I think Rudey is right on target with how to handle the situation -- but perhaps for a different reason. A lot of people (like me) are concerned that their parents will be against their participation or won't want to spend the money (assuming the prospective pledge doesn't plan on paying himself). I think it's important for parents to understand not only the system, but the finances as well.

A couple of other comments -- first to the original thought. If parents are not Greek, they likely know nothing at all, or only the unfortunate things they read or hear about the system. The other thing is that for some parents, paying for a students Greek membership can be a strain. When I was an advisor, one of the biggest financial problems for the chapter was guys who pledged without telling their parents, and then couldn't pay the dues and initiation fee. We ended up with a "contract" that had to be signed by a parent for the younger pledges so they would know what their son was doing and how much it would cost.

Mrs. DA's situation was the same as many of yours, but with a major twist.

Her mom is an ADPi.

And she must have had a very hard experience with the sorority.

Her dad came from a farm family in which education was super important, but there was very little money, and it was the same in wife's family. He put all four of his kids through college (including one masters and one law degree) on a farm "salary." At one point, three of the four were in college at the same time.

They told Mrs. DA that if she pledged, she would never see another penny from them. They meant it. So, she didn't, although she did go thru rush just for the experience. Pi Phi, Chi-O and ADPi all wanted her. The day we met, I invited her to dinner, and she first said no because her family was sacrificing to pay for her room and board, and she didn't want to "waste" their money by not eating in the dorm -- believe it or not. She did change her mind that day, though.

Personally, since I was the first college student in my immediate family, nobody had any idea what the Greek System was about, although both my dad and grandfather were Masons. Since I had no intention of rushing, when I was personally invited and given a bid -- I just didn't say anything to anyone until I was home one weekend and my grandfather asked, "Is that some kind of fraternity pin," when he saw my pledge badge.

Do these "issues" generally come from students who are first generation university students or from parents who did not attend a school with a Greek system? I'd assume that if the parents went to say, U of T as well, that they might know something about it, especially since more people were Greek in the past (when did the number of Greeks at U of T drop, anyway?). In terms of "ethnic" students who are first generation Canadian, many of their parents don't even know what fraternities and sororities are. At Thanksgiving dinner this year, a man said that his daughter was living off campus and paying $X. I said that the cost sounded similar to living in a sorority house. He then looked at me funny and asked me what sororities are.

Finances factors into it of course.

I'm just a bit annoyed, because I'm a good closer. But in this case I really didn't have to be.

1) I can be proud of the fact that the brothers in our fraternity really do care about each other. We cared about the school and the community we were involved in and gave back to.

2) Although we have our fun we don't run a bar night every week or anything like that because not only is it not worth the risk, it's just not us. So no hardcore boozing or hazing here.

3) Grades were a big priority because we knew we were in college and one of the top colleges at that. We all helped other brothers because we knew sooner or later we'd need help ourselves.

4) After graduation, we all were successful. I mean seriously between law school, business school, med school, really lucrative jobs, etc. there wasn't much left to cover. So we had the results to show for it.

5) Finances. Dear parents money is never an issue for us with your son joining. We do make sure you know that this is a commitment. Something can be worked out.

You would think with all this said, the parents would sign off. But parents can have one-track minds for sure.

-Rudey

both of my parents are very anti-greek! actually most of my family is, with the exception of one aunt and uncle. even my grandpa is, and he was in a local fraternity out in oklahoma and part of the masons!!

so to say the least, when i was founding, i heard nothing but complaints about joining a sorority... and even to this day i still hear it.

but i brush it off, and do my own thing, because this is what i want to do, and what i enjoy doing.

i don't really have any advise for you, other than to try and give the parents more of an understanding that it's more than just parties and drinking.

good luck!

I think my parents were initially frustrated with the amount of time I committed to the sorority. My grades never faltered, I worked to support myself and pay for school, and so I was pretty much my own person.

During my first year, I simply would not miss a chapter meeting for anything, and I think my parents viewed it as cultlike that I wouldn't come home for a birthday... "But I'll miss chapter!" I relaxed as time went on and so did they-- what really won them over was when they FINALLY came up to school for Parent's Weekend. ADPi had lots of family activities planned, and my mother cried when I presented her with our "Mother's Pin" at the annual mother-daughter brunch, and we all serenaded our moms.

All of these are great points.

Frankly, every chapter out there should try to emphasis them with perhaps number 4 being the key point to emphasis.

When a chapter can point to the success of their alumni and tie it back to their experience as a member, then that *should* be the closer.

And this should be stressed not only to parents, but to all rushees (PNMs) as well.

Well many are yes from the first generation to attend a school with a greek system, or are just first generation of their family to attend university. Having had parents that attended UofT in the past may or may not be a benefit there was quite a bit of negative press and sentiment regarding the greeks back in the 60s, 70s, and even 80s around UofT.... as for when the numbers dropped basically the 60s and 70s... although it was also a continuation of a trend as enrollment increased, but at one time 1/3 of all males were greek at UofT... now it's closer to 1/300 or worse. I have noticed that the vast mahority of students and parents don't know that GLOs exist in Canada... so the first step is letting them know they exist - and then countering the negative preconceptions that they have taken from the media....

The sudden drop in the 60s and 70s must have to do with the "anti-establishment" attitude. The senior school (Grade 7-high school graduation) students at my old school were divided into 8 teams, all based on Greek letters (I think they were as follows: Alpha, Gamma, Delta, Epsilon, Theta, Kappa, Lambda and Sigma.). However, the Greek letters were retired in the 69-70 (or maybe it was 70-71) school year, and replaced by names of historical figures important to the school.

i grew up with my mom calling the sorority women that came into the bagel shop she worked in on the UT campus not so nice names.

and when i told her i was going through rush she called me one too. she's lightened up a bit though, after ive told her about some things. now she doesn't use that awful term and she actually wears an adpi mom shirt.

dad grew up with very greek parents, so he's always been cool with it.

they were both raised in the 60/70s and my mom and i were talking about it one time and she said "yknow its the time when we were raised, and it was a time when that was kind of looked down upon, and i was conditioned to think that the people who joined were all spoiled brats that had their daddies pay for everything."
so i agree that for some people it has to do a lot with their generation.

I did have one mom that was incredibly against her son joining a fraternity. However, she was a special case. She was the secretary for the Dean of Students for ~20 years. She sat in on many discipline hearing brought on by fraternity hazing. She said she saw/heard too much to ever let her son join. But if he wanted to, I am sure nothing she could do would stop him. I really did not feel right trying to convince her. She had also seen the great young men the system had produced, but the thoughts of what she heard about in those meetings overshadowed that.

Being the first in a large overall family, I was the first to attend college, so all of the relatives were proud of me.

I got booted out of first college and did not go to the Military during Nam. Bad knees.

Went to another College and Pledged a local.. Did not tell my parents but wore the pledge pin home. They asked me what it was and told them. Money was of course a worry, but I flat told them it was my money period. Werent happy but went along.

Got booted out from that Fraternity after they affiliated with a Old Large National.

Started my own local and they just looked at me, like are You Friggen Crazy, but worked my ass off all summer designing everything and saw my determination, they just said we think you are nuts, but good luck.

Well, they met a bunch of the guys and we were affiliated at the end of the school year with LXA. Who or what is that they asked? Well, I gave them a history and they were impressed.

While My Mother has been long passed, I know she was proud of what I did and My Father who is still alive is equally proud. When they would come to School for functions, they were treated with such respect, that all of the Guys considered them second parents.

Then, many years later, a young man, named J H Associated with My Chapter agains His parents wishes but did any way. West Kansas Farmers and hard workers all. He became Our High Alpha (President), and the year of His Graduation, they came back for Founders Day and as all of us were standing on the deck at the House this car with Kansas dirt all over it pulled into the lot. This couple got out and walked up to the deck. I introduced myself and asked if I could help them.

Yes is J H here? Of course, I said, and asked some one to get J. While I introduced them around, J came out and was floored to see them.

They said in front of all of us, many Alums and Actives included said, "Son, We are very Proud of you and have brought you something for Graduation".

Well, of course we all crowded around to see what his gift was.


It was a Gold LXA Badge with Emeralds in the Lambda. It was not cheap back then and I about fell out like all of us did knowing the circumstances of Js Association and the cost of it.

We all started crying as I am doing now just thinking about it.

I dont know if they were embarresed, but said, well, we just wanted to give this to you as We are so proud of you and what you have done and with these fine young men that you are with.

With that, they said they had to drive back home to tend to the crops. As much as we pleaded with them to stay, they could not. It was a special moment far all of us.

Today, J H is a member of the US Army and going to Iraq in Jan.

I had the pleasure of seeing Him at Homecomeing as He could not be back for Founders Day in Feb.

Parents not being for Greek Affiliation, well, I hope some show this to parents.

We do not buy Friends, We gain Friends and so much more. I along with many others have been doing this for years while others who were just students go away never to be heard from again.