Re: Re: Men and Committment
 

Yeah...it is not that deep...TLAW some of us have just decided that AS OF RIGHT NOW...men are not worth the headache. It is all to the good though, it is not a permanent thing!

http://marriage.rutgers.edu/



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Study: 'Guys can afford to wait to marry'
June 27, 2002 Posted: 11:19 AM EDT (1519 GMT)






NEW YORK (Reuters) -- It's official. Men really are afraid of commitment.

Confirming what women have long known, an American study released on Wednesday shows men are dragging their feet on getting married.

Researchers say one of the biggest reasons that men are delaying marriage is that more and more couples are choosing to live together before marriage. As a result, sex -- traditionally one of the main reasons for men to marry -- is relatively easily available, they say.

"In a sense, with cohabitation he gets a quasi-wife without having to commit," said David Popenoe, co-director of the National Marriage Project at Rutgers University in New Jersey.

"Another big thing in addition to cohabitation is that these men are very, very concerned about divorce. It's not getting your heart broken ... the worst thing that could happen is that somebody could take their money," Popenoe adds.

The preliminary findings report on the attitudes toward marriage of 60 unmarried, heterosexual men, between the ages of 25-33. The participants, from different religious, ethnic and family backgrounds, were from four major metropolitan areas in northern New Jersey, Chicago, Houston, and Washington, D.C.

Researchers say both men and women are putting off getting married. The average age for men's first marriage is now 27, the oldest in history, the study shows. That compares to the average age of 23 in 1960, Popenoe said.

For women, the average age of their first marriage has risen to 25, a full five years older than the 1960 average.

And giving women even more reason to be impatient that their boyfriends are dragging their feet, researchers say the trend favors the men.

"Guys can afford to wait to marry. The older they get, the better their chances in some ways of getting married, while for women it's the reverse," Popenoe said.

"Once a woman gets into her 30s, it's more likely that she will have to marry a man who was married earlier. It's more likely that she will marry a man who brings kids (into the marriage) and more likely that she will have a child by herself," Popenoe says.

Ideal & Strawberry,

I'm with y'all-DISCOURAGED! Most of y'all know that I live in Minnesota. Not only are the men scared of commitment, they're scared to ask you to dance at First Fridays?! :confused: I'm still shook on that one. There is no point in looking, we might as well make OURSELVES the bomb so when God blesses us with someone, we'll be totally ready!

P.S. Ideal, I know you really know what I'm talking about...we won't go back to Valentine's Day '02...

You know what, and while I'm at it, I gotta question. Why is it that every guy that is trying to holla at me 1) married 2) at least, ten years my senior 3) has about three children by two different women 4)straight GARBAGE 5) has been married at least two times?! C'mon now!

I'm getting frustrated...so that's why I'm DISCOURAGED!

Being a St Paul native, I refuse to believe that all the Minn brothers are that bad! Still, all your arguments can be flipped, you know. Not all women instil the need to settle down in men, and some are just downright scandalous. Same principle applies: Do not settle. There are good people, who can fulfill most of your desires. Now, I believe pursuit of Mr 100% Perfect is unreasonable, and some people are just impossible to satisfy. What are those attributes that you consider reasonable?

Who are we talkin' about here? Who is supposed to instill in men to settle down? His mama? Cuz I know you ain't talkin' about his girl. We do dang near everything but beg for our ring!!! LOL! I think that's a message that needs to come from a man. I don't know, don't get me started on this, please, lol.

As far as some women being scandalous, it's a reason they got that way. Just like there are reasons why men cheat (Michael Baisden's book was the bomb). Vicious cycle, vicious cycle. *SIGH* Will the circle ever be unbroken?

And then it's like... what part do you settle on? I mean, what part of the relationship is not that important? If you find a hard working man who doesn't do as well on his night job, then what? Or if you find a man who works the hell outta his night job but is a buster, then what? Or he is well educated but is a womanizer? Or he is uneducated but hard working yet feels intimidated by your education? Or he is easy to talk to but is unmotivated and has no drive? Can I PLEASE get the total package?? My ex told me that I wanted it ALL and I can't have it ALL. Why not? :(

Then, when we're not discouraged, and we want a commitment, and we're looking for it, we are seen as desperate. WTF??? So, d*mn all that. I'm cool with me, and I'm going to kick it for a while.

Del, don't make ME go back to Birthday '02. Busters, I swear, lol.

TLAW...based SOLELY on your posts, I would say you are a pretty good man. Unfortunately, you are an exception. NOW...do not read that to mean that there are no good men. What I mean is that you seem to grasp the concept that most men, and WOMEN for that matter, cannot until they have lived a while. It is maturity.

It is also mature, in my opinion, to realize it when you are not fully prepared to commit to someone else. That is how I feel right now.

Why is it the woman's responsibility to instill a need to settle down? It is each individuals responsibility to instill/determine when they are ready to settle down.

Attributes that are reasonable? Explain. Like are you asking for ideal characteristics in a mate?

Like you said earlier, being picky is not a bad thing. Settling down does not mean settling for .

Well, thank you, Libra! *blushes*. Me and you go a lil ways back on Greekchat, don't we?
Anyways, I did not mean to imply that it was a woman's responsibility to make her man want to settle down. What I meant was that some women are just as bad, and make men want to run away. Like you said Ideal, it is a vicious cycle.
My humble words of advice are concepts you guys have already figured out: do not settle. And like Libra said, do not settle for .

Tlaw,

What's up fellow Minnesotan! It's great to meet others from the state. Maybe I'm having a problem because I'm a native of Mississippi and moved here...don't know. But, to respond to your comment about the brothas in Minnesota, let me tell you it is that bad. I don't know how bad it's been since you've visited, but trust, this is definitely the real deal.

Agreeing on what Libra said, it's apparent that you're an extremely cool brotha, which definitely makes you an exception! True, there are some scandalous sistas out there, but I know that I'm not one. In your last post you stated for us not to settle...that's exactly what so many of us women don't do and that's why we feel discouraged. That's all I'm saying.

What are we defining as commitment? GEtting married? Getting married is NO definite way to know that your man is committed. Do not be discouraged my sisters/sorors! There are plenty of good men out there! I think with the divorce rate as high as it is maybe it is time for BOTH men and women to revaluate how they take commitment. Men be true to what you do. Women if you are not getting what you want move on.

Sphinxpoet

No doubt.

There are some chicks that make men want to run away. That was my point initially, that there are parties on both sides who are at fault.

To me, here is the bottom line: People are SO worried about others that they forget to concentrate on themselves. That is why some folks are a mess today. When women worry so much about why this man is wrong and that man is wrong, they are neglecting to focus on what might be wrong with THEM.

As for me, I am still trying to get to know myself. I think I would be doing a man a disservice by trying to get him to committ to me before I can even committ to myself, feel me?

Good point...I think that marraige is simply an EXPRESSion of committment.

Committment itself is more of an acknowledged bond, and a willingness to sacrifice yourself for aother person.

Being a "husband" or "wife" is nothing more than a label. Being a "committed partner" in a relationship is something that doesn't necessarily require marriage.

Well said, Sphinxpoet, Librasoul and Delp. Well said! I like your concepts Libra. Get to know yourself. And there are good people out there. Sometimes, I think our sistahs our guilty of looking in the wrong places.And yes, being a spouse is nothing but a label, albeit a srious legal one. What I mean is, I've heard people imply that they'll change their ways once they get married to the person. Heard about the leapords and his spots?

How and why is marriage and divorce the only benchmarks that we have when measuring commitment? Is that why society puts such an emphisis on getting married? Do sisters really think there is a shortage of men or just there is a shortage of men that can deal with you and your specific issues? Just a question or 2?

Sphinxpoet

Marraige and divorce..we have been socialized to think that we need some sort of ceremony to validate our feelings/committment. I *personally* do not feel it necessary, but that is another thread.

Shortage of men? Being real here: I think there is a shortage of men who meet certain qualifications that women are looking for. Every woman looks for something different in a man, so don't ask me what those qualifications are...I can only tell you what mine are.

Both, Sphinxpoet. Statistically, I know that there are more women than men, especially African American women and men. When I take a mental note of the things that I would like for my significant other to possess, I know that there's a huge shortage. I'll add more later.