Advice to incoming freshmen on campus safety...

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by fantASTic

Sorry, but bullshit. College women are THE SAFEST group of women in the WORLD when it comes to rape and sexual assault. Check out Who Stole Feminism? How Women Have Betrayed Women by Christina Hoff Sommers. That statistic about 1 in 4 women getting assaulted at some point in their life is a LIE, and it has even been admitted by the director of the study that it is not true.

Fearmongering does no good. CrackerBarrel, I agree with you on this.

Also: not every campus has a free shuttle..I go to a large state school and we don't.

If college women were the safest bunch in the world, then campuses would have no reason to host the safety/self defense programs that they do. Maybe 1 in 4 is extreme, but it's foolish to think that it doesn't happen.

And no one is fearmongering. It's better to have a sober buddy/use the shuttle/etc than to run around saying "Hey, I'm safe on this campus! I think I'll walk 20 blocks by myself tonight!" ... just to be on the safe side.

[CrackerBarrel]

They have the safety/self defense programs to make parents feel better about letting their little girl go off to live on her own, to reassure nervous girls, and to make it look like they were being proactive in case god forbid anything ever did happen.

To use the fact that they host a safety seminar to imply they must not be safe is kind of silly. You certainly wouldn't agree if I said there was no risk of sexual assault in prison or else they would host a safety talk, so why should the flip-side of that argument be any more convincing?

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by CrackerBarrel

They have the safety/self defense programs to make parents feel better about letting their little girl go off to live on her own, to reassure nervous girls, and to make it look like they were being proactive in case god forbid anything ever did happen.

To use the fact that they host a safety seminar to imply they must not be safe is kind of silly. You certainly wouldn't agree if I said there was no risk of sexual assault in prison or else they would host a safety talk, so why should the flip-side of that argument be any more convincing?

So you're saying rape and sexual assault do not exist on college campuses? And the ONLY reason that self defense programs exist is to please mom and dad?

[CrackerBarrel]

Rape and sexual assault exist at lower rates on campus than they do in the general community. So no, I'm not arguing that they don't exist, but you all are making it seem like people are going into a war zone rather than a college campus. The fact of the matter is that colleges and college towns usually have a fairly large police presence and it's overall a safer environment than other similarly sized cities.

And it's not the only reason, but yes, reassuring parents and scared freshmen is the primary reason colleges teach self defense programs.

Like I said, maybe there are some horrible campuses where you can never let your guard down, but my only experience has been that about the worst consequence will be beer goggles or maybe a drunk shouting match.

[Kevin]

I would predict that many of these statistics are so low because rape/sexual assault on the college campus is likely under-reported. Being the victim of such a thing is something victims often perceive to be stigmatizing. That can be even more enhanced if the rape/sexual assault occurs within a fairly insular community such as the greek life community.

[33girl]

NO.

What fantASTic said is correct....the 1 in 4 statistic is complete bull and has nothing to do with rape being underreported. This statistic is advanced by women who think things like being catcalled at constitute "sexual assault."

A self defense program is essential for every woman - we had one in high school - but saying that their existence means there's a high rape/assault rate is like saying 1 in 4 elementary school kids is going to die in a fire because they have fire drills.

[Kevin]

If you're responding to me 33, I never said that the 1:4 statistic was anywhere near accurate. I do think that sexual assault is probably underreported though.

[33girl]

Well, it depends what you define as sexual assault. (No, I don't want to go there.)

[Tinia2]

Originally Posted by Kevin

I would predict that many of these statistics are so low because rape/sexual assault on the college campus is likely under-reported. Being the victim of such a thing is something victims often perceive to be stigmatizing. That can be even more enhanced if the rape/sexual assault occurs within a fairly insular community such as the Greek life community.

I would agree with you Kevin. What one person, in their experience and point of view, may call an unfortunate hook up may be called by others date rape.
Over the weekend I found out that one of my relatives went though rush and is now a member of the Greek Community. While a smart and sharp person, we did have a little conversation about keeping ones guard up at all times.
And if one is truly interested in getting informed, try searching topics campus rape,date rape or campus security.
I checked my own campus and just the two unreported date rapes that I personally know of would change the reported statistics. And I would find it rather difficult to believe that I am the only one on my campus that knows of sexual assaults that were not reported.

[nikki1920]

Sorry, fantASTic, I call bullshit on you. I can only speak for UNC and Bowie State (two schools I went to), and there were sexual assualts at both campuses, many of which went unreported. So I disagree with you. I never claimed that statistic. And seeing how I was a victim of an assault, I disagree with your statement that college women are the safest group of women in the world.

I don't think anyone is fearmongering, just discussing what they've seen on their own campuses.

But tomayto, tomahto.

[CrackerBarrel]

Originally Posted by nikki1920

Sorry, fantASTic, I call bullshit on you. I can only speak for UNC and Bowie State (two schools I went to), and there were sexual assualts at both campuses, many of which went unreported. So I disagree with you. I never claimed that statistic. And seeing how I was a victim of an assault, I disagree with your statement that college women are the safest group of women in the world.

I don't think anyone is fearmongering, just discussing what they've seen on their own campuses.

But tomayto, tomahto.

I'm sorry to hear that.

But I don't see anything there that goes against what myself and others are claiming. There are sexual assaults literally everywhere. Hospitals, churches, schools, colleges, towns, cities, everywhere. And the simple fact that sexual assaults do occasionally happen on college campuses is not sufficient to prove that colleges aren't safer than just being out in the public as a whole.

ETA: And on the point you and fantASTic are arguing about, the simple fact that you know of sexual assaults that have happened on campus doesn't mean that "sexual assaults are very common on most campuses" (which is word for word what you claimed). No one is denying that they occur, but they certainly aren't a common occurrence, the kind which will inevitably happen to someone if they aren't careful. That's what some people here are saying and implying, and fear-mongering seems like a pretty good description for what's going on.

[SWTXBelle]

Here's the deal - there is no safe place in society where no assaults happen. I've tried to teach my daughter to think defensively no matter where she is. It just so happens that she is about to be spending almost all her time on a college campus. Therefore, as an incoming freshman, her focus is how to be safe on a college campus. When she moves to a city to begin her career, I will bore her with advice about living in the city. It's not fear mongering - it's dealing with the situation at hand

I think there MIGHT be more assaults in a college setting simply because there is more opportunity - and so many of the students are NOT thinking defensively. But that's just a theory of mine.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

I think there MIGHT be more assaults in a college setting simply because there is more opportunity - and so many of the students are NOT thinking defensively. But that's just a theory of mine.

I completely agree.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by CrackerBarrel

Rape and sexual assault exist at lower rates on campus than they do in the general community. So no, I'm not arguing that they don't exist, but you all are making it seem like people are going into a war zone rather than a college campus. The fact of the matter is that colleges and college towns usually have a fairly large police presence and it's overall a safer environment than other similarly sized cities.

And it's not the only reason, but yes, reassuring parents and scared freshmen is the primary reason colleges teach self defense programs.

Like I said, maybe there are some horrible campuses where you can never let your guard down, but my only experience has been that about the worst consequence will be beer goggles or maybe a drunk shouting match.

If we're going to be sticklers for statistics, can you back up your claim that rapes and sexual assaults exist at lower rates?

There's nothing wrong with letting incoming freshman (who usually have never been on their own) know ways to keep themselves safe. Warning that rapes and sexual assaults DO happen is proactive. Telling women after the fact what they COULD have done is too reactive.

Originally Posted by CrackerBarrel

I'm sorry to hear that.

But I don't see anything there that goes against what myself and others are claiming. There are sexual assaults literally everywhere. Hospitals, churches, schools, colleges, towns, cities, everywhere. And the simple fact that sexual assaults do occasionally happen on college campuses is not sufficient to prove that colleges aren't safer than just being out in the public as a whole.

ETA: And on the point you and fantASTic are arguing about, the simple fact that you know of sexual assaults that have happened on campus doesn't mean that "sexual assaults are very common on most campuses" (which is word for word what you claimed). No one is denying that they occur, but they certainly aren't a common occurrence, the kind which will inevitably happen to someone if they aren't careful. That's what some people here are saying and implying, and fear-mongering seems like a pretty good description for what's going on.

The fact that you haven't experienced them on your campus does not mean that they don't frequently happen. As several have pointed out earlier, many rapes and assaults go unreported, so they happen more than you think.

[squirrely girl]

on a non-rape note, a lot of this advice applies to men as well. just because men aren't as likely to be raped doesn't mean that other occurances such as robbery/mugging or assault are out of the realm of possiblity too. walking around drunk, unaware, and alone is just a bad idea.

being safe and aware is good advice for anybody.