Amen.

Do you want to keep these women whose company that you enjoy as sisters that you love, that you can have fun with, that will be there for you in good times and in bad, that will be your future bridesmaids, etc?

Or do you want pretty, popular sisters who treat you like a pile of poop?

Let's just assume she was being sarcastic so we don't have to get upset........:D It would so ruin this little party we're having.

I'm assuming it was a "joke," but, even if it is, PEOPLE NEED TO STOP MAKING THE AI JOKE. IT ISN'T FUNNY. IT'S EVEN LESS FUNNY THAN PRETENDING TO EAT AND DRINK WHILE WATCHING A THREAD.

Have I told you lately that I love you? Have I told you there's no one else above you? Fills my heart with gladness... Takes away all my sadness...some words... That's what you do.

You are the wind beneath my wings on Wednesday, the official thread of being an idiot.

"Ease my troubles"

:D

Pass the popcorn and chicken wings.

The bar's also open. Anyone want anything? :)

Yeah, I snack while reading the boards anyway...why should it be special because someone is being an idiot on TEH INTARNETS!!!111ONE!

T, I think I love you.

THANK YOU! I was really trying hard to remember what the phrase was! It was driving me crazy.

For clarification purposes, Yes it was sarcasm.

Today I went to a wedding of a chapter sister and 6 of us surrounded her and sang. While in school (recently), our chapter was the fat girls who few fraternities wanted to associate with.

Guess what? Our sisterhood was strong because we fought for every member that came through our doors, fretted over the ones who inevitably quit for their various rediculous reasons such as reputations (that we usually concocted by stupid jealous people). We always lost video night and to the "good" chapters, but the women from my chapter were/are leaders! The chapter is now thriving, huge, with no "fat" girls to be seen! The women we fought to recruit in turn kept recruiting a higher standard.

Basically, you have a choice. Do you want to be a follower and follow all those flaky girls that quit because they were too concerned about their reps? Or do you want to stay, work hard, and change your chapter alledged (sp) repuation. Chances are your chapters repuation isn't as bad overall as you are hearing about.

Thank you sugar and spice for understanding my dilemma. For clarification to everyone else, I'm not looking down my nose at anyone, nor am I looking to be in a "better" house- I am just trying to figure out if being in a sorority that doesn't get a whole lot of respect from anyone on campus- neither the greeks nor nongreeks (my boyfriend of 2 yeras, a nongreek, has been making fun of me for joining a sorority at all) , is worht my money, which I must work (hard) to earn, in dues. Yes, I knew about dues before I rushed- maybe I just expected more. More parties, more time wiht my sisters. More people to meet. Probably, Greek life simply isn't for me. Also, to say that this is friendship vs. repuation and that I am shallow and care about what people think is inaccurate beucase I can't say I'm friends wiht anyone yet- the girls I knew better have already quit and I haven't had much interaction wiht the older members. If I knew the girls better and they felt like my sisters I would never have thought about depledging. I just feel like right now, I am payng money to have people from both sides look down on me and that I'm getting nothing in return.

I just read AxiDTrish's post and now am thinking maybe I just need to give it some time...it's been only a couple weeks, and I guess wiht more time I'll really get to know the girls....it WOULD be awesome to really be part of a sorority...the birthdays, the weddings that come after...

Mr. 1228 always thinks about the Greekchatters because he just made some hot wings! (handing a wing to Taualumna)...anyone else want some? We got some honey garlic wings too :)

I am chilling drinking a C2 but I would love to try the diet cherry vanilla DP...pass one here please :D

I think that you should make an effort to spend time with the sisters in addition to the new members. Get to know them better by hanging out with them. If you aren't feeling the sisterhood, you can quit. Just give it some time.

I agree......

My problem is that she keeps mentioning the money being "worth it" . monetary issues should have NOTHING to do with your decision to stay or not to stay IMO. (unless you really are struggling to pay)

I also have to add, While the chapter should be making an effort to make you feel welcome and offer oppotunities for everyone to get to know each other, why not call up a few older sisters and have lunch, or just go shopping or something ? Talk to your big sis about everything, maybe she can tell the active sisters that there needs to be more events to get to know the new women.

ok . . I read through the posts and I see two major popints of view.

1. You should stay in your current chapter regardless of its social power because friendship is the most important thing and that friendship should transcend whether you have a good time or not.

2. You are joining an organization that has a social function and that you should quit if its actually going to limit you or hurt you socially.

Oh and there are the fixer up people . . but thats barely worth considering unless you are the type of person that owns the entire Time Life home Improvement Series.

Here is my take.

You are joining a social organziation. Its an organization where its major purpose is create social opportunities for you.

And remember, all you Politically Correct optimists out there, not all chapters on a campus are created equal. And the chapter you pick can dramatically affect your college experience. Everything from how much you party, to how many guys you get to choose from for your love interests, to even how much community service you do.

So why join an organization that limits you socially over ones that provide more opportunities?

'Cause here is the big truth, you are going to make friends in either type of chapter.

So why not try for the chapter that gives the best options and make friends there?

If you have decent social skills you will always make friends whether you join a good chapter, bad chapter, or don't join at all.

So if the chapter is going to limit you socially even more than being an independant would, don't join.

I disagree that it's unrealistic to think one can improve a chapter's reputation. Otherwise, by that logic, these groups should fold up their tents and call it a day. Indeed, it is tough, but it *is* possible. However, most people don't care enough to work for it.

I work with a sorority at UT - Austin. I know what a competitive campus it is. I know reputations are ingrained -- and, I might add, undeserved.

I think the bottom line is: How much do you want to be Greek? How important is it to you? Ultimately, you're a sorority member for life -- not just these four years. Giving up membership means forfeiting the amazing lifetime benefits that come with it. Can you see beyond the labels -- labels that are probably untrue anyway?

I do agree that if you're going to be miserable and self-conscious because of a label affixed to this group, you should quit. However, if looking objectively at your sisters, you see the label doesn't fit; if you see that it's faulty, why not proudly don your letters and prove everyone wrong?

Call me a Pollyanna. Call me "stupid" for thinking you can make a change. Call me a naive idealist. I am not trying to be any of those things. I know where you're coming from -- I was Greek at a competitive Big 12 school. I know what it's like. I know how great houses with sweet beautiful girls can be wrongly labeled. I also know that none of these labels and other BS will matter a damn four years from now. Whatever their reputations at UT, the sororities there are wonderful national/international groups -- groups you can be proud to be a member of for the rest of your life.

Drop out....pledges like you are devestating to a chapter who is struggling.

Sounds like your boyfriend's a problem then. Any boyfriend, especially one who you've been with for 2 years, shouldn't make fun of you for a decision to join a sorority.

No matter your reasons for joining, it IS hard to be a member of "that sorority" - no matter how much you may love the house. It's hard to hear people say to you "Oh, you're a Kappa? But you're not fat!" and to have girls not even give you half a chance during recruitment because the girls in their Rho Chi group say "Kappa doesn't drop anyone, why would you want to be a part of that?" It's hard and it's upsetting - even more so when you love the house and know the women in it are absolutely amazing and it's so frustrating when other people don't realize that - they just see that your chapter is smaller than the others and has members that are bigger than a size 4.

I'm just rambling... but yes. Reputations can be extremely harsh and undeserved, and people have a hard time getting past them. But the reputations can change over time, and you can either stay in the chapter and work to change the reputation, or you can drop out and help keep that reputation going. Do what you think is best.

"I do not see the point of paying dues if association with the sorority will only give me a bad repuation around campus."
Is thist all you can see your sorority or your association with it "giving you"? How shortsighted, and wrong, of you.

First of all, realize that there are people like me out here from your org that if they find out who you are after you've made such horrible comments about them, you won't have to make the decision whether or not to quit - they'll make it for you.

Second - reputations vary from campus to campu. I attended a school 3 hours from my present campus, and they had 3 of the same sororities. It's amazing how differently they were perceived on each campus. My point - There will come a day when someone will say, "You're an XYZ? They were one of the top houses at my school!"

Third - college lasts for 4 years (ideally). Your membership is for life, which means you have sisters everywhere that came from so many different backgrounds, chapters, etc. Concentrate on that.

Work your tail off in your chapter, and go love your sisters. If you want to stick around here, my advice would be to change your username and never allude to your "My sorority is the loser sorority" posts ever again.
Your other option is to do them the favor of quitting.

Sorry my post is less than sugary sweet, but I'm sure there are quality women who went through recruitment at your school would have loved your sorority that didn't get a bid. Suck it up a change your attitude.

Its my opinion that if you feel you joined a "loser" sorority you are doing the girls a disservice just by being there. Thay are basically wasting their time on you. I'm sure they'd rather have 1 less pledged member than a half assed pledge that will either drop before initiation or right after. They obviously want to better their chapter, and your negativity and probably trash talking about the org won't help. They probably have a great sisterhood that you've already poisoned yourself against. Too bad you missed out.

EXACTLY!! THANK YOU.

Word to all of James's post. All of you who are preaching about eternal sisterhood blah blah blah -- you can find that in or outside of a sorority. During my college career, the people I've developed (what will probably become) lifelong friendships with did not just come from my sorority. They came from other organizations I joined, the dorm I lived in -- hell, some of them aren't even in college.

What you have to look at is what sororities can offer your social life that those other friends can't. And the problem is that there are some schools where being in a "bottom tier" group isn't worth it to some people when they know they can find similar opportunities elsewhere. You have to ask yourself if it's really worth it to pay a thousand bucks a semester to have two mixers that aren't even that fun, to get judged for your choices by everyone around you, and to have people you don't even know assume you're fat even though you're a size 4. If you know you can make good friends/have eternal sisterhood blahblahblah elsewhere, why put yourself through that?

wow I am also amazed at how cival this discussion has been.
I just want to point out that if this person is for real, she probably has some serious self-esteem issues.
1) you should never let a guy or anyone else tell you how to live your life.

Joining a sorority just like everything else in life has positives and negatives. I personally went through recruitment on a whim as a sophmore. I didn't know anything about sororities other than the obvious media images. But the girls all seemed really nice and I wanted to meet new people. now five years later I am so glad that I joined! I have made some of my best friends, and I have amazing memories.
Now you can make memories and have a great college expirance without joining a sorority. and you can do the same being in a sorority
But no matter what you decide to do you need to be happy. But understand that this is your decision. Either pick yourself up and put your all in to enjoying and being a real sister. or leave!

You know, crunchies, I get what you're saying. I'm not going to jump down your throat or anything, because I realize that to some people the social aspect is one of the most, if not the most, important reasons for joining a sorority. There's nothing wrong with that. But I really think you should give it a shot before you decide to depledge--and by that I mean really give it a chance by getting to know the members, trying to change your way of thinking so you don't view your sorority as "that" sorority, and just simply having fun with it.

As for what others have said about working to change your chapter's reputation...in all honesty, I don't know if you can change the reputation of your chapter, at least in a time span of only a couple years. My chapter was the smallest when I joined because it had just been recolonized, so a lot of rushees didn't even consider it and we didn't mix with the "top" fraternities. Five years later, we're still considered "middle-tier" at best even though we can compete with the top sororities on numbers, looks, grades, activities, etc. What I'm saying is that it can be a lot harder than it looks to change the campus' perception of a certain chapter, but that didn't make a damn bit of difference to me because I still had the time of my life. I had way more fun and social opportunities than I would've had otherwise. Being in a chapter that's not top-tier is not the end of the world. Sure, you might not have date parties with the "hot" fraternities, but I've found that it's usually the guys in the smaller fraternities who are nicest and treat you the best, and make you feel like they want to hang out with you as opposed to just gracing you with their oh-so-cool presence. Even after my chapter moved up, so to speak, I still preferred the fraternities that we'd mixed with in the beginning. And are you sure it's everybody who thinks your chapter is the "loser" sorority, or just the girls who've depledged?

you forgot the drink with it!

http://www.handykult.de/plaudersmili...arty/pepsi.gif

Or, better yet...

http://www.planetsmilies.com/smilies.../party0008.gif

This is seriously the most pathetic thing I've seen. Who would want anyone in their org that is this insecure based on stupid perceptions? What matters is that friendships & bonds that are formed & not the reputation your org is deemed as having by people on that campus. Ummm HELLO??? Every org has their strong & not so strong chapters. Perceptions of orgs change from campus to capmus. I know that on some campuses, Sigma Kappa is a top house while on others, it's not. I just can't believe that people would be so lame as to worry so much about being the "loser" sorority. To me, it is simply in the eye of the beholder.

And this is exactly how you are completely missing the point. It is in the eye of the beholder. Exactly. Go ahead and sit there on your high horse (and why not enjoy some of this virtual popcorn that everybody thinks is funny enough to post about 900 times) and judge someone because she has different priorities and desires when it comes to sorority membership. Hey, it's great that you think friendship is the most important thing about sorority membership. Maybe you'd be happy to hang around with a bunch of dorks who are outcasts on campus. GOOD FOR YOU, but you're out of line to call someone out for wanting something different. IT'S IN THE EYE OF THE BEHOLDER. People want different things. How does it matter if the OP's organization is hotter than festering poo on other campuses if she isn't there? It doesn't -- and it doesn't matter that you or anybody else thinks her concerns are lame or pathetic or whatever.

No. I think you're the one missing the point. Everyone gets all high & mighty in the Rush threads and tells PNM's that they should always walk in with an open mind & not judge a sorority until they've gotten to know them. Now you're telling this girl that it's o.k. to want to leave her GLO b/c she doesn't want to be in the "loser" sorority? Ummm...yeah. That makes perfect sense. Go into rush with an open mind but feel free to depledge w/out giving it a chance b/c someone else thinks you are in the "loser" sorority. :rolleyes:
If she wants to quit it's perfectly fine especially if she's unhappy w/her current situation but don't you find it hypocritical to tell PNM's to have an open mind then turn around and tell a NM to drop if she doesn't want to be labeled a "loser" along w/her GLO.

Well, I never tell anybody to have an open mind because I think that's one of those stupid things people say that really doesn't mean anything. Every woman has a different reason for wanting to join a sorority, and I frankly don't give a rat's ass if she has an open mind or not if she's doing whatever is right for her.

This has been quite civil so far! Having said that I love Diet Cherry Vanilla Dr. Pepper. It's so yummy...!

Something I've always remembered that you may need to know is "You get out what you put in". If you don't like the so called reputation, then get out there and make a difference and start changing it. Sisterhood is for life. They are your sisters and you need to work at getting to know them better. It's give and take... Stick with it and become involved instead of coming here so quickly after pledging and whining about being in a loser sorority with no social life. I don't mean to be harsh, but really... :rolleyes:

As someone who went to The University of Texas, I can honestly say that those in the top tier group, don't realize that there is anyone below them, much less care about making fun of them. So, out of all the groups, it's probably the ones that compete with your chapter for NM's that say crappy things. Of course their competing for many of the same girls so a lot of it's bitter grapes.

As for the frats there are like a zillion of them and it changes from year to year, who's hot and who's not. I don't think Beta is even on campus there anymore and they were one of the best groups when I was there. Things change.

Also, in a campus of 50,000 students, which for a lot of students is bigger than the town they grew up in, how many of them do you really think are looking down their nose at your? Most could care what greek letters some girl walking down the drag or through the six-pack is wearing. Most aren't going to know what group it is anyway.

Because of all these things, it seems that the problem is more that women that you liked in your new member class have depledged. Their decision is influencing yours. From your posts you have said that you haven't spoken/gotten to know many "older" sisters. I don't know if you mean seniors, women older than yourself or women that are already in the chapter. It is just as much your obligation to meet them as it is theirs to meet you. If you are attending chapter meetings, new member meetings, going to chapter dinners etc., unless you are staying only with your new member group and not mixing in with the "older" sisters, I don't understand how you can not be getting to know them.

From the chapters point of view, they know what you're thinking. They know if you're not coming around or decline invitations to go out with your sisters. They know if you aren't going to meetings etc. And they are wondering if you're going to quit. In a "smaller" chapter, things like this are much more apparent than in a" bigger" chapter. Just FYI - total at UT is 150 (unless they have changed it this year). I believe the "smallest" group is 100 and the "biggest" in the 200 range. So, small is not so small.

Utlimately, this is your decision, but make it for the right reasons. Don't have the money to pay? The sisters will understand. But if it's because you don't feel the sisterhood and haven't made an effort or because you are worried that you are in a "loser" sorority. Then leave. The chapter has enough going on without their own members buying into and/or perpetuating stereotypes about them.

I believe that every sister can make a difference in their chapter, but maybe you're just not up to doing that. Some members don't want to put a lot into their chapters, they just want to have a good time.

You just need to decide if you want to be a sister rather than just a member or if you don't want to be either.

CRUNCHIES, this is one of the sorriest Threads I have ever seen.:(

You either decided to join this Greek Organization knowing full well what was ahead of You. You were either In or not, true?

There must have been a reason that You joined.:rolleyes:

Now to jump up and speak badly really throws a bad light some where.

"IF" You are the type of Person You profess to be, and do not like The GLO, either Leave or try to change for the better.

SCREW YOUR BOY FIEND> He sounds like a dick head anyway!

Again, if the whole Campus was talking about This Organizatin, then why did YOu join knowing the reputation that You saw?

Get in and make a change if You can or get the heck out!

No Chapter makes a Total Sorority/Fraternity.

Being that I have only read the original post, I will post the following:

1) If a reputation is partly important to you (which it sounds like it is at least *part* of the reason you are considering leaving), you're in for a treat in the Greek world :) Every sorority on every campus will have a reptuation. Some are good (i.e. the sorority that has a reputation for making a GPA of 3.9 every semester and beating the All-Greek, All-Women's, etc. avg. GPA) and some are bad (i.e. the sorority that always parties, etc). Many times "reputations" are not really deserved and sometimes they are just mean things that people say.

2) Sorority life is a 2-way street. You can't expect to magically become best friends with all 100 (or however many) women in your chapter. You have to spend time with them to build the bonds. Why not show a little initiative and call up some of your new member sisters and get together? Maybe you and your new member sisters can have a get together with them and all of their big-sisters. Why not call up your big sister and suggest you order a pizza and watch a movie. While it is true that they are the "active sisters" sometimes school, work, whatever gets overwhelming and maybe forget some of the little things like calling up the new girls and just asking to hang out. Show some initiative. You only get out of Greek life what you put into it. If you sit around and wait for something to happen, you are just going to be become unhappy, mad, and want to leave.... like I said, show some initiative. Maybe you can move into the sorority house? It's a lot of fun and great way to build relationships w/ ppl.

It takes some time to get completely comfortable in a new environment. I joined Delta Sigma Pi (business) and ADPi at different times in my college career. When I joined DSP, at first it was really strange for me. I felt like I didn't know anyone in the chapter, but after awhile, I made some bonds w/ people and it was all great. Then I transferred schools and even though I was already an initatiated member of DSP, when I joined the new chapter, I felt strange all over again. Like I said, it takes awhile to adjust. Then junior year (I transferred after my soph. year) I joined ADPi and I felt the same way all over again. All three times, I adjusted, made friends w/ people and enjoyed college life. It didn't happen overnight.

3) You said "any help would be greatly apprecaited". No one can really help you make this decision. It is all you. You have 2 options: you can stay where you are or depledge and try joining another house. You may or may not get into another house, but that's just one of the risks (for lack of better terms). Since you mentioned the school was Texas, there is a possiblity of their system having "free upperclassmen" during FR, but I think those spots are few and far between. I don't know a lot about Texas rush, but I hear it is very competitive.

4) If you do decide to stay, use your membership as an opportunity to try to help out the sorority. Take an office. Get involved. Is it possible that your chapter is just really overworked from doing continuous recruitment and people are weary from taking on 2 offices to keep the chapter running? Maybe the sorority just needs a few good women to be excited about turning things around to help it succeed.

That's just my take on it though :)

Agreed -- I think a lot of people are just not being realistic here. I went to a school that is by no means as competitive as Texas. Even here, it is very difficult to change a chapter's reputation -- it takes many, many years. There are a couple of sororities here that have reputations as the "fat" chapters because 10 or 20 years ago they were smaller groups that took the bigger girls. Now they have fewer plus-size girls than most of the middle-tier or even some of the highest-tier groups that are regarded as uniformly beautiful, but they still suffer from the rep. If someone gave you photographs of every sorority and asked you to pick out which one was regarded as the fat chapter, I bet you couldn't do it.

Now fortunately my school is one of those schools where basically every fraternity will mix with every sorority, so every sorority has a pretty active social life. The only time a sorority ever really has trouble with their social lives is when they're on probation. I don't think any group really suffers all that much because of reputation. This is not the case everywhere.

There are too many people who assume that suffering from a bad reputation on campus has no effect on the individuals in that group. For these people, I will once again reference my friend that joined the "fat" chapter at a competitive Southern school because she loved the girls. The way her chapter was treated within the Greek system led to a relapse of the eating disorder that she suffered from in high school because she became convinced that she was fat even though she wasn't. Does this make her a weak, insecure person with no self-esteem? Maybe -- I won't argue that here. Do I think that joining the chapter she genuinely loved was worthwhile in her case? Not when it contributed to health complications that will follow her for the rest of her life. She ended up leaving the Greek system in order to focus on her health, and she only got better after she left the system that made her weight such a huge focus of her life. (And I understand how she feels because I ended up going early alum after Greek drama -- unrelated to reputation, but still unnecessarily petty -- began affecting my mental health and my grades.)

While "following your heart" and all that jazz is good stuff, that alone doesn't make it worth it. You have to weigh whether or not the benefits outweigh the drawbacks. As Greeks, we'd like to believe that they always do, but that's not the case.