E-Mails Suggest Paterno Role in Silence on Sandusky

[agzg]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Wow.

I'm all for conducting research but that is a bit strange.

What's strange? I send these for a living so maybe the fact that she looked it up is what's strange to you - I look this stuff up for other schools sometimes for funsies.

It's a really long survey though. I don't know why schools send out such long surveys. My undergrad did one that took me a half hour to fill out. I was annoyed.

ETA: I see their response rates were shitty - I struggle with getting people to respond, too. Getting people to take surveys is hard, especially when your sample population may be discouraged for some reason.

/nerd out.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by AXOmom

No, you're right, you did not say it was unique (and for the record I never said that you had stated there were no other schools in the country that could compare to PSU, so I'm not sure where that's coming from),

I was responding to everyone collectively.

but this comment:

"My point is that basically the entire state IS Penn State.... But what I'm saying is that a huge chunk of Pennsylvanians live and breathe Penn State, even if they never attend the school. It is THE school in PA. That's not to say that other schools in PA aren't great or worth going to.. And I'm not saying Penn State is the best.. it's just that Penn State is a way of life for A LOT of people."

does come across that way. It sounds like you find it unusual at the very least, and the point being made to you by myself and others is that it isn't even all that unusual. The fact that you said it to support something als463 said and she has made several statements that have an even stronger "Penn State is a special snowflake" implication to them added further to this impression. If we misunderstood you, then I apologize, but since there were several of us who misunderstood you, then I think you should consider that in the context of the thread, what you said came across in a way you didn't intend.

I'm not sure how what I said came across as, "LSU, Nebraska, Bama, etc. students and alumni don't have as much pride in their school as PSU".. but ok. If that's how you interpreted it, then that's how you interpreted it.

My point was simply that Penn State has a huge, loyal student/alumni population, which stretches even beyond the borders of PA, and will always be loyal to the school, regardless of what happened.

And agreeing with ONE statement that als463 made shouldn't automatically make me one of the Penn State crazies. I know, just as well as everyone else here, that she is ALL ABOUT Penn State, and can take things to the extreme when it comes to our alma mater. (Sorry als, but it's true)

als463's response was to something I said to 33girl concerning the likelihood that football players with ties to Penn State would forego scholarships to other schools in order to play without a scholarship to Penn State, but her response had to do with her view that parents whose kids (any kids -not limited to football plalyers) had scholarships to other schools might still send them to Penn State. I don't disagree with her view on that - it just had nothing to do with my response to 33girl which strictly dealt with football players, so her comment wasn't really relevant.

I'm not sure how it wasn't relevant.. but ok.

I also never said that EVERY parent of a football player would turn their child away from playing at PSU and never assumed any such thing. As a matter of fact I stated that some parents under some conditions might encourage their boys to do that, but I mentioned several reasons why I didn't think it was likely that many would (for one thing I don't think there would be many who fit that criteria to begin with).

You didn't say this earlier, so... I was under the impression that however I interpreted your statement was correct.

Again, I understand that we probably did completely misunderstand you, but I hope you understand why you were misunderstood.

And I hope you understand why you were misunderstood, as well. The funny thing is, I think people read others' comments here and somehow turned it into something I said.

Oh well. This is why I generally stay away from saying my piece about this whole situation. It only causes issues.

But whatever, it's over and done with. No hard feelings.

[DrPhil]

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

So onanism.

[33girl]

OK, asking this because I think this is what a lot of PA people were trying to say. Aren't there big rivalries in some of the states mentioned, like Alabama/Auburn, Georgia/Georgia State and Kansas/K-State with people being pretty evenly divided? Not just in sports, but admissions and loyalty and devotion to the school. There's no "Penn State/Penn" rivalry. And the Pitt/Penn State rivalry pretty much died when PSU entered the Big XII. It's still around, but not nearly what it used to be (i.e. when you couldn't wear the other school's shirts on campus).

This is what a lot of people in PA are meaning when they say they think that it's different.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by 33girl

OK, asking this because I think this is what a lot of PA people were trying to say. Aren't there big rivalries in some of the states mentioned, like Alabama/Auburn, Georgia/Georgia State and Kansas/K-State with people being pretty evenly divided? Not just in sports, but admissions and loyalty and devotion to the school. There's no "Penn State/Penn" rivalry. And the Pitt/Penn State rivalry pretty much died when PSU entered the Big XII. It's still around, but not nearly what it used to be (i.e. when you couldn't wear the other school's shirts on campus).

This is what a lot of people in PA are meaning when they say they think that it's different.

Then you have Arkansas, Tennessee and LSU. Those are the flagship schools. People go to Vanderbilt but not for sports.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by 33girl

OK, asking this because I think this is what a lot of PA people were trying to say. Aren't there big rivalries in some of the states mentioned, like Alabama/Auburn, Georgia/Georgia State and Kansas/K-State with people being pretty evenly divided? Not just in sports, but admissions and loyalty and devotion to the school. There's no "Penn State/Penn" rivalry. And the Pitt/Penn State rivalry pretty much died when PSU entered the Big XII. It's still around, but not nearly what it used to be (i.e. when you couldn't wear the other school's shirts on campus).

This is what a lot of people in PA are meaning when they say they think that it's different.

Again, not unique. OSU and Wisconsin have the same (in-state) setup just within PSU's division, and right around the same academic reputation as well (UW slightly higher ranked, OSU slightly lower).

PA people might think it's different, but it's not.

[agzg]

Originally Posted by 33girl

There's no "Penn State/Penn" rivalry. And the Pitt/Penn State rivalry pretty much died when PSU entered the Big XII. It's still around, but not nearly what it used to be (i.e. when you couldn't wear the other school's shirts on campus).

This is why I hate PSU slightly less than WVU.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by 33girl

OK, asking this because I think this is what a lot of PA people were trying to say. Aren't there big rivalries in some of the states mentioned, like Alabama/Auburn, Georgia/Georgia State and Kansas/K-State with people being pretty evenly divided? Not just in sports, but admissions and loyalty and devotion to the school.

At least in North Carolina that would definitely be the case -- you have UNC, NC State and Duke, and then factor in Wake Forest, App State, East Carolina, A&T . . . . Particularly in the case of UNC, State and Duke, you'll have as many people who hate them as who support them.

We may be the exception compared to other states, but there is not a single school here that gets all of the loyalty and devotion.

[AXOmom]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

At least in North Carolina that would definitely be the case -- you have UNC, NC State and Duke, and then factor in Wake Forest, App State, East Carolina, A&T . . . . Particularly in the case of UNC, State and Duke, you'll have as many people who hate them as who support them.

We may be the exception compared to other states, but there is not a single school here that gets all of the loyalty and devotion.

You know, this might be the one case that is truly unusual on the opposite end of states where the school loyalties are extremely divided. California and Texas might be similar but they're a little more spread out. Oh wait, Florida would be very similar.

I think the one thing that's a bid different in the case of North Carolina is that three of those schools are soooo close, and while my N. Carolina relatives would draw and quarter me if they ever knew I said this (since they are Wolfpack people), two out of the three are not only close, they have outstanding academic reputations and are both traditionally phenomenal in one major sport.

Are there examples of other states where this is the case that I've missed?

[AOII Angel]

Oh, and any rivalry in Georgia would be btwn UGA and Georgia Tech.

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

Oh, and any rivalry in Georgia would be btwn UGA and Georgia Tech.

Which, if you've ever lived in GA, is not really a rivalry on the scale of Alabama/Auburn, etc. UGA owns the state. So many students at Tech have academics as their top priority and not as many stick around in the area post-graduation as happens for UGA.

My husband grew up in Atlanta and is a Tech fan, but they're few and far between.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by amIblue?

Which, if you've ever lived in GA, is not really a rivalry on the scale of Alabama/Auburn, etc. UGA owns the state. So many students at Tech have academics as their top priority and not as many stick around in the area post-graduation as happens for UGA.

My husband grew up in Atlanta and is a Tech fan, but they're few and far between.

I agree. That's why I put ANY rivalry.

[AXOmom]

Again, same holds for Nebraska (no other in-state competition whatsoever, and virtually a complete state-wide loyalty to that one school with incredibly devoted fans) and WVU (some state officials have tried to get a rivalry going between WVU and Marshall by having them play each other) - but that hasn't really worked out for several reasons and WVU has a virtual lock on state loyalty as well as completely insane fans...and I mean that in the most literal sense of the word insane - and while it started with football in both cases (as it probably started at least partially from football for Penn State) - it is not limited to that and has morphed into a loyalty to the schools themselves.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by AXOmom

Again, same holds for Nebraska (no other in-state competition whatsoever, and virtually a complete state-wide loyalty to that one school with incredibly devoted fans) and WVU (some state officials have tried to get a rivalry going between WVU and Marshall by having them play each other) - but that hasn't really worked out for several reasons and WVU has a virtual lock on state loyalty as well as completely insane fans...and I mean that in the most literal sense of the word insane - and while it started with football in both cases (as it probably started at least partially from football for Penn State) - it is not limited to that and has morphed into a loyalty to the schools themselves.

I'm sure we could keep going. Texas should get a pass for UT and Texas A&M since it's such a huge state, you could put ten PAs in there. (hyperbole, folks, I don't need anyone to give me a literal approximation of how many would really fit )


ETA: I'd say UMD, but from experience during my time in MD, despite being the only game in town, no one really cares.