Public Education

[hoosier]

Originally posted by Rio_Kohitsuji
Since there may be more students in the private setting, teachers may not be able to give the attention they previously could therefore scores may falter.

No - if there are more kids taking their vouchers to private school ABC, the school has more money and hires more teachers.

Dollarwise: if a voucher is for $8,000, and their are 20 kids in the class, the income is $160,000. Even the Teachers Union wold be happy with 20 kids per teacher.

[AGDee]

Originally posted by hoosier
What would you suggest?

The US already provides free breakfast and lunch at school. Food stamps for the family. Counties have free health clinics, and a hospital has to treat anyone who shows up.

The earned income credit sends thousands of dollars to families with low income.

Some of the old housing projects have crime problems, and every child age 10 and up knows who the drug sellers are. The ghetto 'code of silence' keeps them from telling the police, which might help reduce crime.

Every city has housing codes. If the necessities aren't being provided, the code dept. will take action upon request.

In reality, you get more of what you reward. If you provide free/cheap food, housing, med care, transportation, books, pencils, education, etc., you get more people wanting the free stuff and much more for free.

On the other hand, one of the more successful plans - put thru Congress by the Republicans before the '96 election - has been workfare. If you are healthy and don't have an infant, you have two years to get a job and get out of the project (and help will be provided). When the two years came up, thousands had found jobs and found better housing.

If oportunities are available, and the free stuff is not available or very hard to get, people will get their act together.

You're talking about some utopia that definitely isn't Detroit. The unemployment rate is 7.1% in Michigan. The city is almost bankrupt. There are no county hospitals in this area. The crime rate is sky high and there are areas of the city that even police and EMS won't go because it's too dangerous. YET, the kids who fail in those schools are failing because of the teachers? Nope.

[hoosier]

Originally posted by AGDee
You're talking about some utopia that definitely isn't Detroit. The unemployment rate is 7.1% in Michigan. The city is almost bankrupt. There are no county hospitals in this area. The crime rate is sky high and there are areas of the city that even police and EMS won't go because it's too dangerous. YET, the kids who fail in those schools are failing because of the teachers? Nope.

I share your feeling that it is a tough situation. It's a self-inflicted toughness, for the most part.

Michigan used to be about the most socialist state, with high welfare payments, govt. controls, and high taxes. Now it - and especially Detroit - are reaping the consequences.

Many of these parents are at fault - they may have dropped out of school, had children with no fathers for support, spent money on big screens instead of books, and watched soap operas instead of seeking a job. That was sufficient when welfare checks were coming in and getting larger every six months. Now they have a problem.

[Tom Earp]

Agree with HOOSIER once again! Parents will or cannot disipleine Kids. it is not the Teachers Jobs to do this.

Because of the Laws in place via the ACLU. the Parents nor The Teachers can do anything.

So, where does the blame lay?

Many Mothers with Children with different Last Names? Mothers who are trying to get by on piticance from the Federal Govt Who cannot keep their legs together because they are are on drugs?

Detroit Has caused many problems them selves along with many Major Cities.

Do not ever blame on teachers as they are hamstrung too.

Beat The Kids Ass like many of us were! When No is said, Then NO is The Word!

[AGDee]

Originally posted by hoosier
I share your feeling that it is a tough situation. It's a self-inflicted toughness, for the most part.

Michigan used to be about the most socialist state, with high welfare payments, govt. controls, and high taxes. Now it - and especially Detroit - are reaping the consequences.

Many of these parents are at fault - they may have dropped out of school, had children with no fathers for support, spent money on big screens instead of books, and watched soap operas instead of seeking a job. That was sufficient when welfare checks were coming in and getting larger every six months. Now they have a problem.

We still have the high taxes, one of the highest in the country, I believe. Income tax of 4.9%, Sales tax of 6%, gas tax of (can't remember exactly, but I think it's 17 cents a gallon), cig tax of $2.00 a pack... I pay a 1.5% income tax to the city of Detroit but have no vote there. Residents pay 3%. People who work there pay more in actual dollars than residents do. With the city going bankrupt, they are cutting police and fire services. They cut bus services drastically,making it impossible for some folks to get to work at all. We're in rough shape right now.

I think the biggest problem is that they've remained dependent on the auto companies for unskilled labor jobs, but those are no more. Delph and Visteon are talking about cutting their employees salaries by 2/3. We're talking from almost $30 an hour to $9 an hour. How are people going to survive on that?

In part, unions inflated Michigan's economy and the businesses can't afford to survive here. Detroit never rebuilt after the riots of '67. There was a corrupt mayor for a long time. The fact that they allowed crime to get so bad in some areas that it's not safe for police or EMS is a crime in itself.

Maybe the city going into receivorship will help, but I'm not convinced. In any case, I don't think they should keep taking money away from those schools, because the school should be the one place where kids can feel safe, warm, get those two free meals and learn something, from stable adults who care about them.