"I'm rushing 'for' a certain chapter"

[greekdee]

Sorry if this has been posted (I missed it), but how about this from Auburn's website:

"In 1992, the National Panhellenic Conference passed a resolution addressing letters of recommendation. The resolution, in part, states: "The responsibility of providing letters of recommendation for potential members rests with the members of NPC fraternities and recruitment information distributed through College and Alumnae Panhellenics shall contain nothing that infers letters of recommendation must be secured by the potential member." Each of the sixteen sororities at Auburn that participate in Fall Formal Recruitment is a member of the National Panhellenic Conference and is bound by this resolution" (I am adding here that Auburn actually has 17 sororities. This page apparently hasn't been updated , but is the page you're taken to when in the 2013 recruitment section and click on the link about recs.)

https://fp.auburn.edu/greek/recommendations.htm

I knew about this NPC rule, but wonder how many sororities conducting recruitments for 1500 or more PNMs have the time to secure recs. However, the specific statement recruitment information distributed through College and Alumnae Panhellenics shall contain nothing that infers letters of recommendation must be secured by the potential member may explain the position we're seeing on so many school Panhellenic sites where it has long been held that recs are mandatory. To say anything differently would be an NPC violation.

So -- how do we handle this? I still tell PNMs to GET RECS when going into these competitive recruitments. I have not seen anything valid to assure me that they have lost their importance...but I very much second adpiuf's suggestion about opening up dialogue with NPC groups about it. I am hearing from PNMs and parents about conflicting advice, including that SEC sorority women have told them recs are not needed, that they are not even looked at and that they mean nothing coming from alumnae who don't know the PNM personally...the idea seems to be that most recs come from avid "rec-writers" just shootin' 'em out the door.

Info varies depending on the school, though. Other PNMs/parents are still hearing that 2nd round won't happen without recs. Rec girls of mine who went through SEC rush just last year told me that, as the days progressed, it became very obvious their recs had been looked at. They were clued in when they were introduced to certain members who said, "We saw from one of your rec providers that you...whatever she did." At Tennessee's Panhellenic site, each sorority states how many recs are needed, and even the ones that say they aren't required still say they are recommended. The Ole Miss site says they are helpful in the recruitment process. Last year, they flat-out said they were often a tool for "managing the numbers" in large recruitments.

For now, I would say don't think about going into a competitive recruitment without them, no matter what the Panhellenic page says or what word on the street for your specific school is. But...I can sure see where they are extreme paperwork for sororities (imagine all 2000-plus Bama PNMs sending in 2-3 recs each. Yikes.) AND, if the perception is that most recs are coming from random alumnae just pulling from a resume, then yes, I can see where they carry less and less weight.

Let's talk.

[greekdee]

Sorry, just deleted a double post.

[33girl]

That Auburn thing kind of sounds like when in Congress they stated that the Mafia doesn't exist and then spent ookabillion hours discussing how to deal with the Mafia (if it did exist)(which, ya know, it doesn't)(no, not at all).

And that FSU thing is way beyond, and I really want someone to submit it to their national HQ and pitch a bitch saying it divulges confidential membership selection procedures.

[HQWest]

Note: There are 17 sororities at Auburn. I guess they haven't updated that since Theta recolonized?

[greekdee]

Originally Posted by HQWest

Note: There are 17 sororities at Auburn. I guess they haven't updated that since Theta recolonized?

Ha, I guess not on that page! I checked the main page and it says 17. That page is the first hit that comes up when you google Auburn Panhellenic + recommendations.

I did go to back and accessed their rec info through the main page -- guess where it took me? Same place with 16 sororities.

[honeychile]

From Auburn's Panhellenic page:

Please note that while potential members can seek out letters of rec; it is ultimately not the responsibility of the potential member to obtain a copy of the Recommendation/Reference Form for the alumna or collegian. Also, please be advised that the UA Panhellenic does not have access to individual sorority Recommendation/Reference Forms; however, we can assist an alumna in securing a copy of the recommendation form, if she is having difficulty obtaining one (See FAQ’s tab on our main page).

This is much like saying that a PNM does not have to exhibit proper hygiene, manners, etc when going through Recruitment. It's necessary, but they're not going to mandate them for fear of sounding elitist. The trouble is in the interpretation: they say you don't need recs but omigosh, are you messed up without them!

I certainly didn't go through SEC Recruitment, but we all knew that some behaviors and attire would guarantee not receiving a bid!

[AZTheta]

honey and 33, I don't get that interpretation at all from the quote honey posted.

Instead, I understand it to say (paraphrasing) the PNM is not responsible for getting the rec form to the people writing her rec(s); and that the Greek Life Office, while it doesn't have the individual sorority rec forms, can help the rec writer to get the correct form. I don't interpret it to say that recs aren't necessary; it starts by saying the PNM "can seek out" recs (which is a very interesting indirect way of saying "get them" IMO).

I have never had a PNM give me a Theta rec form to fill out. It's on our website and it's my responsibility to fill out the form and submit it correctly.

Does that make more sense?

[honeychile]

Originally Posted by AzTheta

honey and 33, I don't get that interpretation at all from the quote honey posted.

Instead, I understand it to say (paraphrasing) the PNM is not responsible for getting the rec form to the people writing her rec(s); and that the Greek Life Office, while it doesn't have the individual sorority rec forms, can help the rec writer to get the correct form. I don't interpret it to say that recs aren't necessary; it starts by saying the PNM "can seek out" recs (which is a very interesting indirect way of saying "get them" IMO).

I have never had a PNM give me a Theta rec form to fill out. It's on our website and it's my responsibility to fill out the form and submit it correctly.

Does that make more sense?

Infinitely! I wouldn't dream of giving a form to a PNM, either. It's my understanding that they're part of Membership Selection, and should NOT be given to a PNM.

[MaryPoppins]

Here's what Ole Miss Panhellenic has to say online in their new Recruitment FAQ about recs:

What is a letter of recommendation? Do I really need one?

• - A recommendation is a personal letter of reference written by an alumnae member of a sorority to introduce a Potential New Member to her sorority. In the recommendation, the alumnae will write about your activities and talents so the sorority can get acquainted with you before recruitment begins.
• - Recommendation letters are not required to go through recruitment. They are helpful in the recruitment process. You may send more than one letter of recommendation if you wish.
• - DO NOT include transcripts or test scores with your recommendation letters. Sororities will receive your overall GPA before recruitment begins, therefore transcripts are not necessary. This includes not sending it to local Alumnae Panhellenic Associations or the sorority.

[AnchorAlumna]

I don't care.
When giving material to an alum to write a rec, INCLUDE A TRANSCRIPT.

[groovypq]

I'm a little late to this thread (new baby will do that to you...) but I have noticed this trend in the past year or so. The School Class of 2017 Facebook page is rife with posts about "What sorority are you rushing? I'm rushing XYZ!" or "I know which sorority I want!" and they clearly don't have any idea how recruitment works. And since we're a deferred-recruitment school, they will only be MORE sure of they're "rushing XYZ" by the time recruitment rolls around.

We're a small school (4 NPC orgs) and really, most people are XYZ or bust - and they drop out if XYZ cuts them. Either they go through informal the next fall and try to get in that way or they don't go social Greek (a lot join the service org... and I am NOT knocking service orgs, but at my school there are indeed a lot of people who join it just for letters, unfortunately). I really, really wish there were a way to get PNMs to be more open-minded.

Side note: my chapter's province president is constantly telling them to stop using "rush" and "pledge." However, it seems like no one on campus uses the "proper" terminology. She said once she gets the "campus culture," but still every year there's a lonnnng discourse about proper terminology. I'm not sure how to correct it.

[carnation]

Wow, I just saw how many views this thread has.

Anyway, take note, PNMs! You may have favorites but if you're doing an NPC recruitment, pleeease don't publicize your choices. That's likely to end badly.

[Old_Row]

Originally Posted by groovypq

I'm a little late to this thread (new baby will do that to you...) but I have noticed this trend in the past year or so. The School Class of 2017 Facebook page is rife with posts about "What sorority are you rushing? I'm rushing XYZ!" or "I know which sorority I want!" and they clearly don't have any idea how recruitment works. And since we're a deferred-recruitment school, they will only be MORE sure of they're "rushing XYZ" by the time recruitment rolls around.

We're a small school (4 NPC orgs) and really, most people are XYZ or bust - and they drop out if XYZ cuts them. Either they go through informal the next fall and try to get in that way or they don't go social Greek (a lot join the service org... and I am NOT knocking service orgs, but at my school there are indeed a lot of people who join it just for letters, unfortunately). I really, really wish there were a way to get PNMs to be more open-minded.

Side note: my chapter's province president is constantly telling them to stop using "rush" and "pledge." However, it seems like no one on campus uses the "proper" terminology. She said once she gets the "campus culture," but still every year there's a lonnnng discourse about proper terminology. I'm not sure how to correct it.

I think it might be a little more understandable at a smaller school maybe? With only four sororities it seems like maybe they would all have pretty distinct personalities and there would be a bigger difference between them especially if they are smaller too? A big difference from a school that has a bunch of houses and maybe 200 or 300 members where you could probably find a place in almost any of them if you gave them a chance?

[angels&angles]

Originally Posted by Old_Row

I think it might be a little more understandable at a smaller school maybe? With only four sororities it seems like maybe they would all have pretty distinct personalities and there would be a bigger difference between them especially if they are smaller too? A big difference from a school that has a bunch of houses and maybe 200 or 300 members where you could probably find a place in almost any of them if you gave them a chance?

Coming from a smaller school with fewer chapters--

In some ways, yes. BUT I still don't think you could possibly know that before you get to the school. At that point it is 100% tent talk which is still mostly gossip and untrue, even at a small school. Over half the members without bids at my school came from PNMs dropping out when they didn't get "their" chapter, and it was crap. Any of those girls would have done well and had a great time at any of the chapters. Even in a smaller school with smaller chapters, I think you can find your place with any group.

And most of the girls who are doing that sort of thing are going off of "XYZ is the most popular. I belong in XYZ."

/soapbox

[I should note, as stated earlier, that I rushed "for" a group. and it wasn't the "best" group like I just generalized. But I didn't do that until I'd been on campus for a few months, and, in retrospect, I do think I would have enjoyed myself in any of the groups on campus. I wouldn't have thought so at the time, and Pi Phi was 100% the best fit for me, but I would have been a-ok and had a great experience anyway]

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by Old_Row

I think it might be a little more understandable at a smaller school maybe? With only four sororities it seems like maybe they would all have pretty distinct personalities and there would be a bigger difference between them especially if they are smaller too? A big difference from a school that has a bunch of houses and maybe 200 or 300 members where you could probably find a place in almost any of them if you gave them a chance?

Interestingly, I think this kind of works against what you're trying to argue. If a PNM could "definitely" fit in with at least a small group of sisters in a chapter of 200-300 girls, then she could hypothetically join any one and it wouldn't matter if she focused on only one group. If, on the other hand, there were only 20 sisters in a chapter, she'd have to truly make sure that she fit in with at least a couple of them, and she'd have less of a chance of that happening than she would in a larger chapter. She'd be better off increasing her chances of meeting people she clicks with by being open to more chapters.

My school had 3 chapters. When I was active, there were between 10 and 30 members in each, and we only held informal recruitment. On numerous occasions, we had PNMs who would go through recruitment set on one chapter. They wouldn't get a bid. We had one girl come out to ONLY our recruitment events for THREE semesters before she finally got the hint, went to recruitment events for a different chapter for one semester, and received a bid. She loved her time with her chapter.

I think it's sometimes misleading to say that "small schools/Greek systems are different" when it comes to having an open mind. And I would say you should definitely keep an open mind if you haven't even arrived at school yet, regardless of which school you attend.