A Recruitment Reality Check

[indygphib]

You mean...

VeniceIsSinking = Soliloquy?

[catiebug]

So in other words...

Venice sunk.

Originally Posted by OTW

She didn't transfer schools.

VeniceIsSinking never left, guys.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by OTW

She didn't transfer schools.

VeniceIsSinking never left, guys.

Backfat is back?


BTW, that reminds me - me and all my backfat glory might be showing up on TV soon. Details forthcoming at a later date....

[Soliloquy]

I really had no intentions of coming back, until someone informed me that these speculations were being spread all over the board.

First off, I am NOT venice. I am her friend, we used to be really good friends. We attended the same school and she transfered after the final semester due to a better program being offered there. Her new school has only 3 groups to chose from and she didn't feel comfortable enough to go through rush at this particular university. Plus the program she transferred into is so demanding, she wouldnt have time anyway.

Secondly, I don't know why you would think we are the same person. So because I never came back to let you flame me after you destroyed my thread for bullcrap reasons, you decided to continue to tarnish my name? Why? Because I called certain people out for being hypocritical? Hey, guess what I said my first post? That Venice told me about the site. Didn't I just say we were good friends?

Oh and in regards to the last posts of my thread: The most negative thing I said about my greek system was that it was silly for them to promote a recruitment event without knowing 100% that it was ok for them to have it. And uh.. there's nothing wrong with saying that.. because it's the truth. I also wouldn't rely on the timelines in my thread. Maybe I left a day out? Maybe we had ice water parties in the summer? None of you know for sure. There was no reason for people to get so throughly offended by my remarks because I've never been anything but sincere and (generally) nice to people here. Especially enough so to accuse me of not being me and then to attempt to seek me out. Click my post history and lets see exactly what I've done or said that would justify an internet witch-hunt. You'll find nothing. If I HAD been rude or such, I might feel like I deserve it- but I don't deserve this treatment.

I'd ask you to kindly let the past be the past and to realize that there are more things to life that are important then someone you've never met before- a person on the internet. In the long run, how will I affect your life? Um, I probably won't. I would say nearly all of you are older than me, so once again I'll ask- how do I affect your life? You likely have established careers, families and lives. Why are you spending time on trying to figure out who I am? Especially for unjustifiable reasons.

Now I'm done. If you're that deadset on continuing to bash me- be an adult and PM me. My email provider will notify me of the message.

Originally Posted by Soliloquy

I really had no intentions of coming back, until someone informed me that these speculations were being spread all over the board.

First off, I am NOT venice. I am her friend, we used to be really good friends. We attended the same school and she transfered after the final semester due to a better program being offered there. Her new school has only 3 groups to chose from and she didn't feel comfortable enough to go through rush at this particular university. Plus the program she transferred into is so demanding, she wouldnt have time anyway.

Secondly, I don't know why you would think we are the same person. So because I never came back to let you flame me after you destroyed my thread for bullcrap reasons, you decided to continue to tarnish my name? Why? Because I called certain people out for being hypocritical? Hey, guess what I said my first post? That Venice told me about the site. Didn't I just say we were good friends?

Oh and in regards to the last posts of my thread: The most negative thing I said about my greek system was that it was silly for them to promote a recruitment event without knowing 100% that it was ok for them to have it. And uh.. there's nothing wrong with saying that.. because it's the truth. I also wouldn't rely on the timelines in my thread. Maybe I left a day out? Maybe we had ice water parties in the summer? None of you know for sure. There was no reason for people to get so throughly offended by my remarks because I've never been anything but sincere and (generally) nice to people here. Especially enough so to accuse me of not being me and then to attempt to seek me out. Click my post history and lets see exactly what I've done or said that would justify an internet witch-hunt. You'll find nothing. If I HAD been rude or such, I might feel like I deserve it- but I don't deserve this treatment.

I'd ask you to kindly let the past be the past and to realize that there are more things to life that are important then someone you've never met before- a person on the internet. In the long run, how will I affect your life? Um, I probably won't. I would say nearly all of you are older than me, so once again I'll ask- how do I affect your life? You likely have established careers, families and lives. Why are you spending time on trying to figure out who I am? Especially for unjustifiable reasons.

Now I'm done. If you're that deadset on continuing to bash me- be an adult and PM me. My email provider will notify me of the message.

It's funny how it was one of your "GC friends" who outed you. Apparently you signed your first name to a PM you sent her. (GCers, be careful of who you trust on GC) She was able to find you through your campus network, and oh hey -- the girl in your MySpace pictures looked EXACTLY like the girl in the Wedding Gowns thread with the tattoos! I don't understand why you just couldn't keep posting as VeniceIsSinking. Because AlphaFrog said you had backfat?

I'd post the links here, but now that really would be violations of the ToS . I remember seeing the links posted and I thought to myself, "Un-Freaking-Believable." I wish I could take credit for them, but I can't. My guess is that people are so interested in you because they don't want you joining their organization. They'll stop at nothing to make sure that happens -- even if it means finding out your identity so they can warn their sisters on your campus with multiple no-recs.

But hey, I'll admit that you have a lot of balls. You came back "one last time" to try and make people believe that you're not VeniceIsSinking. Nice attempt.

Best wishes and enjoy your new "elite position," #507! (And thanks for so conveniently editing your post without the 'OTW')

[Tippiechick]

Originally Posted by violetpretty

Soliloquy and VeniceIsSinking attended the same school, but Soliloquy noted that VeniceIsSinking transferred schools and decided not to go through recruitment in this post. Who knows if VeniceIsSinking transferred to the school that AlterEgo goes to, but by "decided to not go through recruitment" I would presume that Venice's new school has a fall FMR and not spring like AlterEgo's school.

Yeah... No.

See, OTW is correct. VIS didn't transfer. Her and Soliloquy both signed their pms with the same name. One was sent to me a LONG time ago and another to someone else. We knew something was up with them having the same name. Thing is -- there were SO many other people who also knew something was up that it was easy to put the pieces together.

So, Soliloquy Is Sinking, you can deny, deny, deny, but you are the one who outed yourself by signing your name to your pm's under both usernames. That isn't what bothers me. I can understand why you used another name. But, to lie and say that VIS transferred is just plain dumb. And, your attitude regarding sororities and how they will want you now SUCKS. THAT is why people on here were determined to keep you out of their group. And, don't worry -- my group isn't on your campus. It wasn't me. It was just a ton of others who didn't want to call you a sister. I am guessing that you being married didn't help things, either.

You want to know why us mean sorority girls don't like you and what it was that made us want to find out about you? Read a summary of your posts and decide for yourself.
http://greekchat.com/gcforums/showpo...13&postcount=1 The part about disliking a philanthropy was awful.

http://greekchat.com/gcforums/showpo...&postcount=171

[Zillini]

Back to the original post. Like everyone else it saddens me when I hear a recruitment story that did not end happily. However something jumped out at me in the original post that I feel is worth mentioning.

Originally Posted by AlterEgo

As far as grades, even if you have the required 2.5 or 2.75 or whatever it may be, it does matter how high/low it is.

This line suggests to me the OP had the minimum Panhellenic avg to go through Recruitment but probably not much higher. It's a mistake for anyone to use that as a guide especially on a competitive campus. Instead you should find out what the previous few semesters Panhellenic GPA was and what the Chapter(s) that interests you earned.

If those Chapter(s) have a 3.0 GPA or higher, it's a fairly safe assumption they'll be looking for PNM's with at least a 3.0 from HS. One also assumes that college level courses will be harder than HS. The Chapter(s) want members who are capable of succeeding in college and contributing positively to their overall GPA rankings.

[KappaKittyCat]

Originally Posted by MaggieXi

As for the GPA requirement, we have often seen on these boards that even if a PNM has a minimum of a 2.75 to sign up for recruitment, each individual sorority may have their own minimum which is often higher than the minimum of a 2.75. Often sororities will not disclose that information because it is part of their membership selection.

The bolded bit upsets me. I know that each school has its minimum GPA and each sorority has its national minimum, which is often higher, and that some individual chapters may have even higher GPA requirements than what nationals sets. However, it bothers me when the minimum for each chapter, regardless of at what level it's set, isn't disclosed to PNMs beforehand. They should know that going in so they can make educated decisions about the chapters and not get their hopes up unrealistically. I think having that info privileged because it's "part of MS" is, frankly, BS.

Now I can imagine another scenario: a chapter has a minimum GPA of 3.0. They've already made all their cuts after first round and still have more women than release figures allow them to invite back, so they go through and cut those with the lowest GPAs until they reduce the list to its appropriate size. Say they weren't able to stop until they hit 3.15, making that their effective chapter minimum. That number, I agree, would be part of MS. If that's what was being talked about here, then I'm cool. But for a chapter to say, "We have a minimum GPA and it's confidential, sorry," is really crappy.

[breathesgelatin]

Originally Posted by KappaKittyCat

The bolded bit upsets me. I know that each school has its minimum GPA and each sorority has its national minimum, which is often higher, and that some individual chapters may have even higher GPAs requirements than what nationals sets. However, it bothers me when the minimum for each chapter, regardless of at what level it's set, isn't disclosed to PNMs beforehand. They should know that going in so they can make educated decisions about the chapters and not get their hopes up unrealistically. I think having that info privileged because it's "part of MS" is, frankly, BS.

Now I can imagine another scenario: a chapter has a minimum GPA of 3.0. They've already made all their cuts after first round and still have more women than release figures allow them to invite back, so they go through and cut those with the lowest GPAs until they reduce the list to its appropriate size. Say they weren't able to stop until they hit 3.15, making that their effective chapter minimum. That number, I agree, would be part of MS. If that's what was being talked about here, then I'm cool. But for a chapter to say, "We have a minimum GPA and its confidential, sorry," is really crappy.

Agreed. W&L did disclose all the individual chapter's requirements beforehand. It always shocked me that some PNMs who met the bare minimum Panhel requirement to participate (2.0), but fell below all the individual chapter's GPA (I think the lowest one was a 2.25--actually maybe all the groups but one had a 2.25) requirements would still participate!

[MaggieXi]

Originally Posted by KappaKittyCat

The bolded bit upsets me. I know that each school has its minimum GPA and each sorority has its national minimum, which is often higher, and that some individual chapters may have even higher GPAs requirements than what nationals sets. However, it bothers me when the minimum for each chapter, regardless of at what level it's set, isn't disclosed to PNMs beforehand. They should know that going in so they can make educated decisions about the chapters and not get their hopes up unrealistically. I think having that info privileged because it's "part of MS" is, frankly, BS.

Now I can imagine another scenario: a chapter has a minimum GPA of 3.0. They've already made all their cuts after first round and still have more women than release figures allow them to invite back, so they go through and cut those with the lowest GPAs until they reduce the list to its appropriate size. Say they weren't able to stop until they hit 3.15, making that their effective chapter minimum. That number, I agree, would be part of MS. If that's what was being talked about here, then I'm cool. But for a chapter to say, "We have a minimum GPA and its confidential, sorry," is really crappy.

I understand what you are saying, but if it is part of membership selection -- as I have heard it is for some sororities, its up to the individual sorority to make that decision whether or not to advise the PNMs. Bottom line that membership selection is confidential, some people will say that thats crappy too.

Like I said before, I think I know where the OP goes to school and the GPAs for almost all the sororities are all over a 3.0. Obviously, some must be lower than a 3.0 to get that average, but when you have a large percentage of PNMs with high GPAs, unfortunately, the girls with lower ones could be very well on the bubble of being cut. Plus I am just putting it out there, but girls with lower GPAs could be scrutenized more carefully at more competitive campus'. You can have a girl with a 2.75, the minimum to rush, but she also holds an student government position, is involved with the student newspaper and plays a sport. Whereas, you can have a girl with a 2.75 who isn't involved in anything.

I would think most of us would agree that grade cuts usually come early on. The OP in this situation was cross-cut on bid day.

[KappaKittyCat]

Originally Posted by MaggieXi

I understand what you are saying, but if it is part of membership selection -- as I have heard it is for some sororities, its up to the individual sorority to make that decision whether or not to advise the PNMs. Bottom line that membership selection is confidential, some people will say that thats crappy too.

I don't think MS's confidentiality is crappy. But if there are arbitrary metrics for choosing PNMs, why can't those be public? It just seems off to me. Who are these organizations that have a confidential minimum GPA?

Like I said before, I think I know where the OP goes to school and the GPAs for almost all the sororities are all over a 3.0. Obviously, some must be lower than a 3.0 to get that average, but when you have a large percentage of PNMs with high GPAs, unfortunately, the girls with lower ones could be very well on the bubble of being cut.

No disagreement here; that's exactly the point I was trying to make above.

Plus I am just putting it out there, but girls with lower GPAs could be scrutenized more carefully at more competitive campus'. You can have a girl with a 2.75, the minimum to rush, but she also holds an student government position, is involved with the student newspaper and plays a sport. Whereas, you can have a girl with a 2.75 who isn't involved in anything.

Again, no disagreement here.

I would think most of us would agree that grade cuts usually come early on.

Yes, as they should. There's no reason to hold out false hope. My chapter always tried to make them at first round if at all possible.

The OP in this situation was cross-cut on bid day.

I understand. I really wasn't commenting on her situation.

[Zillini]

Originally Posted by KappaKittyCat

Now I can imagine another scenario: a chapter has a minimum GPA of 3.0. They've already made all their cuts after first round and still have more women than release figures allow them to invite back, so they go through and cut those with the lowest GPAs until they reduce the list to its appropriate size. Say they weren't able to stop until they hit 3.15, making that their effective chapter minimum. That number, I agree, would be part of MS. If that's what was being talked about here, then I'm cool. But for a chapter to say, "We have a minimum GPA and it's confidential, sorry," is really crappy.

Certainly that scenario is a possibility, but I have never seen it and I doubt I ever will. IMHO nobody likes "automatic cuts" because they're just that, automatic. Even with the huge numbers of PNM's we have going through recruitment on our campus, actives still want a say in who gets cut and who gets invited back via scores/voting. I can't tell you how many angry actives I've seen over the years who's fav PNM was released because her GPA wasn't good enough.

Besides most Chapters that I know of (anecdotal proof only) have their minimum GPA set well before Recruitment even starts. Whether it is via their I/natl guidelines, bylaws or some other local/internal policy, once it's set it's a done deal. There is no changing it.

Like I said earlier, the best way to estimate minimum GPA requirements is to look at the last several semesters of Panhellenic and individual Chapters GPAs. Being on a campus with a highly competitive recruitment typically means it's competitive in other areas of Greek/campus life as well. It's a fairly safe bet that the battle for grade rankings is incredibly intense. Being #1, close to the top or having leaped up a bunch of positions in a year is a great "selling" point during Recruitment. It shows how committed a Chapter is to scholastics.

[KappaKittyCat]

Originally Posted by Zillini

Like I said earlier, the best way to estimate minimum GPA requirements is to look at the last several semesters of Panhellenic and individual Chapters GPAs. Being on a campus with a highly competitive recruitment typically means it's competitive in other areas of Greek/campus life as well. It's a fairly safe bet that the battle for grade rankings is incredibly intense. Being #1, close to the top or having leaped up a bunch of positions in a year is a great "selling" point during Recruitment. It shows how committed a Chapter is to scholastics.

Oh, I agree completely. I think that if a PNM is rushing and her GPA isn't the greatest coming from HS, or if she has college grades and is below the averages, she should have a realistic chat with herself that maybe her grades aren't good enough... especially if she's below the PH average and is shooting for one of the top chapters in terms of grades.

[KappaKittyCat]

Originally Posted by indygphib

You mean...

VeniceIsSinking = Soliloquy?

Wait... you mean, Ben is Glory?

(Name that show! )

[AOIIalum]

Originally Posted by KappaKittyCat

Wait... you mean, Ben is Glory?

(Name that show! )

Buffy the Vampire Slayer!

<hijack>Do we suspect there may be some kind of connection between Ben and Glory?</hijack>