Would You Join a Masonic Lodge?

[33girl]

Originally posted by ISUKappa
It is discouraged by our church (the entire Synod of the church, not just my sigular church) to join fraternal organizations such as Masons or Shriners but other charitable orgs such as Lions Club or Kiwanis are okay (I think it has to do with the ritual/heirarchy of the Masons). No one I know personally is a member of a masonic organization. But if it's what you want to do, then, hey, more power to you.

Are you Missouri Synod? Because I'm Lutheran & I've never heard this one before.

[AlphaSigOU]

Originally posted by ktsnake
Perhaps you could help to enlighten me as to why the Church objects to the Masons? They have the Knights of Columbus. To me, the organizations look very similar.

To me, I think it appears it was a case of the Church not wanting any competition, even though Freemasonry is not a religion.

Back in the 1800s, a papal encyclical by Pope Leo XIII called Humanum Genus denounced Freemasonry as incompatible with the teachings of the Roman Catholic Church, on pain of excommunication. Over time the penalties have lessened, but Catholics who become Freemasons may not receive Holy Communion.

QUAESITUM EST
Declaration on Masonic Associations
Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith

It has been asked whether there has been any change in the Church's decision in regard to Masonic associations since the new Code of Canon Law does not mention them expressly, unlike the previous code.

This sacred congregation is in a position to reply that this circumstance is due to an editorial criterion which was followed also in the case of other associations likewise unmentioned inasmuch as they are contained in wider categories.

Therefore, the Church's negative judgment in regard to Masonic associations remains unchanged since their principles have always been considered irreconcilable with the doctrine of the Church and, therefore, membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful, who enroll in Masonic associations are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion.

It is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what has been decided above, and this in line with the declaration of this sacred congregation issued Feb. 17,1981. [1]

In an audience granted to the undersigned cardinal prefect, the Supreme Pontiff John Paul II approved and ordered the publication of this declaration which had been decided in an ordinary meeting of this sacred congregation.

Rome, from the Office of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Nov. 26, 1983.

Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger Prefect

Father Jerome Hamer, O. P. Titular Archbishop of Lorium
Secretary

Notes

1. Cf. AAS 73 (1981) pp. 240-241
source: http://showcase.netins.net/web/clearlight/mason.html

The Knights of Columbus was founded in 1881 in New Haven, Connecticut. More info on the history of the K of C at http://www.kofc.org/about/history/index.cfm.

To be a member of the K of C, one must be a practical Catholic man, at least 18 years of age. There are three degrees of membership, as well as a fourth degree open to members who have been a third degree Knight for at least a year. Fourth degree members wear the fancy chapeaux and robes.

Members of the K of C enjoy the benefit of a life insurance program. Masons and Knights in many locations work together for the betterment of the community.

[aurora_borealis]

Originally posted by 33girl
Are you Missouri Synod? Because I'm Lutheran & I've never heard this one before.

It is all explained here for the Missouri Synod, andhere for the Wisconsin Synod. I'm ELCA and have never heard of there being a conflict of membership. I know of a Rainbow Girl/OES member that is ELCA here on GC.

Not sure about all the smaller denominations of Lutherans after ELCA, LCMS, and WELS, but I am thinking probably not as open to the Masonic memberships.

[adduncan]

ktsnake--

A very complete answer to your question can be found here:
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09771a.htm

In short, in spite of superficial "appearances" the bottom line difference is the KoC supports the authority of the RCC. The Masons do not.

--add

[AlphaSigOU]

Originally posted by adduncan
ktsnake--

A very complete answer to your question can be found here:
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09771a.htm

In short, in spite of superficial "appearances" the bottom line difference is the KoC supports the authority of the RCC. The Masons do not.

--add

Exactly. Masons require a belief in a Supreme Being, otherwise the obligations taken at the altar would not be considered binding.

[oldblue]

Originally Posted by AlphaSigOU

Actually, there's no higher degree than that of Master Mason; all the other side degrees such as the Scottish Rite and York Rite are entirely optional.

Scottish Rite degrees are usually held over the course of a weekend or two; some jurisdictions will conduct the ceremonies in one day by exemplifying the five mandatory degrees (4th, 14th, 18th, 30th, 31st and 32nd) and communicating the degrees in between via a short explanatory lecture.

York Rite degrees are usually held during a weekend.

Are you a mason?

[JWithers]

My father and his father were both York Rite Masons (Christian only) and also lifelong members of the Presbyterian Church USA. So I guess there is not a conflict of interest since PCUSA is pretty cut and dried as to what is biblical and what is not. It's a very liturgical church and there was obviously never an issue.

[Cardinal026]

My grandparents are still very involved in Masons/Eastern Star/Job's Daughter's, etc. My parents met through some sort of Demolay (sp?) and Job's Daughter's social. It was something that I was very aware of growing up, seeing lots of pictures of my mom as a Past Honored Queen, etc.

When I was around 11, my grandparents started really pushing me to get involved w/ Job's Daughters. I refused, because I thought it was ridiculous that they had some sort of a secret that no one else could no about, and didn't want to join something without fully knowing what I was getting into.

I really regret that decision now, and keep meaning to start being involved - especially after getting to see one of my 15 year old little sister's open ceremonies, and realizing for the first time that the "secret" is really no different from my sorority's ritual. So yes, I would join a masonic lodge now, if I were male, and do plan on becoming involved one day on the female end.

[CutiePie2000]

Translation: we don't want you joining other organizations that might siphon off your money that might have come to the church instead. Therefore, we forbid you from joining these organizations so that you can divert your money to us.

Originally Posted by CSUSigEp

Theres a "lodge" right across the highway from my house, I dont think its a lodge though. Its called "the Masonic home" and i think its like an old folks home. Its FREAKING HUGE.

the Masonic Home is located in Covina, California and Union City, Ca.

In Sacramento there is Shriners Hospital and there are many lodges in the Sac area so i dont think it would be a masonic home since there are only two and i gven the locales to both.

I have seen many threads on here lately regarding masonary and i am very proud of my heritage from being a Past Honored Queen and Past Guardian for Jobs Daughters to being active in Rainbow , as well as being a past demolay sweeetheart, seeing my brothers become masons and my parents , grand parents , great grand parents, aunts and uncles all Masons/Shriners/OES / Scottish and York Rite. Belonging to masonic family i never relaized it til recently being in OES as a Line officer as well as a 20 yr member that these groups ,though they all run in the same circles, i value my masonic family because it is a family. I have known ppl 25 + yrs maybe even longer and belonging to a masonic family as i do i have made such lasting friendships. Ppl who i have come to rely on when i need help. Masons, OES , youth groups( rainbow, Job's daughters and Demolay) they teach you such lessons; respect for country, leadership, good order , tolarence, team work, love for family ,etc.... i can go on.

If some one else considering joining a lodge or a OES chapter please do it is alot of fun and you will make lifelong friends who will last a lifetime.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by CutiePie2000

Translation: we don't want you joining other organizations that might siphon off your money that might have come to the church instead. Therefore, we forbid you from joining these organizations so that you can divert your money to us.

No, not really. If that were so they'd prohibit many other activities such as donating money to the poor not through the church, making donations to schools, hospitals, etc. or joining organizations like GLOs.

There's theological reasoning behind it, please see the above link for more info, but don't just make a comment criticising either Lutheran or Catholic teachings out of ignorance. In general they object because they view the Masonic rituals as bad theology.

[PeppyGPhiB]

My grandfather was a mason/shriner and my grandma (his wife) was in Order of the Eastern Star. I have her pin.

[dekeguy]

As a practicing Roman Catholic I am somewhat confused by the position attrtibuted to the RC Church regarding Freemasonry. Before I joined my Grandfather's Lodge I asked my Archbishop to explain what was the straight story. He said that the Church was opposed to any organization that professed Athesim or anti-religious policies. After the experience of the French revolution where certain French lodges denounced belief in God and attempted to eliminate religion the RC Church condemned the Masonic order. Back in the 1960s Pope Paul VI met with the then Duke of Kent, Grand Master of Masons in England and Wales, who pointed out that regular official Masons were equally opposed to those types of organizations and likewise condemned any who fell into that category. The mistrust and animosity seems to have been an long term outgrowth of Catholic-Protestant misconceptions and misunderstandings. The Duke assured the Pope that the Masons had no fundamental objections to RC members and the Pope said that as a result of this illuminating discussion he had no objection to Catholic laity becoming (regular) Masons. If clergy wished to join they should obtain permission from their Bishop or Abbot or Religious Order Superior. The current Duke (his son and also Grand Master) has been very open to Catholic Masons and very supportive of cooperation and mutuality of interests with the RC Church.
Years later when I was in the UK I asked the late Cardinal Basil Hume about this and he said that Pope John Paul II was widely quoted in the press as saying that he saw no problem with Catholic Laity joining a "regular" lodge but a very grave problem with Catholics becoming involved with any of the "irregular" lodges or purportedly masonic organizations which allowed antireligious, athestic, or politically anti-church aims or professed attitudes. The quotation from the then Cardinal Ratzinger predates Pope John Paul II's quoted (and not to my knowledge ever denied or refuted) comments by several years. I am unaware of any new statements by Pope Benedict to contradict the comments of Pope John Paul. Absent any new information I am at a loss to figure out what the problem would be for Catholics to be Masons and Masons to be Catholics. Anybody have anything that would be helpful in this?

[Drolefille]

I had this long typed up thing, but basically this : http://www.ewtn.com/expert/answers/freemasonry.htm
Approved by the Pope, issued by Ratzinger. I found no documentation of JPII saying anything else unless you include those world conspiracy sites that say the Pope IS a Mason which strikes me as just a wee little bit unlikely. So I don't believe that there were comments by JPII to contradict Ratzinger's (again, papally approved) document. And that document was only clarification that the same rules still apply.

Being a Mason as a Roman Catholic is being in a state of sin and one should not receive Holy Communion. (Not personal, dekeguy)

[RU OX Alum]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Being a Mason as a Roman Catholic is being in a state of sin and one should not receive Holy Communion. (Not personal, dekeguy)

Yeah, nothing personal. Hope that you enjoy the brimstone.

just kidding, with both of you