I couldn't have said it better myself.

Case in point: the Tim situation. And I got Coach, Prada, Chanel sunglasses, Tiffany's, and a bunch of DVDs because I decided to steal the man. If I can do it, so can you.

DO IT NOW!

Since you're just trying to get married and settle down and have kids anyway, I think you should look elsewhere.

Can I emphasize that this is a hypothetical situation and that I hope all of you who are using "you" mean it in the editorial "you" sense? :-)

Anyway, I'm mostly of the school that thinks that flirting is fine (because I flirt with everyone for my own amusement), but probably would not going beyond that. I honestly do think that what goes around comes around, the Golden Rule, blah blah blah. I feel like I DO have an obligation to that other girl not to be an asshole. That said, I'm not always sure where "flirting" ends and "crossing the line" begins and sometimes that gets me into trouble. Haha.

I think valkyrie's point is interesting too. Nine times out of ten (okay, maybe just eight), I think you're wrong, T -- I think that how a guy treats one woman he's with tends to indicate a trend in how he treats most women that he's with. But I certainly don't think that's an unbreakable rule -- you have guys that mature, or learn from their mistakes, or you have guys that just aren't happy with the person they're with but would be with you, whatever. You should tread carefully with these people, but I don't think that they're entirely off-limits.

Everyone's ultimate goal (really at the core of it) is to find somebody to love and love them....even if that somebody was somebody else's somebody first...

so in the end, if you end up with them.....they cheat WITH you, they will cheat ON you.

Don't do it.

OK - I shouldn't let you ladies in on this, but I will. There are two types of 'cheating' for dudes -

1 - Habitual - the dude just cheats on every girl . . . this is the "because I can" cheating

2 - Situational - the dude is locked into something he's not ok with, and cheats as an outlet . . . possibly to break the relationship, possibly for other reasons . . . this is "because I can't" cheating (no further explanation there)

Also, who is assuming this is 'cheating'? Why can't you just 'steal' the dude in the sense of breaking him up w/ his sig other?

I don't know a single guy who goes "I'm gonna do this once and see what happens" or "I'm gonna do this once so I can end things will Sally Mae".

-Rudey

I see nothing wrong with flirting, either. There is a fine line with flirting and being improperly affectionate with someone, but I think most people are aware of when they cross it.

It depends on a lot of things -- how well you know the guy/girl and/or his/her s.o.; if you know what his/her happiness level is in the relationship; what their hotness level is (before and after a few drinks); how you're personally going to feel the next day were something to happen; where your personal motivation comes from; are either of you looking for more than a fun night. Each situation is going to be different.

As far as cheating goes, I don't believe in the "once a cheater, always a cheater" either. I think the Robmeister has it right -- there's habutial cheating (I cheat because I can--it doesn't matter who I'm with) and situational cheating (I cheat because this relationship sucks but I don't have the balls to end it myself, so I'll take the passive aggressive way out). Husband cheated on his long-time college girlfriend because she was a whiny, needy megabitch but at the time he thought that was the best he could do. That relationship finally ended because she eventually cheated on him and he finally got sick of her isht, but he knows if he were to ever do anything like that to me, we would be done. But he won't because I'm not a whiny bitch.

You're telling me you don't know anyone who's only cheated on one girlfriend?

No. But I know plenty of guys that have convinced the girls they were with that the previous girl was awful and that it would never happen again because their current girl is so great - that it is a one time thing.

The best is when the guy gets puntang/putti tang just to be reminded of how much he loves his girlfriend. The guilt afterwards is comparable to being a cutter - and he enjoys the relationship more.

-Rudey

Good point . . .

This might be my favorite thing in the world - it's related to my 'category 2' too, but I'm lazy so i'll leave it as a bizarre generalization like it is now.

The 'cutters' analogy is about right

In the case of situation #2, though, they have to go through some sort of "growing up" between the first relationship and the second. Habitual cheating involves the person "cheating because they can" (it's a trait that they have, etc.). In the second case, of situational cheating, the trait that the person has is not having balls. If you don't give them time to grow those balls, their cheating will be just as habitual as your example #1 -- because every relationship goes through its low points, the person's way of dealing with the bad times is still important. It's not as easy as "She's a bitch and you're not, so I won't cheat on you."

That's why people who say "If s/he will cheat with you, they'll cheat on you" are generally right. If you go straight from relationship #1 to relationship #2 with no time to reflect on what you did and make a change, your behavior will likely be the same in both relationships. What stops people from cheating in the later relationship is growing up and growing some balls, and that doesn't happen overnight.

EVERYBODY'S Workin 4 DA weekEND!

I can see what you're saying, but the s.o. does play a significant part. I mean, if you keep dating needy, whiny bitches then I can see where you're going to become a habitual cheater. But if you start dating someone with a different personality, you may not have those same type of low points because it's a different relationship. It may or may not be that you grew a pair, it's just that with a different person, things may be handled differently. Which leads to your second point:

Quote:

That's why people who say "If s/he will cheat with you, they'll cheat on you" are generally right. If you go straight from relationship #1 to relationship #2 with no time to reflect on what you did and make a change, your behavior will likely be the same in both relationships. What stops people from cheating in the later relationship is growing up and growing some balls, and that doesn't happen overnight.

But not everyone goes straight from one relationship to the next. Granted, I'm probably not the best person to be doling out relationship advice because out of the 4 boyfriends I dated, only one of them made it past three months and he's now my husband. I had a lot of fun and made out with a lot of boys during college (and I'm sure there was a time or two I was the other woman), but I didn't pursue a relationship unless I felt it was worth it, and usually it wasn't. (Saved a lot of stupid boy drama that way--I had enough from my roommate). Likewise, the husband had about a year or so to get over his ex, have fun, realize how shitty the relationship actually was and learn how to not do that with his subsequent gf, me. It helped that I'm the complete opposite of his ex. It doesn't mean we didn't/don't have issues from time to time, but we deal with them differently.

That's just me going from my own personal experience, which is probably not the norm, so...

LOL I don't think I've had a boyfriend who wasn't with someone when we met. I really, honestly don't think it makes a damn bit of difference, but hey, that's just me. I suppose technically the old man and I are both cheaters, so who knows what in the hell will happen. I don't think the fact that neither of us spent much/any time alone after our previous relationships before getting together means that we didn't learn anything. You can learn in any situation, whether you're dating or single.

When it comes down to it, there is no way to know whether the person you're with or will be with someday will cheat on you. I really don't see the point of worrying about it -- if it happens, deal with it, and it's not like worrying about it will make it any less traumatic if it does.

I think this is the first time I've ever agreed with Valkyrie on something.

Quick, someone talk about ISU vs. Iowa.