» GC Stats |
Members: 329,721
Threads: 115,665
Posts: 2,204,953
|
Welcome to our newest member, zaaleislittle81 |
|
 |
|

01-06-2005, 11:02 PM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3
|
|
I went to the University of Delaware and attending during the time of this 5-Star Plan and now it is called "CAP." I attended the school prior to the installation of the plan as well.
The Plan worked rather well from what I could see. It was not difficult to achieve points in the different categories. What is came down to was that you needed to be a Greek Chapter involved in the campus. We received points for going to football games, attending speakers, and participating in other sorority and fraternity events. For example, sororities received points for doing Sigma Chi Derby Days, Theta Chi Powderpuff, and Phi Tau's 5k For Bruce. Fraternities received points for participating in KD's Wiffleball, Alpha Phi's Volleyball, and Delta Gamma's Anchor Slam/Splash. If your sorrority or fraternity did well in terms of grades, then you succeeded in another area that you received points.
The Plan was not all about punishment. Fraternities and Sororities are placed on probation before being kicked off campus. When I was at Delaware, fraternities and sororities that were kicked off sometimes were only kicked off for a year or two. If the fraternitiy or sorority were placed on probation numerous times and were called on serious charges like hazing, then they were possibly kicked off indefinitely.
I do not know if I explained anything better or I just went on about nothing... But I have seen the plan first hand and at Delaware...
|

01-06-2005, 11:39 PM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: NY
Posts: 8,594
|
|
The problem is the sanctions. IF this were a voluntary program with no sanctions it would just be manipulative. But with sanctions its sinister.
Greek chapters exist to exist, and service its members. Not to have all those other goals per se.
What the administration does by creating a "plan" like that is force you to justify your existance based on their ideas of what your purpose should be.
The ultimate penalty to not conforming to their ideas is they take away your existance.
Let me give you an example:
Chapter X has existed for years blithely unconcerned with the administration. They have 60 members and have never had a risk management violation. They pay their national dues. They have lots of fun.
They don't belong to many other organizations on campus, like most students they aren't interested, unlike most students they already belong to one solid organization.
They don't do a lot of community service, and what they do accomplish they can't be bothered to report to the administration. After all, they are doing it for themselves.
Maybe their grades are even under the campus average.
So suddenly the college creates the 5-star program. And chapter X goes from being fine, viable and having lots of fun to being a One or Two star chapter.
A one star chapter would mean they can't have intake and can't socialize. A two star chapter can't socialize. A three star chapter can't socialize.
So all the fun stops for the entire group and they are threatened with death, unless they decide to do things that they had decided as individuals they didn't want to do. Do more community service, join other organizations etc etc.
There is no difference in the organization before it gets the One Star rating or right after, except that now they are somehow "bad."
See how accepting someone else's definition can hurt a chapter?
|

01-09-2005, 02:35 AM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3
|
|
I have read what you have written, but what is the sole purpose of a sorority or fraternity? Here are just a few statements according to some fraternity and sorority national websites:
"The fundamental purpose of the X Fraternity is to cultivate an appreciation of and commitment to the ideals of friendship, justice and learning. "
"X offers to women of all ages a rich heritage based on principles of personal integrity, personal responsibility and intellectual honesty. Its primary purpose is to foster high ideals of friendship, promote educational and cultural interests, create a true sense of social responsibility, and develop the finest qualities of character."
"X seeks to create a lifetime experience which centers on reverence to God, duty, honor, character and gentlemanly conduct."
"X provides experience in group living and offers the opportunity to learn leadership and interpersonal skills that equip members to assume positions of responsibility in the world of career, community and society. X encourages academic achievement, respect for learning and development of organizational skills that prepare college women for attaining their goals in life."
I am not trying to start an argument, but you have said that chapters exist to exist and not to have goals per se. According to four chapters that are on the campus of the University of Delaware and very well-known chapters, their national mission statements state ideas and purposes similar to what the "Plan" as you have said is enforcing you to follow. Isn't your national chapter enforcing these guidelines to follow? I know for a fact while I was a member of my organization, that we had national representatives visit our chapter to ensure that we were living up to the high ideals of our organization. As a Vice President of my organization, I remember having to fill out various forms and send them to our national headquarters stating the activities we completed in the semester as well as our grade reports. Through this Delaware Plan, they are only actually helping you to fullfill your obligations as an active member of an organization on the campus and to ensure that through the various activities you are participating in, there are little to no risk factors involved.
|

01-09-2005, 03:15 AM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 779
|
|
There's a story about a rally of the old Communist Workers' Party in London. The fiery speaker ended by saying, "Come the revolution, it'll be strawberries 'n cream for all the masses!". A voice from the crowd shouted out, "But what if I don't like strawberries 'n cream?". The speaker narrowed his eyes and replied, "Come the revolution, you'll eat strawberries 'n cream whether you want it or not."
Fraternities at their founding largely grew out of a desire for independence, to build friendships away from the eyes of overbearing faculty and college rule-makers.
Of course our national organizations are founded on noble purposes, and wish to encourage those ideals among the membership of its chapters. But they are OUR purposes and OUR ideals. The first inclination of college administrators is to control. Whatever rules and standards they espouse and try to make the Greeks achieve is all focused on that mission: control.
There was an interesting exchange on my campus when this sort of nonsense was first proposed. The administrators were trying to tell fraternity presidents that all these rules would make them better, that all the grades and commuity service and diversity seminar and clean-your-lawn regulations and restrictions would create the ideal fraternity chapter.
One fraternity president stood up and said, "With respect, if you think all these burdensome regulations are going to make an ideal fraternity, then why doesn't the school create a fraternity chapter set up exactly the way you want it...and then see if any students want to join."
UDGreek, with respect, James is exactly right and has stated the case with more clarity than I could. The problem is not the noble purpose; the problem is the eagerness of the administration to punish any deviation from what they think your own fraternity should be. Come the revolution, you'll get strawberries 'n cream shoveled down your throat whether you want it or not.
Last edited by Firehouse; 01-09-2005 at 03:17 AM.
|

01-09-2005, 12:22 PM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Kansas City, Kansas USA
Posts: 23,584
|
|
YES,
Here, Here!
Sounds good on paper, "BUT", is it truely workable?
Is it the best for the Student Orgqanization?
Most if not all Greek Members will participate in many things outside of "The Chapter"!
The main thing of going to College is to Graduate, and to do that they must attain a certain GPA.
But forcing an Organization to do more than be a part of a viable Organization who do things on their own is stretching the rubber band a little to much.
__________________
LCA
LX Z # 1
Alumni
|

01-11-2005, 12:46 AM
|
Moderator
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Hotel Oceanview
Posts: 34,519
|
|
Quote:
Originally posted by UDGreek
II am not trying to start an argument, but you have said that chapters exist to exist and not to have goals per se. According to four chapters that are on the campus of the University of Delaware and very well-known chapters, their national mission statements state ideas and purposes similar to what the "Plan" as you have said is enforcing you to follow. Isn't your national chapter enforcing these guidelines to follow? I know for a fact while I was a member of my organization, that we had national representatives visit our chapter to ensure that we were living up to the high ideals of our organization. As a Vice President of my organization, I remember having to fill out various forms and send them to our national headquarters stating the activities we completed in the semester as well as our grade reports. Through this Delaware Plan, they are only actually helping you to fullfill your obligations as an active member of an organization on the campus and to ensure that through the various activities you are participating in, there are little to no risk factors involved.
|
the point is that the national HQs should be the ones enforcing the goals of their org.
Say that (example) Kappa Sig puts a very high priority on community service. They don't care if their members donate one dime to their or any philanthropy - as long as they are doing hands on community service they are fine. This is appreciated by chapters who don't have lots of members or funds.
UD puts a provision in their plan that says to get X amount of points, you must make a yearly donation of $$$ to your philanthropy. The Kappa Sig chapter there never has and their nationals are cool with it - but UD is not. They get scored low in the philanthropy area - even though they are meeting the goals of their org as their org has set them forth.
__________________
It is all 33girl's fault. ~DrPhil
|

01-11-2005, 09:49 AM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 15,821
|
|
I totally agree that this should be the Inter/National org putting these things in place. AGD has had a 5 star program for it's chapters for as long as I can remember, but it's something to strive for and there are no punishments for not making all of your stars. Conversely, it's quite an honor to be a 5 star chapter. It simply sets out what goals WE see as important for our chapters.
I am very concerned overall by the increasing amount of intrusion that administrations are putting on GLOs. I don't think they micromanage all the other student organizations on campus like they are trying to do with the Greeks. Our organizations' goals should be up to us, not up to the University. They don't know what principles we were founded on. I bet they couldn't recite our Purpose or name a Founder. They do not know what our letters stand for. IF they own the housing that Greeks are using, then they are entitled to some controls there, but otherwise, it's none of their business. When events are held on campus, sure they have to follow campus policies. Outside of that, our business is our business.
Dee
|

01-12-2005, 02:10 PM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Western PA
Posts: 19
|
|
The topic is similar, but I think I'll open the flood gates for more opinions. There seems to be a lot of people that disagree with UD's CAP - I've actually seen the program work for chapters that had been struggeling and provide additional guidance for a chapter to shoot for.
Now, this is slightly off topic, but if you disagree with university's programs like this, how do you feel about standards in general? Who should hold GLO's accountable? I ask this, because standards are the future in GLO's, especially NIC Fraternities with the standards initiative that is being put into place.
Again, I'm not trying to start trouble, just interested in everyone's perspective.
|

01-12-2005, 02:24 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Taking lessons at Cobra Kai Karate!
Posts: 14,928
|
|
Those of you that have your national office determine what "star" you are, do they release that info to the public?
-Rudey
|

01-12-2005, 04:23 PM
|
Moderator
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Hotel Oceanview
Posts: 34,519
|
|
Quote:
Originally posted by whtwudusay
Now, this is slightly off topic, but if you disagree with university's programs like this, how do you feel about standards in general? Who should hold GLO's accountable? I ask this, because standards are the future in GLO's, especially NIC Fraternities with the standards initiative that is being put into place.
Again, I'm not trying to start trouble, just interested in everyone's perspective.
|
Especially for fraternities, it is up to each individual fraternity and their national officers to hold their groups accountable and determine what is important. I say "especially for fraternities" because there are SUCH huge differences throughout the IFC. Some groups want to get huge, some concsiously stay small. If you have a Greek advisor who thinks that huge chapters and huge nationals are the way to go, it's going to be hard on the smaller groups, even if they are the groups that would be best for the campus.
We give out "four star chapter" awards to chapters who excel, but we don't single out those who don't.
__________________
It is all 33girl's fault. ~DrPhil
|

01-12-2005, 10:11 PM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 15,821
|
|
Our stars are published in The Quarterly (our quarterly magazine) which isn't exactly confidential, although it's mailed only to members in good standing. I believe that most Panhellenic groups share their magazines with each other. So, it's not broadcast on the nightly news, but it's not confidential information either. However, we celebrate each star that a chapter receives rather than punishing them for not receiving other stars. I see it as a difference in philosophy.
We have another quantitative measure of each chapter which is more broad and which isn't published, but is made known to the chapter. If a chapter doesn't make a certain score with that, they are not in good standing and can't vote or be eligible for special awards.
But, that is up to Alpha Gamma Delta to decide, not University administrators. As I said before, the administrators don't know our ideals.
Dee
|

01-12-2005, 10:35 PM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 521
|
|
I don't think it's bad per se, just misdirected somewhat. It seems as though these plans look at the entire Greek system which is to be expected, but not individual groups. While we are a part of that, I just feel that having all of these standards homogenizes the system so that there isnt much difference between ABC and XYZ.
My biggest issues, like I said before, are overprogramming and with some of them - a negative recognition system. Outside of that I don't think it's fair to publish "ratings". For some groups I could see it being warranted but what about a group that is struggling - that blanket policy could be the thing that hurts your group.
Also my first thoughts when I saw something like this is more work for the chapter advisor. Sure it is the chapter's responsibility to plan the activities to meet the requirements, but obviously advisor's have to be familiar with the program and remind the chapter about fullfilling the requirements.
__________________
DFE To Be Rather Than to Seem to Be
|

01-13-2005, 12:04 AM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Kansas City, Kansas USA
Posts: 23,584
|
|
Quote:
Originally posted by whtwudusay
The topic is similar, but I think I'll open the flood gates for more opinions. There seems to be a lot of people that disagree with UD's CAP - I've actually seen the program work for chapters that had been struggeling and provide additional guidance for a chapter to shoot for.
Now, this is slightly off topic, but if you disagree with university's programs like this, how do you feel about standards in general? Who should hold GLO's accountable? I ask this, because standards are the future in GLO's, especially NIC Fraternities with the standards initiative that is being put into place.
Again, I'm not trying to start trouble, just interested in everyone's perspective.
|
Ah, took me a few reads to catch up on you!
The problem seems to be not What National Organizatons do with any of thier Programs, but what Individual Schools want to insitute on thier own to so jusdge what The Meaning, Function and responsibilty is.
Now, where does the Poblem Lay? With You in Your Position with little money to function or what We expect from Semi-Adults, that could be a major question.
Amazing, I have some Of My International Officers along with many others who monitor GC to see what really is happening out in the Greek World where We as Members find out more information a lot quicker that The IHQs.
You have to love it, stay tuned and find out what is up to date and current!
Depresing isnt it?
Oh, for Sorority Ladies, there really isnt that much difference in all of the problems. We all have them!!!!!!!!
UDGreek
While your idealism is appreciated, I dont hink you inderstand the realisticness of the total picture.
Notice # of posts. Feel free to give a rebutal. But People who have been around for a while have a ot of more intropestive.
Oh, never forget, there are folks on here from HS kids looking on to current College Students, Alums, Parents and National/International HQ Organizations.
__________________
LCA
LX Z # 1
Alumni
Last edited by Tom Earp; 01-13-2005 at 12:16 AM.
|

01-21-2005, 01:45 PM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 521
|
|
I just got another one of these "plans" from one of my campuses.
__________________
DFE To Be Rather Than to Seem to Be
|

01-21-2005, 02:57 PM
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Edwardsville, IL
Posts: 502
|
|
For everyone's FYI, most of these plans are mandated from the top down, not necessarily dreamed up by the Greek Advisor, for whom in most cases this creates a lot of additional work (as well as for the students). This is a paradigm in higher ed that a lot of schools are adopting because presidents and vice-presidents are calling for it. Take a look at "A Call for Values Congruence" put together by a group of college/university presidents and excutive directors for some NIC/NPC groups. While not directly a "Delaware Plan", the "Sample Greek Community Standards" (page 6) certainly parallels it. Here's the link :
http://www.fraternityadvisors.org/new.htm
Go down to a Call for Values Congruence
Last edited by BSUPhiSig'92; 01-21-2005 at 03:02 PM.
|
 |
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|