The Break Up of America

[DeltaSigStan]

Originally posted by Rudey
How about you tell the middle and upper classes not to offer work to illegal immigrants, not have their houses and gardens built and tended by them, etc.?

-Rudey

Then who'll pick the lettuce?

I'm serious, the argument in Cali is always "These immigrant migrant workers are the backbone of our economy, because they work dirt cheap doing a job others wouldn't. If we didn't have them, our ecnomy would fail."

[Kevin]

Originally posted by Rudey
How about you tell the middle and upper classes not to offer work to illegal immigrants, not have their houses and gardens built and tended by them, etc.?

-Rudey

The illegals might think twice about coming here if they learn that they will be refused hospital treatment when they are injured on the job.

They might think twice about bringing their kids here if they know our schools won't accept illegal immigrant students.

I don't realistically think that we have a prayer of convincing people not to have their lawns mowed by the cheapest folks out there (and often, these folks aren't all that cheap). Sometimes, the best solution available for a problem goes through the government.

[Rudey]

Originally posted by ktsnake
The illegals might think twice about coming here if they learn that they will be refused hospital treatment when they are injured on the job.

They might think twice about bringing their kids here if they know our schools won't accept illegal immigrant students.

I don't realistically think that we have a prayer of convincing people not to have their lawns mowed by the cheapest folks out there (and often, these folks aren't all that cheap). Sometimes, the best solution available for a problem goes through the government.

Right.

So basically unofficial and underground systems should now be encouraged.

-Rudey

[Kevin]

Originally posted by Rudey
Right.

So basically unofficial and underground systems should now be encouraged.

-Rudey

Honestly, I don't care what they do as long as it doesn't cost me money.

[Rudey]

Originally posted by ktsnake
Honestly, I don't care what they do as long as it doesn't cost me money.

Yeah some days I like to live in special bubbles where I make rules for the universe too

-Rudey

[Kevin]

Originally posted by Rudey
Yeah some days I like to live in special bubbles where I make rules for the universe too

-Rudey

I can say what I want. It doesn't mean it'll ever happen. My bubble kicks your bubble's ass. Your illegals work for $7.00/hr plus benefits. Mine work for a bowl of rice and some band aids.

[Rudey]

Originally posted by ktsnake
I can say what I want. It doesn't mean it'll ever happen. My bubble kicks your bubble's ass. Your illegals work for $7.00/hr plus benefits. Mine work for a bowl of rice and some band aids.

In my bubble only supermodels work for me and I repay them with sexual favors.

-Rudey

[Kevin]

Originally posted by Rudey
In my bubble only supermodels work for me and I repay them with sexual favors.

-Rudey

Want to trade bubbles?

[DeltAlum]

Originally posted by ktsnake
Want to trade bubbles?

No, only the contents.

[James]

Multiculturalism may very well have been a prime contributing factor to the downfall of the roman empire.

Originally posted by RACooper
My point was that even prior to Augustus there were Roman writers that consitantly wrote about moral and social decay brought on by the divergent ethinc groups within the Roman state... and this train of criticism continued right up until the end, a full 400+ years later... but ultimately it wasn't the different ethinc groups within Roman society that caused the "fall" of Rome...

Just as there has been people who have written in the past (US & Canada) that the differing ethnic groups are weakening the respective countries... they have blamed differing groups over the years as well, but the prevailing thought is always "they" are not "us", and yet "they" become "us" as new groups arrive or emerge... will these many ethnic groups casue the break-up or collapse of the state? I don't think so...

[RACooper]

Originally posted by James
Multiculturalism may very well have been a prime contributing factor to the downfall of the roman empire.

In what way? Political corroption and rampant inflation due to the ever increase pay-outs to the military crippled the Roman's defense and infastructure... I don't see how the many diverse cultures played a significant role in Rome's collapse.

[Taualumna]

I'm not familiar with Roman history, but many people who are against multiculturalism feel that the government has to bow down to new cultures, by allowing them to keep their culture within reason. Rob, have you heard of the sharia law issue in Ontario? There were articles about this in The Toronto Star last month on how Muslims in Canada are divided as to whether a "watered down" version should be allowed in Ontario. Apparently Queen's Park has already passed a bill allowing it, making Ontario the only jurisdiction in North America to do so.

Edited to fix a spelling mistake

[RACooper]

I am familiar with the issue...

First I don't believe any culture should be catered to more than any other culture... I really don't know all of the issues behind the drive for the recognition of this law, but it does have precedence: Native Canadian legal automonmy on the reserves an only for specific legal issues...

Now if you look at this precedence the you can see one distinct difference - juristiction. You know exactly where the Native Canadian's have legal and more importantly geographical juristiction. If a minor legal matter concerns happenings on a reserve, the Band Council has authority, where-as if the legal matter stems from actions off of the reserve then local or provincial authorities have juristiction; and at any time decisions or rulings can be appealed at provicial or fedral level by either party. I haven't seen enough information to pass judgement with this issue, but I don't see how it can work without coming into conflict with other local, provincial, or federal authorities...

An example of that was the case of the religious community that advocated some pretty harsh corpral punishments for children in the community (out by Ottawa)... they argued that religion and tradition gave them the right to enforce their practices... but they lost in courts ultimately.

[Kevin]

It might be fun to compare the US to the Roman empire. At the end of the day, there is really no comparison. Two completely different entities.

The Romans occupied far more territory than the US currently does. At the same time, their soldiers were getting from A to B at a maximum of about 4 miles per hour.

At the time, Guerilla warfare was almost unheard of and of course, there was no UN.

The problems and challenges facing the US are VASTLY different than those facing Rome. It might be fun to draw parallels, but there really aren't any.

I don't think the Canadians are going to come south and sack Washington D.C. anytime soon.

Damned barbarians.

[RACooper]

Originally posted by ktsnake
It might be fun to compare the US to the Roman empire. At the end of the day, there is really no comparison. Two completely different entities.

The Romans occupied far more territory than the US currently does. At the same time, their soldiers were getting from A to B at a maximum of about 4 miles per hour.

At the time, Guerilla warfare was almost unheard of and of course, there was no UN.

The problems and challenges facing the US are VASTLY different than those facing Rome. It might be fun to draw parallels, but there really aren't any.

I don't think the Canadians are going to come south and sack Washington D.C. anytime soon.

Damned barbarians.

Well I drew the comparsion because it is an example most are familiar with... I could have compared the US and the British Empire as well... and still the arguement would remain the same...

As for the comparisons to military ability, I thought it was somewhat approprate... but had forces stationed in "hot spots" and both were used to stablize regions.. as for guerrilla warfare, while not termed as such (that wasn't until the Napoleonic Wars) there was still a problem with rebellious peoples and states... a good example would be the Boudicca uprising or the many uprisings in Palestine.

As for parallels... hey it was the Founding Fathers that drew the comparisons in the first place... Roman Republican politics are very similar to recent (past 50 years) US politics - in terms of needed wealth, public image, hot button issues, trade concerns, and public opinon. Also the Romans wrote extensive treasties on issues that concerned them.. read for example the works of Juvenal... he was raging against cultural decay, immigrants and non-Romans taking jobs, concerned about decline society's morals, deploring the acceptance of same-sex relationships, decrying government corruption, and was worried about a declining economy... any of these sound familiar? Sometimes you can gain insight into to current events by looking at how they have been debated and dealt with in the past...

As for Canadians looting Washington DC... nah once was enough, nice to see you fixed up the place with a nice coat of paint.