RFM Question - Page 5

Titchou · #61 08-20-2012, 05:21 PM

I would think very few would do that knowing that it's possible for a chapter to delete a woman.

UGAalum94 · #62 08-20-2012, 05:49 PM

Are all schools now on the unlimited QA system now?

I can remember getting confused here a few years ago because I started thinking that for any school using RFM and QAs, a PNM who maximized her options would get a bid. One of the more knowledgeable folks checked me because UGA didn't yet promise that, and in hindsight, I suspect that it was because there were still limits on how many QAs a chapter could get, and depending on where a girl preffed, her chapters could max out before they got to her, I guess.

Excepting the kind of info that Titchou mentioned when a chapter wants to remove someone from the bid list for cause, based on new info the chapter received, what would keep a girl who maximized her options at pref from getting a bid these days? Why is Arkansas telling them that?

Titchou · #63 08-20-2012, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

Are all schools now on the unlimited QA system now?

I can remember getting confused here a few years ago because I started thinking that for any school using RFM and QAs, a PNM who maximized her options would get a bid. One of the more knowledgeable folks checked me because UGA didn't yet promise that, and in hindsight, I suspect that it was because there were still limits on how many QAs a chapter could get, and depending on where a girl preffed, her chapters could max out before they got to her, I guess.

Excepting the kind of info that Titchou mentioned when a chapter wants to remove someone from the bid list for cause, based on new info the chapter received, what would keep a girl who maximized her options at pref from getting a bid these days? Why is Arkansas telling them that?

Arkansas isn't telling them anything beyond that it's possible. They certainly shouldn't qualify it because that would border on private membership selection information. Unless the University REQUIRES that all women a pref be placed, it is ALWAYS possible that someone who has maximized her options will go without a bid - possible, but not probable. But they are better off not promising. I don't see a problem with it. The Green Book says "should" put them all on their bid list and they are just following that dictate.

IndianaSigKap · #64 08-20-2012, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

Does anyone know of any school where they use RFM, a girl attends preference, fully fills out her bid card and ISN'T guaranteed a spot? The exception may prove the rule.

Indiana...the exception to every rule. What is that saying, "If you can't be the good example, be the glaring mistake?"

I didn't think that schools HAD to offer bids if a PNM did not match, even if she maximized her options. I assume many schools to this, but it doesn't sound like they have to.

DeltaBetaBaby · #65 08-20-2012, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndianaSigKap

Indiana...the exception to every rule. What is that saying, "If you can't be the good example, be the glaring mistake?"

I didn't think that schools HAD to offer bids if a PNM did not match, even if she maximized her options. I assume many schools to this, but it doesn't sound like they have to.

Right, if a chapter found out something extremely unsavory minutes before pref, you better believe they would still take her off of the final bid list.

DubaiSis · #66 08-20-2012, 10:27 PM

I meant other than Indiana, our special snowflake school

Titchou · #67 08-21-2012, 06:56 AM

With RFM, if you are on a bid list and you listed that group on your bid card AND maximized your options,you will get a bid. The issue is whether or not you made the bid list....and it's possible to attend a pref and not be on that group's bid list. Not probable - but possible.

DeltaBetaBaby · #68 08-21-2012, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou

With RFM, if you are on a bid list and you listed that group on your bid card AND maximized your options,you will get a bid. The issue is whether or not you made the bid list....and it's possible to attend a pref and not be on that group's bid list. Not probable - but possible.

But if you attend two prefs, and list them both, and for whatever reason, you are dropped from one big list, are you guaranteed a bid to the other?

gee_ess · #69 08-21-2012, 09:55 AM

^^^okay, without too much MS info being divulged, the confusing thing about this statement is that everyone who attends pref is on a list. So, I think the general prevailing thought, at least at Arkansas, is that everyone who attends pref( maximizes, blah, blah) gets a bid. And that is what the "officials" at arkansas always said. Now, they freak everyone out by very clearly saying- we can't be SURE you will get a bid, but we are pretty sure. And, I assure you, no one in those houses thinks they can leave a girl off those final lists. And, to further compound things, if you were to place/rank a pnm last in order to possibly achieve that, she is very, very likely to be a QA because that is where they come from.

Posted while deltababy was posting. I am wondering about her question also.

pinapple · #70 08-21-2012, 11:02 AM

In the University of Texas UPC Constitution (which is public and a link to follow) it states:

Quote:

Guaranteed Placement: The following procedures should be followed if women whose bids did not match in the normal course of bid matching must be placed in fraternity chapters who have already reached Quota:

i. The potential new member will be matched to the fraternity chapter she has listed on her preference card that is the smallest in chapter size, as long as her name appears on that chapter’s preferential bid list. By matching her there, that group may exceed quota in order to place every potential new member eligible for guaranteed placement (see ii ) in a chapter.
ii. This procedure shall never include a potential new member who lists an intentional single preference on her preference card or one who has failed to accept or attend any recruitment event for which there was room in her schedule.

The way this reads I would gather that if a chapter does not have her on the bid list, she indeed would not get a bid if she was invited to, and attended one pref party OR she would go to chapter "B" if chapter "A" left her off their bid list.

I find it all very, very interesting.

Link to the constitution:
http://deanofstudents.utexas.edu/sfl...nstitution.pdf

Now my question is this: If a school "sells" guaranteed placement, I would say they are in a bit of pickle if a PNM attends two pref parties and then does not end up on either bid list. Probably not common, but I would think it could happen, especially if some type of bad girl behavior was stumbled upon between scheduled days....you will find so much "cross association" between girls at UT, that if a PNM makes a fool of herself in the night time hours during recruitment, it will spread like fire.

gee_ess · #71 08-21-2012, 04:46 PM

For me, the problem is the practice of calling the whole thing "Guaranteed Placement." The word "guaranteed" is misleading.

Titchou · #72 08-21-2012, 07:48 PM

There are GA's who will call and ask why you left someone off and if you had permission from your national to do it. Now that's not saying all of them keepthat close a tab on it but some do.

33girl · #73 08-21-2012, 11:46 PM

I thought we discussed on here before that UT has guaranteed placement (if you maximize, blah blah blah). In other words, if you get to pref, you WILL receive a bid, no exceptions. I don't think that anyone has ever said, intimated or guaranteed that any of the other schools we brought up do the same.

gee_ess · #74 08-22-2012, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 33girl

I thought we discussed on here before that UT has guaranteed placement (if you maximize, blah blah blah). In other words, if you get to pref, you WILL receive a bid, no exceptions. I don't think that anyone has ever said, intimated or guaranteed that any of the other schools we brought up do the same.

I must not have been paying close enough attention, because I thought that was the end result for all schools that use RFM. That GP a characteristic of it.

New question: is there a "magic percentage" that RFM /specialists work with looking ahead from registration to pref and crunching numbers for return numbers for each round?

For example, at Arkansas (ole miss, too) they surely can see what the numbers are doing each round. And even as they chant "quota range will be determined based on , blah, blah) I have to believe they can see where things are heading. Are they holding to an unspoken rule that no more than 10% will go bid less. Because each year, that is roughly how many drop, are released, etc. Why not 20% or 30%? Why don't they make those big cuts early. Then make another BIG cut in a later round.

pinapple · #75 08-22-2012, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 33girl

I thought we discussed on here before that UT has guaranteed placement (if you maximize, blah blah blah). In other words, if you get to pref, you WILL receive a bid, no exceptions. I don't think that anyone has ever said, intimated or guaranteed that any of the other schools we brought up do the same.

But can we say even UT has GP if by their own wording, that a girl has to be to on the bid list? If you only have one pref party and a house chooses to NOT place the girl on the bid list, where is the RFM coordinator going to put her? Are they going to force the sorority's hand?