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  #46  
Old 07-07-2005, 05:06 PM
jubilance1922 jubilance1922 is offline
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So lifesaver, let me make sure I'm understanding your point.

You think its ok to make fun of a cultural group, whether the country has a history of racism or not?

Sorry, but I don't buy that.
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  #47  
Old 07-07-2005, 08:03 PM
Munchkin03 Munchkin03 is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by PhiPsiRuss
1) Open mouth.
2) Insert foot.
That needs to be edited.

1). Open mouth.
2). Remove funnel of MOONSHINE.
3). Insert foot.
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  #48  
Old 07-07-2005, 11:28 PM
non-greek newby non-greek newby is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by lifesaver
I dont agree. I personally think racism IS bad. But the recognition of racism as a bad thing is pretty uniquely American and European. Just because we have embrased it doesnt mean EVERYONE ELSE HAS TO. I guess I just believe in a nations course of self determinism. If racism is so abhorrent to nature then in the due course, the citizens of a country will make the decison to end it on their own. If we as another country force our views on them, then it wont be genuine. They have to want to end it. It needs to come from them, not us. I think its as bad, if not worse to impose our values on a country as letting them operate a system where others make judgements on a person becasue of the way they look - especially when its in a system where there are no rights violations and there is equality and has been for nearly 200 years. We sure as hell cant say that in the US. Thats just my opinion.

In the meantime, start researching the 40% of items in your home that were "Hecho En Mexico" and throw them out. And vow to not purchase anything that was ever made in mexico or has mecican components and hit them in their pocketbooks. Start a boycot. But dont just pay lip service to it. Do something or shut up about it.
Lifesaver,
I'm going to have to disagree with you, as well. First, the recognition of racism is a pretty universal thing. The United Nations has a committee dedicated to the elimination of racism and discrimination. There was also the World Conference Against Racism in 2001. And we have deemed racism as an international human rights violation. But that's not really what we're talking about here.

When racism occurs, there are usually 2 groups involved – the discriminators and the discriminated against. Now, usually, the discriminators have some kind of power over those who are discriminated against. Most of the time it’s either political power, economic power, psychological/social power, or all of the above. So, how do you fight against this when you are poor and defenseless? And how do you become conscious of the fact that there exists something else in the world that doesn’t involve racism if that’s all you know? Being unconscious of a wrong-doing does not make it right. For example, imagine that the majority of people in a country believe that killing all children with blue eyes is acceptable because it hurts the aesthetic value of this country. You are saying that we cannot intervene in this case, despite the fact that these children would not be able to fight for their rights simply because they do not have the political clout as would adults in government.

There are some cases where I understand that cultural norms exist which my culture would dictate is wrong. For example, women in some countries must wear veils on their heads or cover their bodies from head to toe. For religious purposes, I understand this is not discrimination because they accept it as their culture, but there are many instances where discrimination exists and these groups do not accept it, but it’s very hard for them to fight against it. You should watch the movie “Hotel Rwanda.” Maybe you’ll get a taste of what I mean.

In the meantime, I’d like you to know that I’m not just paying lipservice to any of this. And that there are plenty of other effective ways of fighting against racism that doesn’t involve throwing away half of what you own.
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  #49  
Old 07-08-2005, 10:48 AM
Rudey Rudey is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by non-greek newby
There are some cases where I understand that cultural norms exist which my culture would dictate is wrong. For example, women in some countries must wear veils on their heads or cover their bodies from head to toe. For religious purposes, I understand this is not discrimination because they accept it as their culture, but there are many instances where discrimination exists and these groups do not accept it, but it’s very hard for them to fight against it. You should watch the movie “Hotel Rwanda.” Maybe you’ll get a taste of what I mean.
How does that make sense?

You disagree with lifesaver because he thinks they should have the authority to deal with racism but are OK with sexism?

Many of those women have no choice but to wear the veils or they are beaten, jailed, raped, and killed. Many of those that do are also pressured. And yes, many also choose the veil over western styles.

-Rudey
--Women's rights is also addressed at the UN
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  #50  
Old 07-08-2005, 06:46 PM
non-greek newby non-greek newby is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rudey
How does that make sense?

You disagree with lifesaver because he thinks they should have the authority to deal with racism but are OK with sexism?

Many of those women have no choice but to wear the veils or they are beaten, jailed, raped, and killed. Many of those that do are also pressured. And yes, many also choose the veil over western styles.

-Rudey
--Women's rights is also addressed at the UN
Rudey, I meant specifically those which accept being veiled for religious purposes. I am not talking about those who are forced to wear it without their consent.
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