Chick-fil-a Support Day and Free Speech

[agzg]

Originally Posted by sigmadiva

And as I stated, for me it does.

It just deeply offends me when White gays act like they are the same "type" of minority that they can equate with being Black or Hispanic.

What I see is White gays do a very good job of trying to convince people that just because gays can't get married, then they are a minority that is akin to Blacks with respect to slavery and the after-effects of slavery in this country. I never buy it.

As I stated before, being Black and being gay are not the same thing with respect to being a minority.

But what about the Black gays? Can the Black gays win the Oppression Olympics? What about the wild card, Black transgendered women?

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

White homosexual men and white lesbians have always been able to use white privilege which includes socioeconomic status, education, hiring, wages, and salary. In certain environments, one's sexual orientation and sexuality can be "hidden" whereas race, ethnicity, and gender are darn near impossible to hide.

Do you see how dumb it is to attempt to rank oppressions? Inequalities do not have to be the exact same in order for them to coexist and for all of them to be legitimate.

Exactly. I hope you saw the facetiousness in my comment.

[sigmadiva]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

And that is your problem.

I accept that. Which is why whenever a White gay tries to convince me that we suffer / have suffered the same injustice, I will say no.

Its an issue that I have chosen to take a stand on. Yours may be broader than mine.

Short list of power minorities:

1. Women--sexism, misogyny, patriarchy
2. Racial and ethnic minorities--racism and discrimination
3. LGBT--heterosexism and genderism
4. People with physical conditions--disability discrimination
5. Age groups (50+ in many contexts)--ageism

Back to the real discussion.

I agree with this list.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by agzg

But what about the Black gays? Can the Black gays win the Oppression Olympics? What about the wild card, Black transgendered women?

On a serious note, Black LGBT are a double minority. There are community groups and research about how Black LGBT have double minority statuses. Many feel rejected by the Black community and by the LGBT community.

The Oppression Olympics.

Originally Posted by sigmadiva

I accept that.


I agree with this list.

LOL. You are being strange and random. If you agree with my short list, the point you are making is moot.

[sigmadiva]

Originally Posted by agzg

But what about the Black gays? Can the Black gays win the Oppression Olympics? What about the wild card, Black transgendered women?

Yes, they suffer a double 'whammy' - being Black and gay.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by AGDee

Exactly. I hope you saw the facetiousness in my comment.

LOL. Nah, you have to be more obvious with the facetiousness when discussing power and oppression.

[sigmadiva]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

LOL. You are being strange and random. If you agree with my short list, the point you are making is moot.

Perhaps....


My point is, in terms of minority, the idea that Whites consider themselves a minority is truly laughable to me me. As a group, they exercise more power and influence than anyone else. So I ask them, 'Where is the suffering?'

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by sigmadiva

My point is, in terms of minority, the idea that Whites consider themselves a minority is truly laughable to me me. As a group, they exercise more power and influence than anyone else. So I ask them, 'Where is the suffering?'

If you agree with my short list, your posts are moot. You are chasing yourself around for no reason.

[agzg]

Originally Posted by sigmadiva

Perhaps....


My point is, in terms of minority, the idea that Whites consider themselves a minority is truly laughable to me me. As a group, they exercise more power and influence than anyone else. So I ask them, 'Where is the suffering?'

This is all a long way of entertaining myself to the point that there's always someone more oppressed than someone else. And it's a good thing to recognize that. But this discussion does not relate (in current terms) to other minorities.

Here are some comparisons I will let fly in a discussion without calling you an asshole and awarding you a gold medal in mental gymnastics at the 2012 GreekChat Oppression Olympics:

1. Discussions relating to gender inequality and pointing out the intersection between race and gender and its effect on gender equality (in fact, I would have agreed with your comment outlining how Black women get a bum wrap had you left out the douchetastic "pointing out someone else's privilege" angle, which, btw, I'm already aware of, thanks - don't forget that you're probably more privileged than a lot of Black women, as well).

1a. This also goes for discussions relating the experience of being a member of the LGBT community AND either a gender minority (the perception of lesbians versus gay men) OR/AND a racial minority and the effect it has on equality, although that can get confusing (what are we discussing now?).

2. Discussions relating to specific policies directed toward different minorities which could be related - "Stop and Frisk" laws in NYC v. "Show us your papers" laws in Arizona.

3. Discussions drawing comparisons between individual actions/memberships and their speech relating to minorities and individual actions that you may take against them (boycotting them, calling them idiots, whatever), but nothing else about any shared or not shared experiences between minorities.

4. Discussions TBD. I'll determine right now that this discussion does not fall under option #3. And I'll tell you why it won't:

DrPhil made a comment calling the LGBT community (if you can call it that - that's like making the comparison that all gender equality advocates are feminists) are a power minority. This is true. You perceived her to be drawing a direct comparison between the LGBT minority and Black or Hispanic Minorities and their experiences as minorities. I said "What." because that was fucking stupid (you noticed there was no question mark, there, right? I wasn't questioning you. I was calling your post irrelevant). You pointed out my privilege to me and engaged in some athletics to point out that you're clearly more oppressed than me. You continue to do so. If White gay men are saying they have it harder than you, TO YOU, you have my full permission to slap them right in the face. But frankly, harping on and on about it makes me think that you have a problem with gay people.

Do you have a problem with gay people?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by agzg

But frankly, harping on and on about it makes me think that you have a problem with gay people.

Do you have a problem with gay people?

Either that or she's Andre Turner. LOL.

On the real, despite how random sigmadiva is being, what she is saying is nothing new. There has always been this ranking and battle of oppressions. Many Black people were and still are tired of other groups saying that they are oppressed/power minority and using the racial and ethnic dynamics as a comparison. When white homosexuals say "we're just like you," it does attempt to make oppressions the exact same rather than just co-existing. It is as annoying as that thread where the people were comparing their circumstances to that of Blacks.

[agzg]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Either that or she's Andre Turner. LOL.

On the real, despite how random sigmadiva is being, what she is saying is nothing new. There has always been this ranking and battle of oppressions. Many Black people were and still are tired of other groups saying that they are oppressed and using the racial and ethnic dynamics as a comparison. When white homosexuals say "we're just like you," it does attempt to place oppressions the exact same rather than just co-existing. It is as annoying as that thread where the people were comparing their oppression to that of Blacks.

Of course it is. I just find the Oppression Olympics really annoying.

[DrPhil]

Yeah well we entertained sigmadiva's posts. LOL.

[sigmadiva]

Originally Posted by agzg

Do you have a problem with gay people?

Kinda, sorta no.

What people do in their lives is their business. But, since homosexuality has been turned into a 'hot button' political issue, it is not unreasonable for people to take sides.

Christianity is very deeply rooted in this country. And, in Christianity homosexuality is seen as sinful, along with other acts. So, if you ask me as a Christian, do I have a problem with gays, then yes I do because it does go against the Bible. I strive to live as close to God's word as possible.

But, I'm also wise enough to recognize that not everyone is a Christian. I'm also wise enough to know that people have the right to their own beliefs even though they differ from mine. So, in that respect, then I say live and let live.

Personally, I'm heterosexual. So for me it is hard to comprehend being attracted to someone of the same sex.

If someone says they are not in support of gay marriage, as marriage defined by the Bible, then they have every right to express that openly in the same way that someone would express the opposite view.

Going back to the original point of this thread - I think if the CEO of CFA was not the CEO, but some random guy, then this would not make news. The reason this made news, IMO, is because this was said by someone who runs a multi-billion dollar company. Gays are seen as a political group that exercises its power and influence (read money). So, the idea of someone offending a political group like that ruffled feathers. Bottom line - money is involved. If money was not involved then I don't think anyone would care. Gay, or not.

[sigmadiva]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Yeah well we entertained sigmadiva's posts. LOL.

Thank you! It just prolonged what I need to do - go wash some dishes!

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by sigmadiva

Christianity is very deeply rooted in this country. And, in Christianity homosexuality is seen as sinful, along with other acts. So, if you ask me as a Christian, do I have a problem with gays, then yes I do because it does go against the Bible. I strive to live as close to God's word as possible.

But, I'm also wise enough to recognize that not everyone is a Christian. I'm also wise enough to know that people have the right to their own beliefs even though they differ from mine. So, in that respect, then I say live and let live.

I am also a Christian and I do not consider homosexuality sinful or wrong. I also challenge people who quote the Bible for their stance on homosexuality.

Originally Posted by sigmadiva

Thank you! It just prolonged what I need to do - go wash some dishes!

No, you will not end your random posts with a dish washing flounce.