14 year old child died a day after being hit, kicked, kneed and restrained by guards

[AKA_Monet]

Originally posted by SKEEphistAKAte
It's always a great feeling to be in the presence of so many beautiful, intelligent, socially conscious black students. Black college students who took time out of their weekend and their exam studies to fight for a good cause. It was moving and reassuring to see that the future of the African American community is in the hands of people who will not take injustice lying down. Damn right we had lots to smile about. But you wouldn't know anything about that.

ETA: Be assured that your people's attempts at oppression will never break the Black spirit.

Soror Skee-

Don't argue with him, he's just trying to hit on you...

Rudesque translation: "All the ladies are attractive in the picture"...

[SKEEphistAKAte]

Crowd Pic:



(my classmates are sending me their pics individually so I will continue to post as I receive them)

[SKEEphistAKAte]

Tallahassee Democrat Coverage of the Protest:

http://www.tallahasseedemocrat.com/a...arams=Itemnr=1

I'm in picture 14 (me and everyone else in Tallahassee)

[RedefinedDiva]

From the clip, in which I see jumps where things may have been edited out, all I see is their efforts to escort him somewhere. Since I know that this young man subsequently died, what looks like resistance is probably inability to stand/walk and fighting for his life.

When I looked at the clip, I didn't have a problem with it because I used to work at a detention center and am used to seeing children restrained. Therefore, I didn't initially see the issue. However, I (now) know that what was released to the public is only what happened AFTER the beating. So, considering that he probably was in pain, suffering, angry, dying...., their actions were excessive.

The problem is that people don't get the prober training to deal with problem children. You MUST be prepared to work with them. They WILL push you to the limit. Trust me, I've been there. These "officers" or whatever they were, couldn't have been properly trained.

Will the FULL clip eve be released?

[PhrozenGenius]

IN REFERENCE TO THE TRAGEDY THAT OCCURED IN FLORIDA:

There is a very fine line between restraint and brutality in certain situations. Through my experiences with law enforcement, sometimes the violence continuum is elevated to the point where brutal tactics are used to restrain particularly resistant/violent individuals.

In this case the line was obviously crossed. I felt like I was watching the Rodney King beating all over again. It was utterly disgusting and ridiculous for them to continue beating on a 14 year old child after he was obviously incoherent and seemingly unconscious.

I hope that the Black Law Student Association continues to tackle this issue. My respect for BLSA grows more and more by the day.

[Ideal08]

Look, y'all, don't start none, won't be none. If y'all wanna start race riots and all that other crap, do it somewhere else. Here is NOT the place. This Ave is a PEACEFUL avenue. I don't care if you think I'm censoring the conversation or what. Take it up with John. Living in Cincinnati has lowered my tolerance for this type of BS. Keep that crap over in the poorly moderated forums if you must, but DO NOT bring it into THIS forum.

Please continue on with your regularly scheduled thread.

Soror SKEE, thanks for all the info you provided. I LOVE the crowd pic. Please continue to keep us informed.

[SKEEphistAKAte]

Originally posted by RedefinedDiva
From the clip, in which I see jumps where things may have been edited out, all I see is their efforts to escort him somewhere. Since I know that this young man subsequently died, what looks like resistance is probably inability to stand/walk and fighting for his life.

When I looked at the clip, I didn't have a problem with it because I used to work at a detention center and am used to seeing children restrained. Therefore, I didn't initially see the issue. However, I (now) know that what was released to the public is only what happened AFTER the beating. So, considering that he probably was in pain, suffering, angry, dying...., their actions were excessive.

The problem is that people don't get the prober training to deal with problem children. You MUST be prepared to work with them. They WILL push you to the limit. Trust me, I've been there. These "officers" or whatever they were, couldn't have been properly trained.

Will the FULL clip eve be released?

In undergrad I worked at a mental hospital and I am also used to seeing people be restrained. However, people are only supposed to be restrained when they are resisting- when they are at risk to themselves or others. It is obvious in this video that this young man was going in and out of consciousness, he couldn't even stand up-there was no resistance and no threat of flight or risk to himself or others, therefore there was no need for the excessive attempts at restraint.

At the protest, Attorney Ben Crump noted that the officers had "shoved several ammonia tablets up his nose" in attempts to revive him. If you look at the video you can see him being kneed, you can see his arms being twisted, officers falling on top of him. It is ridiculous and totally excessive.

I am not sure whether the entire tape will ever be released. It seems that many of the news stations are removing this limited footage from their websites. More may come out during/after the trial.

ETA: Initially the news reports stated that Martin Lee Anderson entered the boot camp one day and died the next. Attorney Crump noted that this young man entered the boot camp and the parents were called about 2 HOURS later to say that he was being taken to the local hospital.

[RedefinedDiva]

Originally posted by SKEEphistAKAte
In undergrad I worked at a mental hospital and I am also used to seeing people be restrained. However, people are only supposed to be restrained when they are resisting- when they are at risk to themselves or others. It is obvious in this video that this young man was going in and out of consciousness, he couldn't even stand up-there was no resistance and no threat of flight or risk to himself or others, therefore there was no need for the excessive attempts at restraint.

At the protest, Attorney Ben Crump noted that the officers had "shoved several ammonia tablets up his nose" in attempts to revive him. If you look at the video you can see him being kneed, you can see his arms being twisted, officers falling on top of him. It is ridiculous and totally excessive.

I am not sure whether the entire tape will ever be released. It seems that many of the news stations are removing this limited footage from their websites. More may come out during/after the trial.

ETA: Initially the news reports stated that Martin Lee Anderson entered the boot camp one day and died the next. Attorney Crump noted that this young man entered the boot camp and the parents were called about 2 HOURS later to say that he was being taken to the local hospital.

I did notice in the video that they were beating on his arm, seemingly in an attempt to get him to bend it.

This is a sad case.... I feel sorry for the young man and his family. I pray that BLSA keeps up the good fight and sees this case through to the end. I will be joining my school's BLSA chapter next year.

That group picture is great!

[nonchalant]

All these updates are truly needed and very informative. The situation is truly sad. It seems as if the world gets worse by the day. I will definitely send out prayers to the family as well as to people trying to rectify this issue. Once again, this makes you think on many levels.

Parents/Guardians with problem children that have to resort to sending their children to a camp may be very skeptical about that now. The process truly needs to change. I'm glad the camp is being closed. Credentials should be checked just like in any other business. I feel that if children are sent to camp by a judge, the parents should have a right to do a background check on the facility before admitting the child. My sister had to go to one, and I was worried the whole time she was there.

Also, the child had medical problems. There are exceptions to every rule. Why have the child doing strenuous exercises that he may not be able to handle? I'm glad the autopsy reading was reversed by a licensed individual. I figured the brutal beating caused the internal bleeding that caused the death. He was doing okay before then. Truly sick and sad.

I hope justice does prevail. I'm thankful for everyone that is participating in the protest. Hope is still alive. Civil rights leaders works were not done in vain. It's not right that no one was arrested even with the new autopsy reading. Even without that, the footage should have been enough. I leave it in God's hands.

[Gods Ivy]

Originally posted by nonchalant
All these updates are truly needed and very informative. The situation is truly sad. It seems as if the world gets worse by the day. I will definitely send out prayers to the family as well as to people trying to rectify this issue. Once again, this makes you think on many levels.

Parents/Guardians with problem children that have to resort to sending their children to a camp may be very skeptical about that now. The process truly needs to change. I'm glad the camp is being closed. Credentials should be checked just like in any other business. I feel that if children are sent to camp by a judge, the parents should have a right to do a background check on the facility before admitting the child. My sister had to go to one, and I was worried the whole time she was there.

Also, the child had medical problems. There are exceptions to every rule. Why have the child doing strenuous exercises that he may not be able to handle? I'm glad the autopsy reading was reversed by a licensed individual. I figured the brutal beating caused the internal bleeding that caused the death. He was doing okay before then. Truly sick and sad.

I hope justice does prevail. I'm thankful for everyone that is participating in the protest. Hope is still alive. Civil rights leaders works were not done in vain. It's not right that no one was arrested even with the new autopsy reading. Even without that, the footage should have been enough. I leave it in God's hands.

Amen....You said it all. During the tape I also viewed the child's arm being beat while his body was limp. If he is limp is there a continued need for restraint? And to me all off the officers/workers did not appear concerned when the ambulance appeared there were only a few that ran and seemed concerned after he had fallen several times to the ground. This whole ordeal is truly sad for the country and for the family.

[Gods Ivy]

I knew it. Great work protesters.


TAMPA, Fla. - A 14-year-old boy beaten by guards at a juvenile boot camp died because the guards suffocated him, a medical examiner said Friday.

The findings of the second autopsy on Martin Lee Anderson conflict with the initial ruling from a different medical examiner that the boy died from complications of sickle cell trait, a usually benign blood disorder.

"Martin Anderson's death was caused by suffocation due to actions of the guards at the boot camp," said Dr. Vernard Adams, who conducted the second autopsy. The boy's body was exhumed after a camp surveillance videotape surfaced showing the guards beating him the day before he died.

Adams said the suffocation was caused by hands blocking the boy's mouth, as well as the "forced inhalation of ammonia fumes" that caused his vocal cords to spasm, blocking his upper airway.

The videotape shows Anderson being kneed, struck and dragged by guards on his first day at the Bay County Sheriff's boot camp for juvenile offenders. He was eventually taken to a Pensacola hospital, where he died a few hours later, on Jan. 6.

No one has been arrested in connection with the death, which sparked protests at the state Capitol, forced lawmakers to scrap the military-style camps and led to the resignation of the state's top law enforcement officer.

Gov.Jeb Bush also ordered an investigation after Anderson's family questioned the finding by Bay County Medical Examiner Charles Siebert that sickle cell trait was to blame for the boy's death. Bush appointed Hillsborough County State Attorney Mark Ober to lead the investigation, and Ober ordered the second autopsy.

A forensic pathologist hired by Anderson's family observed the second autopsy, Dr. Michael Baden, said afterward that he believed Anderson didn't die from natural causes.

Siebert had ruled that physical exertion had triggered sickle cell trait and ultimately caused small blood clots to develop in Anderson's bloodstream, which resulted in internal bleeding.

Anderson had collapsed while doing push-ups, sit-ups, running laps and other exercises that were part of his admission process at the camp. He had been sent there for violating probation by trespassing at a school after he and his cousins were charged with stealing their grandmother's car from a church parking lot.

[AKA_Monet]

What I find very interesting is how did it get so bad so very fast...

1) The boy had a sickle cell trait that exacerbates many problems when under duress.

2) Who knows what sickle cell does to folks neurologically? Something does happened. I don't know exactly what happens. But the boy may have been "acting out" uncontrollably because of his untreated trait, which means he needed better psychologically care, not a boot camp mentality.

3) Those who are untrained in detention or restraint techniques and are not certified healthcare providers should not be forcing any child under duress, then compounding the effect due by adding ammonia to revive a child. It's one thing for an adult. It's another for an developing adolescent...

This whole thing is just jacked up... And I dunno my 1992 LA riot mind is back on... I have a bad feeling about this...

[Gods Ivy]

Originally posted by AKA_Monet
What I find very interesting is how did it get so bad so very fast...

1) The boy had a sickle cell trait that exacerbates many problems when under duress.

2) Who knows what sickle cell does to folks neurologically? Something does happened. I don't know exactly what happens. But the boy may have been "acting out" uncontrollably because of his untreated trait, which means he needed better psychologically care, not a boot camp mentality.

3) Those who are untrained in detention or restraint techniques and are not certified healthcare providers should not be forcing any child under duress, then compounding the effect due by adding ammonia to revive a child. It's one thing for an adult. It's another for an developing adolescent...

This whole thing is just jacked up... And I dunno my 1992 LA riot mind is back on... I have a bad feeling about this...

Sickle cell trait is not the same as having the disease and I think that is where folks are getting this case all mixed up. Just because you have the trait does not mean you feel any symptoms. If you produce a child and you and your mate have the trait then your child will have the disease. You can be a carrier of the trait and have not problems, due to distress or not. The issue is that they used excess force and continued to do so when the 14 year old's body went limp. Were you able to see the video. The nurse even watched as it happend.

[DELTABRAT]

Originally posted by Gods Ivy
Sickle cell trait is not the same as having the disease and I think that is where folks are getting this case all mixed up. Just because you have the trait does not mean you feel any symptoms. If you produce a child and you and your mate have the trait then your child will have the disease. You can be a carrier of the trait and have not problems, due to distress or not. The issue is that they used excess force and continued to do so when the 14 year old's body went limp. Were you able to see the video. The nurse even watched as it happend.

Right. Sickle cell trait is nothing. Everybody and their mothers have that. SST manifests physically, neurologically, or otherwise, in no way whatsoever. Anemia is a problem, additionally, under intense, stressful conditions, exhaustion and low oxygen could occur. However, I think it's important to keep in mind that this young man was an athlete and so for his sickle cell trait to suddenly start "acting up" because he was running some laps, I think is nuts.

I heard the first person who performed the autopsy say that if the guards did in fact kill this boy that he was lying when he said that he was out of breath in the first place and that he doesn't believe that he was faking. My answer to that is so what if he was faking...imagine that initially he was. A 14 year old boy lying about being tired doing strenuous exercises, etc. So! That's still no excuse to beat the shit out of him until he was unconscious.

I have a 13 year old sone and I can only imagine what this mother is going through. He was a CHILD!!!

[AKA_Monet]

Originally posted by Gods Ivy
Sickle cell trait is not the same as having the disease and I think that is where folks are getting this case all mixed up. Just because you have the trait does not mean you feel any symptoms. If you produce a child and you and your mate have the trait then your child will have the disease. You can be a carrier of the trait and have not problems, due to distress or not. The issue is that they used excess force and continued to do so when the 14 year old's body went limp. Were you able to see the video. The nurse even watched as it happend.

As a Ph.D. in Molecular Genetics I am well aware of human hemaglobinapathies. One of which is Sickle Cell where the is a rearrangement of beta-globin gene locus with various haplotypes.

One of the many problems with human Beta-globinapathies are the haploinsufficiencies. That is what they mean by carriers of the the trait. Since the beta-globin gene locus is one of the largest ones and there is a switching of several exons during the development, at any point there could be problems that obtaining a fully functional hemaglobin as someone that may just carry the trait reaches puberty.

When scientists and medical doctor's say stress, it means, that when there is low oxygen tension in the lungs that causes the increases in blood pressure, hyperventilation, and perceived "flight or fight" responses that are activated under the parasympathetic nervous system. Since hemaglobin is an intricate part of that process and blood is rapidly moving everywhere to create some kind of response in the body, through the action of hormones, including thyroid and insulin, red blood cell sickling, because of an incomplete protein due to haploinsufficiency or compound heterozygosity can exacerbate a response with someone that merely carries the trait...

Moreover, there are other environmental external factors, aside from the hitting by personnel, such as substance abuse, or poor nutrition, that could make someone that carries the sickle cell trait more prone to certain pathologies: i.e. increased tumorigenesis, aneurysm [sp?] and stroke. How a thallesemia could cause all of these secondary chronic diseases are under intense investigation.

And what you have here is a developing adolescent with raging hormones and the personnel could care less of his medical condition. Already, that speaks volumes to the neurological conditions he has yet to fully manifest, if he develops them appropriately at all...