Forced to choose between being black or ________.

[Reds6]

Originally posted by ms_gwyn
AKA_Monet

I will answer your questions (I hope you don't mind, I not saying that I've have the same experiences as sistermadly or Jill, but perhaps have a little bit of insight)


Just a little background, I grew up in the ‘burbs, most of my friends were either Latin/Hispanic or Asian while in school...and of course my family and my extended family.

I feel very comfortable living in "both" worlds (and I hesitate to use that word, cause that really isn't it), I have clusters of friends from all ethnic backgrounds and I jump from one to the other, not that I'm keeping them separate, that is just the way it is. I don't act any different with any my sets of friends and if they happen to come together for some event, they see the same person.

But then there is the fact that I (will be) a member of a non-NPHC glo, it is just were I landed in life, as a young girl I just knew that I wanted to be a Delta, but when I went to college there was no Delta chapter present at my school (I didn't know about city chapters, this was back in 1991), so I went through rush for NPC found my home (a different story) and now I will become a member of a NPC through Alumna Initiation...it is the arena that I feel most comfortable in...and that really is the whole point of choosing an glo, the place where you feel most comfortable in and they accept you for who you are.

My real life friends and family do not have a problem with me doing this.......but when I come to a place like GC, lines are drawn and sometimes I feel like I have to straddle that line. But since I really don't live my life in GC world that should not be important. But also in my life (younger days) my "blackness" was questioned and was told that I wanted to be white, which of course makes me angry because is there a certain formula that makes a person black? Isn't it enough that black b/c of my ancestry? is there a handbook that I forgot to pick up?

I have never lead a "double" life and I will certainly not start to do that now....perhaps that is how sistermadly and jill feel.

First let me say, Christ comes first, regardless of color lines.
I find this interesting. I grew up in the burbs and lived in mainly white neighborhoods. I have been told I "talk white" all of my life! But with this I never felt that I needed to prove that I was "black enough" I have never viewed the decision that I have made or my successes as being a product of extreme exposure to the white community. I attribute who I am, what I have accomplished and my faith to my family. How I was raised. I was raised aware. I was raised that my surroundings at the time, was not the make-up of the world. Growing up in a predominately white area, only increased my desire to learn more about my culture and to gain the experience of being around my people, which is why I chose a Black College. I never felt that I had to choose nor did I feel obligated to go to a HBCU to prove my blackness, it was my desire. No one can define who I am nor my blackness. My blackness and my culture aren't choices its my life and who I am.

[RACooper]

Originally posted by Sistermadly
I never said it was "that liberal". I simply said that liberal isn't a dirty word here, unless you're a member of the Progressive Conservative Party or the Bloc Quebecois, or you're an Albertan.

Actually I'd say that "liberal" has a slightly different context up - unless you're a Alliance/Reform PC...

But back to the topic at hand...

Personally, for my own interest I'd like to here the opinions about identity and ethnicity from some who have experienced both the US and other countries variety of race-relations and identity... was there the same pressures or different pressures - and if different how?

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally posted by Sistermadly
Is there a particular passage you had in mind? 'Cause I have it here on my bookshelf, and though I've read it, nothing comes to mind that was germane to my particular take on the situation at hand.

The entire book is relevant.

[ladygreek]

Originally posted by Reds6

S, re: your siggy, Chaos is back

[Reds6]

Originally posted by ladygreek
S, re: your siggy, Chaos is back

yes and with a VENGEANCE!

[Rudey]

Originally posted by ladygreek
Hmmmm, in my experience a berry that is white is not ripened and therefore quite sour.

The flip side of that is a berry that is rotten.

-Rudey
--Basically all chicks dig white guys with tans

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally posted by Reds6
yes and with a VENGEANCE!

And until KAZO comes back.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally posted by Rudey
--Basically all chicks dig white guys with tans

It's just as easy to find a man who doesn't need a tan, though.

[Rudey]

Originally posted by DSTCHAOS
It's just as easy to find a man who doesn't need a tan, though.

Like Michael Jackson?

-Rudey

[Honeykiss1974]

Rudey, he is Italian (Sicilian to be exact) so I'm not sure if white people even consider him "white"?

Cripes, racism can be so confusing sometimes.

LOL

[ms_gwyn]

Originally posted by Reds6
First let me say, Christ comes first, regardless of color lines.
I find this interesting. I grew up in the burbs and lived in mainly white neighborhoods. I have been told I "talk white" all of my life! But with this I never felt that I needed to prove that I was "black enough" I have never viewed the decision that I have made or my successes as being a product of extreme exposure to the white community. I attribute who I am, what I have accomplished and my faith to my family. How I was raised. I was raised aware. I was raised that my surroundings at the time, was not the make-up of the world. Growing up in a predominately white area, only increased my desire to learn more about my culture and to gain the experience of being around my people, which is why I chose a Black College. I never felt that I had to choose nor did I feel obligated to go to a HBCU to prove my blackness, it was my desire. No one can define who I am nor my blackness. My blackness and my culture aren't choices its my life and who I am.

I didn't grow up in a predominately white neighborhood….I grew up mostly around Latinos and Asians, and spent a few years living in "the hood" (I hate that expression, but lack a better term). I have never felt the need to prove my blackness, but others seem to think so, those people don't even show up in my world…hence my statement on a "blackness" manual, I have never felt lacking in my culture. As for picking the college that I did, for my major it was one of the best universities in the west and I didn't want to venture to far from home and I also wanted the "full" college experience, that is what I didn't stay in CA and go to FIDM, Otis/Parsons (now just Otis) or Cal Arts. I agree that my blackness and my culture aren't choices and if they were choices…guess what I wouldn't change a damn thing about my life, but its part of my me, I will never be defined by the color of my skin…to me that is to inhibiting. I think we are staying the same thing just coming from two different angles and experiences.

[AKA_Monet]

Okey,

Some folks here have life experiences that expand their self definition beyond acculturation...

And some folks here have limited expressions, which causes definition because of acculturation...

If one's were stronger, there would be no need for definitions...

Personally, I refused to be defined... For I am indescribably, undefinable, and indefinite... And if folks must define me, then define me Divine, for that is what I am, I am a child of God...

But that is an sidebar...

My brother made some choices in his life that I had issues with (searchable only on GC). I had no choice but to get over myself and get a life. I have had my "attitude adjustment" after 10 something years. My relationship with my brother is limited not only due to distance, but also due to what I know is his "faulty thinking" (spelled as a clinical psychological assessment--not my personal opinion)... He made his choice to live his life as he saw fit and jumped right into it without considering what is will do to him or to others...

As an African American male in the United States, does he have that luxury?

Then, his whole concept of his being just got very complicated when that "privilege" we are speaking of now, broke down his front door of his career life... Short of a non-black teacher using the "N" word in class with high school students--not once, but twice within a week, my brother had to DEAL with his faulty thinking up front, close and personal--as he was this teacher's superior and chose not to reprimand her file the first time...

Mind you, the non-black teacher was married to an African American man and had children from that marriage--so of course, how could she be labeled as a "racist"...

Needless to say, that did not quell the anger and resentment of the African American parents that MY brother had to contend with...

Now, I am watching from the sidelines my brother's life. And it hurts me to watch it because I know exactly what he is going through in his mind and I cannot do anything to alleviate his pain but just listen... However, he chooses not to reach out to me when I have reach back to him even after I had to sacrifice some of my strongly held views and values of Afrikan Centeredness...

I say all this to ask those who thrive outside the box, what do you all do when lunacy happens?

Because the way I see it, I am in the frontlines of the battle of bigotry and Spiritual self awakening... That is where my sword and fight lies... I may not see global change, but little changes mean alot to me... One person at a time.

Are you all really thinking you can live pristine without the sting? Just asking.

Also, I have done frontline battle with the Klan, so I am not unfamiliar with the pen-ultimate of hatred. And I have won these battles. But that is a tactical strategy that has to be learned by going into the "lion's den"... Avoidance causes it only to fester...

[Reds6]

Originally posted by ms_gwyn
I didn't grow up in a predominately white neighborhood….I grew up mostly around Latinos and Asians, and spent a few years living in "the hood" (I hate that expression, but lack a better term). I have never felt the need to prove my blackness, but others seem to think so, those people don't even show up in my world…hence my statement on a "blackness" manual, I have never felt lacking in my culture. As for picking the college that I did, for my major it was one of the best universities in the west and I didn't want to venture to far from home and I also wanted the "full" college experience, that is what I didn't stay in CA and go to FIDM, Otis/Parsons (now just Otis) or Cal Arts. I agree that my blackness and my culture aren't choices and if they were choices…guess what I wouldn't change a damn thing about my life, but its part of my me, I will never be defined by the color of my skin…to me that is to inhibiting. I think we are staying the same thing just coming from two different angles and experiences.

Yes and I wasn't debating your point or saying you were wrong for feeling the way you do. My comments were more closely related to yours than others. So Beatheeeeee

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally posted by AKA_Monet
For I am indescribably, undefinable, and indefinite...

Just like everyone else........


Most people will say this but the more different and unpredictable people claim to be, the more they are like EVERYONE ELSE who claims to be different and unpredictable.

Humans are very much the same and predictable. This is why we have patterns of human behavior with slight variations within and across individuals.

Imagine a world without this. There would be little to nothing bringing us together and allowing us to relate to our MANY commonalities.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally posted by Rudey
Like Michael Jackson?

-Rudey

Like a man who doesn't need a tan. Figure it out.