tell you that everyone else does. THIS IS FOR EVERYONE...... I AM NOT ANGRY I AM HURT BY THE WAY THINGS HAVE BEEN AND ARE FOR MY PEOPLE! IT PAINS ME TO SEE THE DESTRUCTION THAT HAS COME UPON US AT THE HANDS OF OTHER HUMAN BEINGS(WHITE PEOPLE) THIS IS SOMETHING THAT I AM VERY PASSIONATE ABOUT BECAUSE IT AFFECTS ME AND MY CHILDREN AND MY FRIENDS AND MY FAMILY ETC. I DO NOT WALK AROUND EVERYDAY WITH A CHIP ON MY SHOULDER READY TO BEAT DOWN ANY WHITE PERSON THAT I SEE. NO I AM BETTER THAN THAT. AS I HAVE SAID BEFORE I AM VERY MUCH SO ABLE TO LIVE, AND DEAL WITH WHITE PEOPLE IN THIS WORLD. I CHOOSE TO ONLY DATE BLACK MEN AND ONLY HAVE DEEP ASSOCIATIONS WITH PEOPLE OF COLOR THAT IS MY CHOICE. AS FAR AS HOW PEOPLE THINK I COME OFF IN MY POST....... THATS TOO DAM BAD TAKE THEM FOR WHAT THEY ARE MY OPINIONS AND MY OWN PERSONAL FEELINGS. I DO NOT TRY AND DISS PEOPLE OR HURT ANYBODYS FEELINGS. I HAVE ONLY SPOKEN TRUTH AND IF THERE ARE WHITE PEOPLE WHO READ WHAT I SAY IN THIS FORUM AND GET OFFENDED THEN THEY MUST BE GUILTY. I SPEAK FROM A HISTORICAL STANDPOINT AND FROM MY EXPERIENCES. I AM NOT SPEAKING FOR EVERY BLACK PERSON IN THIS WORLD (I WISH I WAS THOUGH) I AM SPEAKING FOR ME. IF I TYPE IN ALL CAPITAL LETTERS IT IS BECAUSE THAT PART OF WHAT I AM SAYING IS IMPORTANT. I KNOW SOME ASSOCIATE ALL CAPS WITH YELLING BUT THAT IS NOT THE MESSAGE I AM SENDING. I CAN NOT BE ANGERED BY THIS FORUM I DO NOT KNOW ANY OF YOU AND NOR YOU ME SO WHAT SENSE WOULD IT MAKE TO GET ALL HOSTILE. IT IS JUST SOME THINGS PEOPLE SAY ARE JUST STUPID AND SOME THINGS SADDEN MY HEART. THATS IT THATS ALL. FYI: OVERALL I AM A PRETTY HAPPY PERSON I KNOW THAT NO WHITE PERSON IS GOING TO KEEP ME FROM DOING ANYTHING. THEY ARE A EXTREMELY SMALL PART OF MY OWN PERSONAL WORLD. I DEAL WITH THEM WHEN I HAVE TO AND WHEN I DO NOT HAVE TO I CHOOSE NOT TO! THSTS NOT ANGER NOR RACISM THATS JUST MY CHOICE!
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I'm white. Black people are an extremely small part of my world. I deal with black people only when I have to. Honestly, it makes no difference to me if I ever see another black person. I mean if they all picked up and moved or whatever, I would not miss them at all.
Does this make me, a white person, racist? If it does, then prettygyrl, you must also be a racist. Because those words were not mine. They were yours. Yes, I know the words are not exact, I switched the places of black & white in what you said. Those were all words you stated in the above message & another message on page 2 of this discussion. prettygyrl, you may not be a racist but that is definitely the impression you are giving off. LOOK AT THIS... for anyone who did not read this entire message and is thinking the first paragraph is coming from me, please read this entire message and you will get the point. |
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I'm not HAPPY about it either. But I have to say I'm grateful that somewhere people had the courage to stand up for what they knew was right. That's where I get a lot of my strength and positivity from. Quote:
I've heard people in the bathroom in my floor talking about the N!gger in 403 (me). I've heard people say that so-and-so must like black people because he likes rap. I've heard the white girl next door talk about how she thinks I'm in a gang because I wear a scarf at night. I've had people come into my store and boss me around like my name is Butterfly McQueen. You think that doesn't make me angry??? Poplife doesn't give a flip what people see first. People will see what they want to see anyway. It doesn't bother me, so why should I care??? My thing is this: I could tell you about many one on one racist incidents I have encountered face to face, but why? I refuse to become the stereotypical angry black person. You think you're the only one who hurts by this? Girl, I'm not all "let's hold hands and heal the world" but when I look back on all that has happened I feel that we have already been hurt too much. By allowing ourselves to constantly feel angry and upset we are simply allowing ourselves to continue to feel hurt even though our grounds still shake with the echo's of the past. It takes more strength to stay positive and to be happy with what you have than it does to let anger get the best of you. My father said that the best thing we can do is concentrate on bettering ourselves and that's what I'm doing. Even though I "grew up well" (not my term) I still get mad when I go to my old neighborhood and see people that used to be my neighbors still there. I wonder "why me and not them too?" I hurt as well, and not only that, but sometimes I feel guilty even though I didn't have anything to do with it. I just wondered why you seemed so focused on whites when they're not the only other non-black race in this country. Maybe it's me, but I didn't think whites were the only people that have a problem with me being black. It come come from anyone...sometimes even your own (you should know what I mean.) We all suffer from the same ills in one way or another....it's all about how you take it. [This message has been edited by Poplife (edited June 04, 2000).] |
Username actually no i would not think you were a racist if you said that in all actualty i would not really give a dam. Ya dig! If you think it makes me racist so be it! My plight in life is not to please other people but to please myself, take care of my business and help my people any way i can! Poplife I am glad you can handle things so well. I agree to disagree with everybody you handle things your way i handle them mine. Its cool. I was not knocking the way you feel I was just clarifying what I said. Everyone gets so bent about the things I say but I have told no lies and I speak from the heart. I am a very blunt person and i respect anyones opinion.
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Wassupp.. I just wanted to be number 100!!
Hahahaha.. but for real pretty gyrl much love and respect to ya gyrlie!! Love to everyone else who see's her point cause I'm feeling her 110%... peace |
Hey! You beat me to it. Guess I'll have to settle for #101...
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You know what? I've spent so much time off-topic I never commented on the original thread.
Well, all I have to say is this: I like to see strong black men marry strong black women. It's one of the best sights someone like me can see. BUT I really can't talk about racial mixing because many people that I love and respect are products of a black person with a non-black mate (i.e. my bestfriend and Prince. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif ) If I don't know the reason someone married outside their race then I can't speak on it. How do we know why they are with that person?? It's not always a case of wanting to change the flavor of their candy (but sometimes it is). Someone spoke about how some black men can get when they come into a bit of money. That's true, but I read in a few magazines that the girl Kobe is marrying was his high school sweetheart. Plus, isn't he from Cali???? Well then that explains a lot! lol. I know out there it's a common thing. Alot of black men are dating/marrying Latinas. Kobe is one of many. There are more kinds of interracial couples than black/white. Take my bestfriend: All four of her grandparents are either mixed black people or non-black. Another friend of mine is Guyanese. Her mom is black and her dad is East Indian. In Guyana (not to be confused with the African country Ghana) no one cares. It's too common to be bothered by it. To the people that say that are against it, is that just for white/black relationships or for any black/non-black, white/non-white and so on and so forth type of thing? [This message has been edited by Poplife (edited June 04, 2000).] |
i will be the first to admit, that there have been quite a few times when i have seen black men with white women and it hurts. Mostly because it does seem like when black men reach a certain stature in life they seek out either the lightest damn near close to white women they can find...or a white woman. Not to mention the fact that black men date white women far more than black women date white men although those numbers seem to be increasing. For the man that dates any woman of various nationalities not based on the color of their skin but for that person's qualities, that I have no problem with...it's only those that date exclusively outside their race that bother me. For someone to be black and date only white, it's as if your saying that your own skin color isn't beautiful. If you cannot find beauty in your own people enough to date them, than you definitely are suffering from low self esteem because you would have to have a bad case of self hate to exclude your people from your personal dating game. The same applies to white's. I have seen plenty of white girls who date only black men exclusively and people who do these things offer very weak excuses for doing so. And often times than not base their decision to date exclusively outside their race based on stereotypes. Those stereotypes I won't bother going into we all know what they are! Basically what I am saying is if you have a strong sense of self you can open yourself to dating all races as we all have something to learn from and offer each other. If you choose to date exclusively outside your race, I suggest you see a therapist about your severe color complex issues.
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I agree. Well said! |
Interesting coincidence with regards to this thread: there are at least two movies out now that involve interracial relationships: Mission Impossible 2 and another one. I mentioned Mission Impossible 2 because it's obvious, but I'll keep the other movie a secret because it's kind of a surprise. Anyone who has seen the movie will know what I'm talking about. In MI-2 the race thing is not an issue at all. In the other movie, it's kind of an issue, but an amusing one.
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Dang this is still going strong! Hey Mr. Moderator has there ever been other forums that have went this long? Anyway........ thanks Mgdzkm433 I truly respect your opinion as well. Thanks Monique I am glad you understand. To answer someones question about is the problem with only White and Black dating for the most part for ME anyway yes it is. Although I would love to see Black men with Black women it does not sadden me to see one with people of Hispanic descent. Also actually Kobe and his future wife were not highschool sweet hearts Kobe is not originally from L.A. He met this girl on the set of a video shoot. Finally............ I want to say something to Black people........UNFORTUNATELY ARE PRESENT STATE AS A PEOPLE IS VERY WEAK CURRENTLY, AND I COULD GO ON FOR DAYS AS TO HOW IT IS WE BECAME THIS WAY BUT I WILL NOT EVEN BOTHER WITH HOW IT STARTED. I WILL SAY THIS THOUGH.........WE WILL NEVER(I CAN NOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH) EVER GAIN EQUALITY IN THIS WORLD AS LONG AS WE CAN NOT GAIN IT AMONGST OURSELF. UNTIL THE DAY COMES THAT WE CAN SAY THAT NONE OF THE PAIN AND SUFFERING WE ENDURE IS AT THE HANDS OF ONE ANOTHER WE WILL CONTINUE TO STRUGGLE IN THIS WORLD. AS A PEOPLE WE HAVE A POOR SENSE OF WORTH AND WE CONTINUE TO HURT EACH IMMENSELY INSTEAD OF LOVING ONE ANOTHER. THE LOVE OF OURSLEVES IS KEY TO OUR STRUGGLE, WE SHALL NEVER OVERCOME UNTIL WE ARE STRONG AS A PEOPLE AND UNIFIED WITH A DEEP LOVE AMONGST OURSELVES. WE NEED TO REALIZE THAT THE GREATEST ACCEPTANCE WE CAN ACHIEVE IS THE ACCEPTANCE OF EACH OTHER NOT THE ACCEPTANCE OF OTHERS! UNTIL WE CAN LOVE, RESPECT, TRUST, AND BE LOYAL TO ONE ANOTHER WE CAN NEVER BE THAT WAY TO ANY OTHER. IF THERE ARE SOME WHO THINK THAT ARE IN LOVE WITH THE OTHER OR THAT RESPECT OR ARE RESPECTED BY THE OTHER, OR THAT THEY TRUST OR ARE TRUSTED BY THE OTHER, THEY ARE SUFFERING FROM A FALSE SENSE OF LOVE, RESPECT, TRUST, AND LOYALTY CAUSE ALL THAT BEGINS AT HOME. IF YOU DO NOT LOVE YOURSELF THEN YOU CAN NOT POSSIBLY LOVE ANYONE ELSE! I KNOW THAT WE ARE ALL INDIVIDUALS BUT AS A PEOPLE WE ARE ONE IN THE SAME. I SEE THINGS SUCH AS INTERRACIAL DATING,ALLOWING WHITE PEOPLE INTO BGLOS ETC. AS ANOTHER WAY THAT WE WEAKEN OURSELVES. THESE THINGS WEAKEN BONDS THAT WE MAY ALREADY HAVE AND CHANCES OF BONDS TO BE FORMED. IT IS JUST ANOTHER WAY WE DIVIDE OURSELVES. IF THERE ARE SOME WHO DO NOT BELEIVE OR WHO HAVE YET TO SEE THE REPERCUSSIONS OF THESE THINGS TRUST ME WHEN I SAY YOU WILL ONE DAY SEE. IT IS NOT ABOUT HATRED, OR RACISM. YES WE CAN WORK WITH WHITE PEOPLE, GO TO SCHOOL WITH THEM, ASSOCIATE WITH THEM, HELL INVITE THEM OVER FOR DINNER. YOU KNOW, WHATEVER. BUT! OUR FAMILIES AND OUR ORGS(SUCH AS BGLOS) IS SOMETHING THAT IS OUR OWN. PRIVATE PERSONAL! THESE ARE THINGS THAT WE HAVE AND ARE FIGHTING TO MAINTAIN, THINGS THAT WE HAVE AND ARE FIGHTING TO KEEP IN GOOD STANDING, TO KEEP THEM STRONG. THESE ARE THINGS THAT WE HAD TO AND STILL HAVE TO WORK DAM HARD AT TO KEEP TOGETHER AND TO KEEP THEM POSTIVE AMONGST OURSELVES! WE DO NOT HAVE TO SHARE THESE THINGS WITH THEM NOR SHOULD THEY HAVE TO SHARE THEM WITH US. WE ARE DIFFERENT! WE ARE VERY DIFFERENT! OUR LIFES WILL ALWAYS GO IN DIFFERENT WAYS. INTERGRATION MAY BE A GREAT IDEA IN SOME ASPECTS OF OUR LIVES BUT IT IS NOT SUCH A GOOD IDEA IN OTHER ASPECTS OF OUR LIVES. HOW CAN YOU KEEP THE BLACK FAMILY STRONG IF ONE OF THE HEADS OF THE FAMILY IS NOT BLACK? ITS REALLY NOT EVEN CONSIDERED A BLACK FAMILY ANY LONGER, RIGHT? SO WHAT HAPPENS WHEN ONE DAY THERE ARE JUST NO MORE BLACK PEOPLE AT ALL?........ I JUST WANTED TO GIVE YALL SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT. I AM DONE WITH THIS TOPIC. I WANT TO SEND LOVE OUT TO ALL PEOPLE, BECAUSE I DO LOVE ALL PEOPLE. i JUST HAVE A GREATER AND MUCH DEEPER LOVE FOR MY PEOPLE AND IF THAT MAKES ME A RACIST........... THEN HELL, SO BE IT!
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Prettygyrl,
I think that only a topic about religion MIGHT have gone this long, but I'm not sure. Also, I'm not a Mr. I'm a Miss. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/tongue.gif |
DID I CALL YOU A MR. MGDZKM433. IF I DID I APOLOGIZE!
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Prettygyrl,
I think it's important for us all to express our true feeling, and I think that it's great that you feel strongly about something. Many people walk through life with the lack of feeling strongly towards any one thing in particular. I think it's wonderful to really believe in something, especially heritage and the past. I commend you for your strong beliefs in something so close to your heart. Even though some people might not agree with you, you should hold strongly to your feelings. I don't think there's an issue anywhere out there that everyone will fully agree on. They might not be as controversial as this issue, but we are all individuals with our own feelings, thoughts, beliefs, and opinions. It's important for us to express ourselves. Not only do I commend you, but I thank you as well. Even though you and I might not agree, I feel it's always important to view anothers opinion and learn from it, no matter if you agree with it or not, it is another prospective that I might never have thought of. |
it looks as if people still have strong feelings about the whole interracial dating issue. personally, i'm in no position to deny myself the pleasure of a beautiful woman's company, regardless of her race. i'm a black man myself, and the last girl i dated was white.what i found funny was that some of the black women who openly criticized me had previously turned me down for dates. what was i to do? sit on my hands and knees praying for that special black woman? get real! especially considering the sheer amount of lovely ladies out there willing to be with me.
besides, last time i checked, uniting different cultures was something people strived for. am i to think that it's only ok provided i don't fall in love with a member of a different race and culture? we can be friends and talk all this nonsense about peace and unification but we can't date? fall in love? perhaps i'm just not getting it. |
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DAMN!
Okay, let me say I really agree with shalom on this post and AKA2D '91. I really feel that if you know your history as an African in AMerica and understand slavery to the fullest, there would be no way you would date outside of your race (as a Black person). No other race was brought here for cheap labor purposes ONLY. I hear whithe people say all the time that "I didn't beat your ancesors" or" I didn't lynch you uncles and aunts, why are you mad at me." Because I am still living with that reality EVERYDAY of my Black life, that's why and so are you. Yeah although you didn't have the whip in hand, personally, one of your ancestors did. Point blank. Additionally, they want the Black folk when they are on top. Let some Sh*% go down with Kobe...NO ONE will have his back except the Black Community. This has happened numerous times in the past. I personally think there are cultural differences that make it very difficult when people marry outside of the Black race. Additionally, the more we marry outside of the race, eventually the Black family (with traditional Black values and customs) will be erased. I agree that I tend to have problems with people who ONLY date outside their race, and I have seen some. The occasional dating may not be the problem. But when you look past me (a strong sistah) to get to Sally...that's a problem. To BlondeChick...you misconstrued the message. See..as Black women we have had MUCh more to deal with from the START of slavery and we endured. We were not meant to survive...do you understand that? But we did. There's drugs that are DELIBERATELY put into OUR neighborhoods...genocide. Many of us have fallen prey...many haven't. Still we raise children in some of the worst neighborhoods KNOWN to man. Yet we still raise athletes, doctors, lawyers, etc. Remember we are talking on the average here. I am not saying there aren't white people who have had it bad and that there aren't some Black people who were afforded a lot of amenities so they would succeed. On the average...it's just not that way. Finally, I don't see how a man can say he loves hi mama and marry someone who looks NOTHING like her. I'm angry. Because I truly think white people don't understand where we are as a people...I KNOW they don't. Shaka Sankofa was MURDERED yesterday for a crime in which there is definite questions about his involvement. I know you don't understand, but you don't have to. All of my life I have been MADE to understand you. Your history, your language, etc. I'll tell you what, my son will not bring a white girl home. His father is in the Nation of Islam and I am very Pro-Black (can you tell). It won't happen. I feel like the white people who say "I am not racist, my maid is Black." But I have plenty of friends who are white. I would question them if they stepped into the room with my brothah on their arm. I love you all, but I have got to go. |
Delta Brat can I say amen.
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DELTABRAT...
I really commend you for your stance. Often times on this board, people intend to say what you did, but their arguments are so stilted and end up sounding ignorant. You are a very eloquent, well-stated person (and thanks for not using caps!) I don't object to interracial dating, because you can't control with whom you fall in love. I have, however, been ignored by black men in favor of white women--made to feel as if I'm not even in the room. That annoys me, but I really don't feel it appropriate to comment on it, because anyone can criticize my life and my dating choices. We all should remember to concentrate on bettering ourselves, and the rest will follow. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif |
Username...I like the way you reply to posts. It's interesting and easy to follow.
I forgot who asked the question to chAKAlate about the CPT (that's Compton). I am born and raised in Compton, left to go to UCLA. now I am back because I am a struggling graduate student (ya know the story). The fact is not that white people don't feel "safe" in Compton. The fact is that when Black people began to move to Compton in the 60's and 70's (yes, RUNNING from the south...we all know why. If not, see other 100+ posts on this thread)the city consisted on MOSTLY whites. I remember my neighbors being white when I was growing up. When they both died, we went to the funderal etc., etc. What happened/ As Blacks moved in, whites moved out. Point blank. It's strange because we all know that white people (in Cali) would really prefer to live where we (Black and Latino) do. It is called South Central for a reason. It is the most centrally located area in Los Angeles. Close to downtown, Riverside, whatever. Is anyone aware of the fact that there was JUST a prison built in Watts. You can see it off the 105 Fwy. Additionally, the building of the 105 happened very close (temporally) to the building of that prison. Some militant brothahs and sistahs (my mentors) feel that there is a reason behind this. Something to the tune of incarcerating MORE Black men. Thus leaving their families barely able to fend for themselves. Raising the prices of homes in Watts, thereby making them unaffordable. Moving BACK in. DOn't forget that at one time, this was the residence of white people, and leaving us, once again, to fend for ourselves. Sound like a crock of shit? NOT. Okay, enough on the lessons from the hood. PEACE |
By the way, Kobe's fiancee is Latina. My boyfriend just got an e-mail from his friend with a pic of them in the locker room after the game on Monday. He had some champaign and she was wedged deep between the brothahs legs. They seem happy. I ain't mad. Still won't change my story but I ain't mad. Should he have kicked it with Brandi? She might have been trippin'. Like "Fool, I'm worth 15 million my damn self so don't trip". Now rub my back. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/rolleyes.gif That's her rollin' her eyes. LOL
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Who knows how I can get the picture off of his e-mail and post it for others to see. I can't tell my boyfriend because I wasn't EXACTLY supposed to be looking at his mail. I know, I know.
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BRAVO BRAVO DELTABRAT. YOU SPEAK IT LIK IT IS GIRL. PEOPLE DO NOT LIKE WHEN I TYPE IN CAPS SO THAT MAKES WHAT IS SAY STILTED AND IGNORANT. I AM LIKE WHATEVER! I SUPPOSE YOU ARE A BUT NICER BUT MY POST STARTED OFF NICE THEN SOME STARTED POSTING REALLY OFF TH WALL STUFF BUT STILL THEY GO WHAT THEY WANTED OUT OF IT! INSTEAD OF WHAT WAS THE TRUE MEANING OF WHAT I WAS SAYING SO I SUPPOSE THEY ARE DEALING WITH IT ANYWAY THEY CAN! I SAY WHATS ON MY MIND I TYPE IN CAPS WHEN IT IS IMPORTANT AND THATS THAT. I AM GLAD YOU ARE ON TOP OF THINGS! MUCH LOVE TO MY PEEPS
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