Asian student confesses: 'we work harder'

[James]

How come many people tend to grow defensive, take general comments personally and then lash out? Its a common pattern but makes discourse difficult.


Couldn't we be calm and stick to the issues?

[Kevin]

Originally posted by KSig RC
What culture would that be, kevin? Black culture? Poor culture? Immigrant culture?

How can you properly define a widespread problem using such a narrow definition as 'culture'?

I'd hate to call it black culture or immigrant culture. That would be painting with a pretty broad brush.

How about the culture that many blacks are raised in verus the culture that many immigrants are raised in?

Of course, again, that's stateing what is insanely obvious. My girlfriend teaches band in an inner-city school. She observes that many of the children there come from families that place an extremely low level of importance upon a good education -- so much so that parents blame the teachers when their kids have behavioral issues in school -- please note that I did not mention race in the sharing of this information, I simply mean to point out that at least in this case, these kids from the inner-city families don't place a very high value on their education. In many cases, these parents simply see the teachers as babysitters that can take care of their kids while they watch afternoon television.

I realize that the above comes nowhere even close to a representative sample, and I failed to address what groups she says do better, however, I think it does address the fact that there is a home culture that exists in this country that prepares children for failure.

I don't know how this is borne out in statistics, but what starang21 is saying seems to be echoing what we already know. Asian kids do better than white kids on these standardized tests, and to continue with that comparison, blacks and hispanics do not fare as well as whites on these tests.

Hopefully, no one here would be brazen enough to suggest that eugenics could play any role here, and if it's not caused by the home culture of these kids, what else could it be?

[Taualumna]

I've noticed that most responses place a heavy emphasis on inner city kids, but rural kids often face the same problems. Inner city kids often get help and support from city based agencies but often, rural kids don't get the same benefits (see an earlier post for article from the Toronto Star) and sometimes score lower than kids from lower income urban areas.

Just a thought.

[Rudey]

I am of the opinion that quite a bit of what Bill Cosby says is true.

At the same time, the right to an education is universal and benefits every class of peoples.

At the same time, to bring a class of people up to a higher education level, you need to spend more on them than you do than the upper brackets. This country has yet to do that.

-Rudey
--Responsibility for all is the only solution

[Kevin]

Originally posted by Taualumna
I've noticed that most responses place a heavy emphasis on inner city kids, but rural kids often face the same problems. Inner city kids often get help and support from city based agencies but often, rural kids don't get the same benefits (see an earlier post for article from the Toronto Star) and sometimes score lower than kids from lower income urban areas.

Just a thought.

At least around here, I consider many of the problems of the rural community to be self-imposed. In Oklahoma, our rural communities are responsible for our state having more than 500 school districts, many of which operate schools within 2-3 miles of eachother and have extremely small student populations, the inability to hire qualified teachers, the inability to staff the schools appropriately, etc. Despite that, their state representatives have really dug their heels in as far as redistricting for fear of losing their communitys' identities.

At least for my area, the rural areas seem to create their own problems where the inner-city issues seem to be frustratingly difficult to solve (and it's not for a lack of trying). My girlfriend, who teaches in an inner-city school was very idealistic at the beginning of the year, and by year's end she seems to be wondering how long she has to stay at this place before it's considered okay to put her resumé out.

Rudey -- how do you feel Bush's No Child Left Behind program will assist these children in at least being placed at a site where a decent education is available if they want it?

-- and honestly, I don't think that's the problem. From what I've observed, there are many kids that simply don't value education. I'm quicker to blame ignorant and uncaring parents than society (although in a sense, they're the same thing).

[starang21]

Originally posted by James
How come many people tend to grow defensive, take general comments personally and then lash out? Its a common pattern but makes discourse difficult.


Couldn't we be calm and stick to the issues?

it's hard to have intelligent conversation when the first "general" comment is a bigoted and racist one. what's the point of having thought provoking conversation when the first comment cast already has very little thought behind it? what i find funny is when people make "general" (i.e. prejudiced) comments about a certain race of people, they complain about being called a racist.

[starang21]

Originally posted by ktsnake
I don't know how this is borne out in statistics, but what starang21 is saying seems to be echoing what we already know. Asian kids do better than white kids on these standardized tests, and to continue with that comparison, blacks and hispanics do not fare as well as whites on these tests.

that's not really what i'm trying to say, however. i could care less what the breakdown of any of that is. it doesn't affect me, and i've never thought about how much better or smarter i was or thought i was over the white people in my class. i don't even think asian people really look to make comparisons in that manner. it's not that serious. i'll leave that to y'all (people who want to make comparisons on race to make themselves feel better...much akin to hoosier) . the point behind my post was to turn around his ignorance and bigotry and place it on him.

[starang21]

Originally posted by PM_Mama00
Why is it ok for you to agree with a statement that is against single parents, but once culture or whatever is brought up it has nothing to do with things? I know many people who grew up without a father who are incredibly smart while their mothers were struggling to get by.

Maybe that has something to do with it in some ways, but not all.

And starang, don't you think it's kind of racist to say that Asians are all smarter and it's not because they study harder? I guess since we're not Asian we are just naturally not as smart, right?

i don't think it's racist at all...because asian people don't have the good ol boy system (i.e. white priviliedge) and can't oppress white people on the whole.

the reason behind that comment was to point out the ignorance and bigotry behind comments such as those already typed out in this thread that try to imply some sort of superiority or inferiority that a certain race has. people don't like it when it's them. for every person that wants to compare people who emulate rap stars, i can compare those who don't perform as well as asians.

no wants to comment on how racist hoosier is, but everyone want to call me a racist. i'm not racist, my best friend is black.



famous words.....if it applies to you, remain offended.

[Rudey]

Originally posted by ktsnake

I don't know how this is borne out in statistics, but what starang21 is saying seems to be echoing what we already know. Asian kids do better than white kids on these standardized tests, and to continue with that comparison, blacks and hispanics do not fare as well as whites on these tests.

Pacific islander and Asians are different. And within Asian, certain Asian nationalities do not do well in those statistics - mainly South East Asian.

In regards to the No Child Left Behind Act, a bipartisan act and not Bush's program btw, I think it does head in the right direction but that it is still not enough.

In regards to parents not placing enough emphasis on education, I believe that is a direct result of being uneducated themselves.

Even if someone's life goal is to clean pools, he deserves an education. That education will help him vote. That education will help him stay healthy. That education will benefit his children. That education benefits all and is really a right he/she deserves.

-Rudey

[hoosier]

Originally posted by James
How come many people tend to grow defensive, take general comments personally and then lash out? Its a common pattern but makes discourse difficult.

Couldn't we be calm and stick to the issues?

Since many libs and dems cannot logically and intelligently support their arguements and statements, they quickly resort to name calling (racist, bigot) and lash out.

It's nothing new.

[hoosier]

Originally posted by starang21


but if you want to discuss...what i'd like to discuss is how asians perform better on the SAT that whites.

or how a higher percentage of asian males and females have at least a bachelors degree than that of whites.

i'd also like to know what you think about how asian families have a higher median income to that of white families.

i don't think it could be because asians work harder, because the hardest workers when i was in college seemed to be the white folks who still performed at a lower level than i did. hmmmm......i wonder what ever could it be???

I don't know that all of your stats are accurate, but the Asian's inspire me and make me want to work harder to keep up/get ahead.

[hoosier]

Originally posted by starang21


lets get to the point of your posts. bringing up whatever menial and ridiculous point you were bringing up had no basis in this conversation. you've already shown us your bitter and deep seeded hatred for black people. it's old already.

You certainly read unintended stuff into my posts, in fact you are reading untrue stuff.

I feel much sadness about the way our nation - and especially the south - treated African-Americans for a century following the Civil Way.

Perhaps you have heard about Karl Fleming's new book "Son of the Rough South." An excerpt in today's newspaper covered James Meredith's admission to Ole Miss in 1962. Hundreds of US Marshalls and US troops secured his place on campus, with 168 Marshalls injured (29 gunshot wounds, 6 with acid burns) and 200 soldiers were injured. A French reporter was shot fatally in the back, and an Oxford resident killed by stray gunfire. Prior to the battle's start, the Mississippi State Troopers (all white) made a show of driving off campus with their 68 cars.

Meredith, according to the book, heard from his father that "Death is preferred to indignity."

I wonder what he thinks about many of today's African-Americans?

[starang21]

Originally posted by hoosier
You certainly read unintended stuff into my posts, in fact you are reading untrue stuff.

I feel much sadness about the way our nation - and especially the south - treated African-Americans for a century following the Civil Way.

Perhaps you have heard about Karl Fleming's new book "Son of the Rough South." An excerpt in today's newspaper covered James Meredith's admission to Ole Miss in 1962. Hundreds of US Marshalls and US troops secured his place on campus, with 168 Marshalls injured (29 gunshot wounds, 6 with acid burns) and 200 soldiers were injured. A French reporter was shot fatally in the back, and an Oxford resident killed by stray gunfire. Prior to the battle's start, the Mississippi State Troopers (all white) made a show of driving off campus with their 68 cars.

Meredith, according to the book, heard from his father that "Death is preferred to indignity."

I wonder what he thinks about many of today's African-Americans?

talk about a useless bit of information. you bring nothing of use to this conversation. you continually attempt to disparage black people on this site just to make your racist sensibilities more at ease.

[starang21]

Originally posted by hoosier
I don't know that all of your stats are accurate, but the Asian's inspire me and make me want to work harder to keep up/get ahead.

actually, they are....but you should be inspired, considering that according to these stats you're not at the top of intellectual totem pole.

[starang21]

Originally posted by hoosier
Since many libs and dems cannot logically and intelligently support their arguements and statements, they quickly resort to name calling (racist, bigot) and lash out.

It's nothing new.

"conservatives" hide their racist ideologies by applying their miniscule thought process on what a few do and apply it to the whole. if people wouldn't make racist comments based out of hatred, then the name calling wouldn't happen. you make them, therefore it applies to you.