Divorce or premarital Sex?

[valkyrie]

Originally posted by epchick
Ah...that's right, I didnt catch my mistake..i'm sorry. I guess I should have just said "different sectors" instead of "different religions."

But everything else after that is still the same:

As long as you have God in your heart, believe that Jesus is his son who came down to earth and died for our sins....and just try to live a Godly way (and not just by doing good deeds, but trying to live the way God says through his Word--the bible) then your all good.

Hm, so you're saying that I'm not all good. Oh well. Someone was bound to say it eventually.

[33girl]

Originally posted by xo_kathy
Right, that's the idea I've heard before - though I don't know of any protestant faith that doesn't take communion?! Is there one? But I just don't understand how cermonies and rituals can be more of a deciding factor than, for instance, a stance on ordaining women or condemning homosexuals to hell.

BTW, I promise I'm not judging, just wondering! AND, my father's side of the family is uber Irish Catholic, so it's not like I haven't been exposed to my fair share of it.

They might take it but not as often and not with the same amount of ceremony.

Although Glitter's right...I'm Lutheran (aka Catholic lite) and can't imagine ever going to a church where the minister wears a regular old suit.

[xo_kathy]

Originally posted by 33girl
They might take it but not as often and not with the same amount of ceremony.

Although Glitter's right...I'm Lutheran (aka Catholic lite) and can't imagine ever going to a church where the minister wears a regular old suit.

Well, not as often is true, but just as much ceremony - just a different kind.

AND, that's just my point. You're going to choose a religion based on what the minister wears? And I know that's not exactly what you are saying, but I just think if religion is not something to be taken lightly, why would you make decisions based on the "fluffier" parts of it? (and by YOU I don't just mean 33girl!)

OH, and valkyrie, I think you are just fine! Pretty swell, even!

[honeychile]

Originally posted by Glitter650

I think, for the most part catholic people who disagree with the more "conservative" parts of their faith don't find something "offensive" about other, more "liberal" pretestant branches of christianity.... (and some branches are JUST as conservative as catholicism) They LIKE the other parts of being catholic, the rituals and ceremonies (communion, saying the rosary...) are really beautiful, and most protestant faiths have done away with those aspects of religion.

FYI, many nondenominational churches (which are not properly called Protestant because they're not protesting anything) are much more conservative than the Catholic church. They do take communion, but they don't believe in transubstiation (that the wafer literally becomes the body of Christ), and don't say the rosary as it's not in the Bible.

I've gone to a couple nondenominational churches; I actually prefer them, when their message agrees with my beliefs. It's easier to find a small "non-dom" with the same belief system as mine than one of the more popular sects

[valkyrie]

Originally posted by xo_kathy
OH, and valkyrie, I think you are just fine! Pretty swell, even!

Why thank you!

[amanda6035]

...when I was in high school, I was a goody two shoes who swore I'd wait to have sex until I was married....

6 years later I thank God (no pun intended) that i did not. Because I got engaged when I was 22, to a man who was NOT right for me. We called it off before it was too late (legally) but not until after we had already slept together.

I'm gonna offend someone with this, but I'm gonna say it anyway: If I had waited for THAT, I would have been one unhappy, pissed off, disappointed "i cant believe I waited for THAT...THAT is what the BIG DEAL is about? Yawn, boring" person and I probably would have turned into an assexual being. In short: It sucked.

I dont remember who said it, but someone mentioned that they didnt necessarily believe you had to wait to be married, but that it should be with someone who you honestly thought mgiht be the one. I agree. I dont think you shoudl be wild and crazy about it, but I no longer think its necessary to wait. As cliche as it sounds, you probably wouldnt buy a car before giving it a test drive, right? Not saying you should test drive a hundred cars....but, yeah. You get the idea.

[Tom Earp]

It always amazes Me when people quote the Bible or The 10 Commandments, and the Dogma of certain Relegions.

I just wonder, are not all Animals of every type supposed to be Gods Children?

Now, who preforms the Marriage Rite for Non Homo Sapiens?

How do we get eggs, Bacon, Beef, potatoes and carrots? They preform a sexual function of some kind dont they? We just call it something different.

Actually as was said, SEX is just a small part of Mariage. It is the first step in the many steps to see if you will be compatable. I dang sure wouldnt want shoes that pinch my feet.

[AGDee]

Originally posted by xo_kathy
Totally off the sex/divorce topic, but I find this so odd. I hear of so many Catholics who say there are lots of things they don't agree with, but they "choose" it anyway. Now, I understand it might be a little hard to decide "Never mind, Jesus isn't the savior" and convert to a non-Christian religion - though I know people do. But often the things that Catholics don't "like" about their religion are things I think of as being more "liberal". So I guess I often wonder what it is that the other, more liberal denominations DO stand for that the Catholic folks don't like. Hmmm, GeelyPenguin would be a good mind to pick about this...

The rules of the Catholic church that I don't agree with are some of the "man-made" rules that they've chosen to enforce with no religious reason for it. Such as interpreting "Be fruitful and multiply" as meaning "Don't use birth control ever". That is an interpretation of one line in the Bible that the church leaders decided is very important. They don't allow women to be priests because none of the disciples were women, they claim. Huh? Well of course at that time in history, none of the disciples were women because women were second class citizens then. They couldn't be disciples and be taken seriously. That has changed though.

I do think you'd have to create your own religion to find one which you agree with in every way. Each person who reads the Bible finds different meaning and interpretation in it, but we look to others to find out what it means. It will even mean something different if you read it when you're in a different state of mind.

That said, I have nothing against other Christian religions but I am most comfortable worshipping in the manner that Catholics worship during mass. When I feel a need to worship publicly, I am most comfortable doing it during a mass which is solemn, serious and which involves active participation on my part. The part of the Catholic mass where someone is interpreting the Bible for me is very short. And, the Eucharist is the absolute main reason that when I attend church, it is a Catholic church. There is no where else that I can receive the Body and Blood of Christ and when I am seeking that spiritual nourishment, that is where I go.

By the way, it's not a sin to be divorced if you're Catholic. In fact, they don't recognize divorce. You are still married, even if you're divorced. Therefore, it's only a sin if you actually cheat on that person you're still married to. If you get your first marriage annulled, then your first marriage was never sanctioned and doesn't count, so then you can re-marry.

Matthew 5:31-32: No divorce, except for fornication: "It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement. But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery."

1 Corinthians 7:10-12: No divorce, on any grounds: "And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband: But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried, or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife. Paul wrote this passage in response to questions raised by the church at Corinth about divorce and remarriage. He says that God does not allow divorce. If a couple divorces against the will of God, then their only options are to remain single, or to reconcile and restore their marriage..

Found this cool link that compares the beliefs of numerous religious denominations. Very interesting stuff:

Religions are Different

Dee

[xo_kathy]

Originally posted by AGDee
And, the Eucharist is the absolute main reason that when I attend church, it is a Catholic church. There is no where else that I can receive the Body and Blood of Christ and when I am seeking that spiritual nourishment, that is where I go.

Ah, but as our very knowledgeable friend MysticCat once pointed out:

"The older Protestant groups -- the Lutherans, Presbyterians and Anglicans -- all teach that the Body and Blood of Christ are received in the Sacrament. They may disagree with each other (and with the Catholic Church) about how this happens, but they do teach that it does happen."

But again, I guess it's in the details.

Next question -
So, my parents got married in the Catholic church and had my brother and I. Then they got divorced. Many years later my dad wanted to get remarried so he asked my mom to go through with the annullment. So, doesn't that make my brother and I bastards in the eyes of the church and make my parents real sinners?

Funny part of the annullment - it didn't go through in time for the second marriage. So, not only did my dad have to get married in a Presbyterian church (which is what my mom happens to be), but it was a female minister! We're lucky Grandma didn't have a heart attack that day!

[aephi alum]

Originally posted by AGDee
If a couple divorces against the will of God, then their only options are to remain single, or to reconcile and restore their marriage..

But if a couple divorces and then one of them dies, the other is free to remarry, right? In the eyes of the Church they'd be a widow/widower, right? You can't reconcile with an ex who's dead.

[Tom Earp]

"In the eye of The Church".

When most people say Catholic Church, Catholic Means Universal.

Usually that means The Roman Catholic Church. Back in the days when Knights were Bold, The Roman Church was more of an economic presence than the Reighning Heads of State and had more land than they did.

So does that Not Mean the The Anglicans, Lutherens, Greeks Orthadox and other Groups, Methodist, Presbyterians, Babtists, ETC are not Universal?

Granted this may be off of the subject, but it is a Relegious Subject We are talking here is it not?

So, The Male of The Species is always on the look out for the Female of The Species. So. When they meet, what do they do get it on. Chicken, Deer, Hog, Cow, Armidillo or what ever.

Isnt it amazing that the Male of The Species is always better looking than the Female?

Was there really a Damn Snake and a Big Red Apple in "THE EDEN"? How many Kids did they really have? What caused it, that friggen Rib?

[Glitter650]

Originally posted by honeychile
FYI, many nondenominational churches (which are not properly called Protestant because they're not protesting anything) are much more conservative than the Catholic church. They do take communion, but they don't believe in transubstiation (that the wafer literally becomes the body of Christ), and don't say the rosary as it's not in the Bible.

Exactly my point, as many ARE more conservative, it MUST be something else that keeps catholics from switching... when they don't agree with some of the doctrines... and I attended presbyterian and although we took communion, it was not done with NEARLY the ceremony as it is in Catholic churches, especially when one thinks about the emphasis placed on the first communion. and having had to confess before etc, that was my point in bringing up the "ritual/ceremony aspects.

I have a cousin and is engaged to be married to a wonderful woman. John (the cousin) is divorced and so is his fiance, Jen. John used to be a "Dead Head" (one that followed the Grateful Dead everywhere they went), and he got married to a fellow "Dead Head" that wanted to settle down and have a family. Well, John never really made the agreement to settle down to her. He continued to be a devoted "Dead Head". His ex-wife wanted to change him and he didn't get the whole idea of marriage equals settling down and not following the Grateful Dead around. Consequently, they divorced because one wanted to change the other and the other didn't want to settle down.

On the other hand, Jen (the fiance of John) divorced her husband because her ex-husband wanted her to have an abortion of their child. He requested this after she found out she was pregnant. They had both talked about kids and both wanted a child at the same time so they were following the same timeline. So, from then on out, they did the deed for the sole purpose of having a child. Well, she got pregnant and her ex-husband flipped out. He didn't want a child all of a sudden, blah, blah, blah. Until she had Aisy, she slept on the couch while waiting for the divorce to finalize.

Fast forward, a few months. John and Jen met and started dating. They get engaged and are getting married this month. They have a child together, Samantha, and John wants to adopt Aisy when they get married. He won't be able to do it because the ex-husband won't sign the custody papers, albeit he doesn't want anything to do with Aisy and he fought like hell to get visitation rights. No one understands why he won't give up custody rights other than it's a power and ego trip he's riding on presently.

In these two cases, I would rather get divorced than have pre-marital sex. I think everyone chooses their demons and deals with them accordingly. We're all humans and have a right to choose what we do in our lives. I am not going to judge someone based on those private decisions. Granted, I am not going to intentionally be around criminals, etc., and these types of people will deal with their actions either now or later.

[Tom Earp]

Who cares?

If the Two People are not happy and if they have Kids and They arent Happy, who does is benefit?

I was Married for 20 Years and 20 Days. It just was not there.

So, I should be miserable along with maybe Her? Why?

[epchick]

Originally posted by valkyrie
Hm, so you're saying that I'm not all good. Oh well. Someone was bound to say it eventually.

I never meant that!! "All Good" is a saying that means that you'll be fine, its ok, its "all good." I dont mean that someone is good, or not good.

I'm sorry if you took it wrong valkyrie. By no way was I trying to judge you or say that you were "not all good."