Canadian Chapters and Alcohol Policies

[Siobhan]

I am just curious how Canadians find all these new alcohol polcies considering 90-100% of our chapters are legally allowed to consume alcohol.

[Lil_G]

Making fraternity houses go dry in Canada doesn't make any sense. In ontario, most students who finish O.A.C. are legally old enough to drink. Because of this, we do not have under-age house drinking; unlike in the states.

Not allowing 20 somethings' to drink in their own house is stupid as hell. If chapters abide to no alcohol rush policies, then I don't see any problems.

[33girl]

I remember bringing up that point to someone when all this alcohol-free brouhaha got started. I know our policies used to say that we would follow the "state and local laws" regarding alcohol - I'm sure most national sororities were similar. It will be interesting to see if it has an effect on Canadian expansion.

By the way, what's O.A.C.?

[gphi2k]

Originally posted by Lil_G:
Making fraternity houses go dry in Canada doesn't make any sense. In ontario, most students who finish O.A.C. are legally old enough to drink. Because of this, we do not have under-age house drinking; unlike in the states.

Not allowing 20 somethings' to drink in their own house is stupid as hell. If chapters abide to no alcohol rush policies, then I don't see any problems.

yah, i totally agree. only two houses on our campus are dry and no one wants to have exchanges with them. it's sad but true. we are ALL legal pretty much. and if we're not, then usually those who are underage will be of age within three months.
it's a touchy subject cause we're extensions of the u.s. houses and we can change our bi-laws but the alcohol laws are handed down by I.H. so it's not easy to get around. But I've asked the same question myself.

As for OACs, they are Ontario Acedemic Credits. They're taken as a grade 13, (sucks) and you have to take 6 to get into university. The schools take the average of your best 6s oacs and consider acceptance on those grades ALONE (except for Mcgill which looks at previous years).

hope that answers your question.

leslie

[gphi2k]

Originally posted by Lil_G:
\Not allowing 20 somethings' to drink in their own house is stupid as hell. If chapters abide to no alcohol rush policies, then I don't see any problems.

Sorry, two messages...hehe. I agree that it's dumb, but it's also a liability issue. Insurance is lower with a no-alcohol policy. So it's better for the house corp. board if there is no booze allowed....

[shadokat]

Do Canadian Greeks have the same problems though as their U.S. counterparts? I mean, are there deaths from drinking, hazing through drinking during pledging, or any of the awful tragedies we read about all too often here in the states?? If there isn't, then I'd say you follow your laws, which are certainly more important than a policy.

------------------
Delta Phi Epsilon, Celebrating nearly 84 years of Dedication, Pride and Excellence!

[gphi2k]

Originally posted by shadokat:
Do Canadian Greeks have the same problems though as their U.S. counterparts? I mean, are there deaths from drinking, hazing through drinking during pledging, or any of the awful tragedies we read about all too often here in the states?? If there isn't, then I'd say you follow your laws, which are certainly more important than a policy.

No. You never hear about that kind of stuff here. Never. There is hazing. I know that much. But deaths from hazing or drinking? Not as far as I know. At least not at this end of the country. What about the westerners??

[Lil_G]

Originally posted by shadokat:
Do Canadian Greeks have the same problems though as their U.S. counterparts? I mean, are there deaths from drinking, hazing through drinking during pledging, or any of the awful tragedies we read about all too often here in the states?? If there isn't, then I'd say you follow your laws, which are certainly more important than a policy.

HELL NO, I have never heard of any of that happening anywhere in Canada. The age difference in alcohol is a completely different social environment for us. Take my school for example (the University of Ottawa), we have about 40 bars/clubs within walking distance of campus. There isn't a huge need to go to a fraternity keggar.

Also, because alcohol has been available to us more much earlier than in the states, there isn't this macho of older guys making first year students drink as much as they can.

Another point is that the greek system operates without funding (for most schools) from the institution, so keg parties are an important source of revenue which would be lost if we were forced to go dry.

Lastly, because we are Canadian-Greeks we already have enough adversity to deal with; if the public heard about something like that happening, holy $hit we would be in trouble!

[Siobhan]

It is beyond me how this alcohol policies are goingt to work, the one fraternity that has gone dry is suffering.

At UBC we have 3 pubs/bars on campus!!!

As far as problems with drinking and hazing such a problem just doesn't exist like they do in the US. It is very hard to swallow because where do your International policies override federal and provincial law. In my sorority we were told our new members coudln't come out to party and drink with us - how do you tell someone they can't do something they are legally allowed to do!? The greek system in Canada is already faltering.



[This message has been edited by Siobhan (edited March 09, 2001).]

[gphi2k]

Originally posted by Lil_G:
\
Another point is that the greek system operates without funding (for most schools) from the institution, so keg parties are an important source of revenue which would be lost if we were forced to go dry.

That's what I thought too. Don't know about out west but frat parties here lose money 99% of the time. They charge relatively low covers because they want the party to be as populated as possible. They say they throw the parties simply for the sake of having a kegger.

But you were DEAD ON about the liablity issues nationally. We have a hard enough time getting acceptance to belong anywhere on campus (there are schools that not only don't support but flat out refuse to allow frats and sorors on or near the campus). I guarantee you, one death due to hazing in this country and you'll see chapters closing left right and centre. we would cease to exist.

Leslie

[matthewg]

Originally posted by Siobhan:
In my sorority we were told our new members coudln't come out to party and drink with us - how do you tell someone they can't do something they are legally allowed to do!?

I wonder if you could call that hazing......
just kidding , but if it were the other way round people probably would - hilarious!

[This message has been edited by matthewg (edited March 09, 2001).]

[33girl]

Originally posted by Lil_G:
Also, because alcohol has been available to us more much earlier than in the states, there isn't this macho of older guys making first year students drink as much as they can.

THANK YOU! Now can you please hammer this fact into the heads of US lawmakers?

[Lil_G]

Originally posted by 33girl:
THANK YOU! Now can you please hammer this fact into the heads of US lawmakers?

I don't think we're given any credit. To vote you only have to be 18, you would think that's more of an important decision than whether or not someone is capable of buying alcohol. It doesn't make any sense to me.

It's not like i'm sitting at home about to do an essay and suddenly decide to get hammerred instead just because I have some rum in the cupboard.

[canadajen]

Originally posted by Siobhan:
It is beyond me how this alcohol policies are goingt to work, the one fraternity that has gone dry is suffering. At UBC we have 3 pubs/bars on campus!!! Not to mention about 30 more within a 10-15 minute bus ride. If our prof gives us time during our lecture to work on a group project I can bet you a million dollars the whole class will end up in the Pit (our main campus pub)with pitchers and pints working away. Also when we meet with our profs for extra help we will often go to one of the campus bars for a pint and to talk things over - I kid you not!!

Okay, I just have to step on here and clarify some things ...

I am sorry Siobhan, but you make it sound like we are alcoholics here at UBC! I have also gone to school here for 5 years, and have yet to have a 'class' at the Pit ... sure, I visit the Pit, Gal & Koerner's too, but not as often as your post made it seem like.

In your post, you also made a comment about their not being any problems with alcohol in our greek system or at our campus -- how can you make such a generalization on a campus of 35,000 students?!?! I KNOW of a number of people, personally & otherwise, both WITHIN & outside of the greek system, that have had alcohol-related hazing problems

Please Siobhan, DON'T assume that you speak for all of us here at UBC - you don't! I have sent out a copy of your posting to others here at UBC so that we can truly get an accurate representation of campus life.

I am sorry if I sound upset, but please, CHECK yourself.

Delta Zeta chapter
Alpha Gamma Delta
University of British Columbia


[This message has been edited by canadajen (edited March 09, 2001).]

[Siobhan]

I was generalizing in the fact that we do not have the same probs with alcohol up here as in the states - and not to make us sound like alcoholics but to say that when it comes to alcohol canadians tend to be much more liberal.