I've Had It!

[Peaches-n-Cream]

I hope that the SigmaAEPi Sorority Life debacle serves as a cautionary tale for other greeks out there who will now avoid being a part of this or any other 'reality' show.

[shadokat]

Aren't we all holier than thou now?!? Bama made the perfect point...you put the dirty laundry out there, you deserve the flack you get. On Sigma's website, it says how they were advised by the University, attorneys, etc. on this show. Guess what? They decided it was a good idea. And now we all see it wasn't. I am sorry but I can't feel sorry for some group who decides to put their lives on MTV. They are young people who watch MTV, see what MTV does to shows, and see how the editing goes. Did they think they'd be different? Come on folks...if they are that naive, that's sad...incredibly sad.

[justamom]

WHO REMEMBERS? Last year someone brought up the idea of an ad campaign for all GLOs. It was a GREAT idea, and it made the rounds to the private forums.

If we all agree that it isn't presenting the true image of Greek life, then rather than dwell upon it, we need to focus on countering it.
They "innocently" made our job more difficult, but the problem of image existed prior to this show. In my opinion, as bad as it looks, and it is HIDEOUS for a sister to slap another sister for example, it is NOTHING when you compare it to the media attention on beatings and alcohol related death.

The entire SYSTEM needs to work on improving our image to the public. It would be nice if we had NPC IFC et al behind it, but it may not be feasible. If we have to start with ourselves as individuals, so be it.
One way to begin is to get out there with the unaffiliated students and represent our entire philosophy through our actions, words and deeds.

[33girl]

This just shows the fundamental conceit that is very real in the NPC. They deny their member groups, that they are rightly proud of, the chance to be on TV. So MTV finds a non-NPC sorority and films them - then NPC cries foul! "No! We're nothing like that! Our x, y, z is 180 degrees from that!" They wrongly believed that if MTV couldn't get an NPC sorority, which of course are the ONLY groups that MATTER (sarcasm), they wouldn't bother. If you don't stand up and speak up for yourself, then you can't be mad when someone else puts words in your mouth.

Like JAM said, we had an image prob before this - from risk management, but also from the snobbery that does exist in some chapters. I agree that the Sigmas made a bad decision, but everytime someone says something negative about them, we just pound another nail in our own coffin. It's done. We can't undo it. So let's stop raking these girls over the coals for things that aren't even related to the show.

As far as the slap, as s & s pointed out, this was behavior between PLEDGES and if you'll recall, everyone who wanted to pledge received a bid. They had no idea what kind of pledges they were going to get - they didn't change their selection method because they had decided they were going to give bids out like this long ago -- they didn't want to be choosing. Furthermore, this was last week's episode. It might be resolved on tomorrow night's ep, or it might have been resolved that night - but without seeing the 95% of their lives that ended up on the cutting room floor, we'll never know. It saddens me that so many people automatically assume the worst, that it was just blown off, instead of that it was resolved and edited out.

[Star Turtle]

Wow - Leave for one day to see an concert....


This thread will be deleted in the morning. I didn't want to open a second can of worms. I simply wanted to remind everyone (in a less mom-like way)

If you don't have anything nice to say, Then don't say anything!

[damasa]

Originally posted by Star Turtle


If you don't have anything nice to say, Then don't say anything!

I have never been the one to agree with this statement. Why sugarcoat something if you don't like it? If it bothers some people enought to say something, good or bad about it, they should be able to do as much.

Now, like I said before, I could care less either way about this debate, but I don't like the show.

BUT, you went and started an entire new thread about this, you said something about this, others should be able to do the same if they want to as well.

I like this thread, it's a pretty good debate, I think anyway.

[librasoul22]

Originally posted by 33girl
This just shows the fundamental conceit that is very real in the NPC. They deny their member groups, that they are rightly proud of, the chance to be on TV. So MTV finds a non-NPC sorority and films them - then NPC cries foul! "No! We're nothing like that! Our x, y, z is 180 degrees from that!" They wrongly believed that if MTV couldn't get an NPC sorority, which of course are the ONLY groups that MATTER (sarcasm), they wouldn't bother. If you don't stand up and speak up for yourself, then you can't be mad when someone else puts words in your mouth.

Like JAM said, we had an image prob before this - from risk management, but also from the snobbery that does exist in some chapters. I agree that the Sigmas made a bad decision, but everytime someone says something negative about them, we just pound another nail in our own coffin. It's done. We can't undo it. So let's stop raking these girls over the coals for things that aren't even related to the show.

As far as the slap, as s & s pointed out, this was behavior between PLEDGES and if you'll recall, everyone who wanted to pledge received a bid. They had no idea what kind of pledges they were going to get - they didn't change their selection method because they had decided they were going to give bids out like this long ago -- they didn't want to be choosing. Furthermore, this was last week's episode. It might be resolved on tomorrow night's ep, or it might have been resolved that night - but without seeing the 95% of their lives that ended up on the cutting room floor, we'll never know. It saddens me that so many people automatically assume the worst, that it was just blown off, instead of that it was resolved and edited out.

***APPLAUSE***

This is the BEST post in this entire thread.

I will say it again. WHAT GOOD IS COMING FROM BASHING THEM, THE SHOW, ANYTHING??? If you need to vent, that's fine. But you cannot get pissed when others notice how your venting is indicitive of something else. Perhaps if you all were more sure that your own org was not guilty of MOST (the slap notwithstanding) of the things that aired on Sorority Life, you would not be so inclined to get defensive. who on earth cares what outsiders think? If you are doing your thing like you are supposed to, and you are projecting a positive image, then why worry? You cannot please everyone, nor can you hope to eradicate all ignorance. If the fact that the show has perpetuated stereotypes bothers you, THEN DON'T DO IT YOURSELF. And CERTAINLY don't complain about it WHILE doing it yourself. The best remedy to ensure that the show doesn't have such negative ramifications is to get out and work and show that Greeks do, in fact, do more than party, drink, slap each other, and wreck shop in general.

[Star Turtle]

After walking away and re-reading the thread - I've decided that there are several good points that many gc'ers have shared on this topic. I have also decided that instead of deleteing this thread - or editing the post where I stated that thought, I will add this - I am done discussing this topic, and I can only hope several other join me on this idea. Whether or not you watch the show, like the show, or enjoy some of the 'drama' of the show - it's everyone's personal business.

I must say though - I find it funny that everyone uses the "laundry" phrase - I figured that would help to "country-fied" my personality on these boards!

Ah, well, - Live and Learn!

[Serenity]

Originally posted by librasoul22
WHAT GOOD IS COMING FROM BASHING THEM, THE SHOW, ANYTHING??? If you need to vent, that's fine. But you cannot get pissed when others notice how your venting is indicitive of something else. Perhaps if you all were more sure that your own org was not guilty of MOST (the slap notwithstanding) of the things that aired on Sorority Life, you would not be so inclined to get defensive. who on earth cares what outsiders think? If you are doing your thing like you are supposed to, and you are projecting a positive image, then why worry? You cannot please everyone, nor can you hope to eradicate all ignorance. If the fact that the show has perpetuated stereotypes bothers you, THEN DON'T DO IT YOURSELF. And CERTAINLY don't complain about it WHILE doing it yourself. The best remedy to ensure that the show doesn't have such negative ramifications is to get out and work and show that Greeks do, in fact, do more than party, drink, slap each other, and wreck shop in general.

I think you deserve applause as well, Librasoul22. Great post!!

I don't know... the whole bashing SAEPi seems so "high school" to me. *No offense to any high schoolers on GC* I've never seen a worse case of kicking someone when they were down, regardless of whether or not you felt they deserved it, than on the threads relating to "Sorority Life". I'm starting to wonder if jealousy really is an issue for some GC'ers because some of the comments have been just plain rude and bitchy. Nothing more, nothing less. And, I think the fact that most of the conversation is being held by the women on this forum speaks VOLUMES.

I think the fact that so many people are using the excuse that since SAEPi agreed to do the show it makes them fair game, as justification for their comments, is deplorable. What ever happened to taking the high road? What are your comments saying about your chapter? You're so proud and overjoyed to make snide and bitchy comments with your letters in your screen name. I hope you don't think it's going unnoticed. But maybe you do since there are so many of you who feel PNM's can't differenciate between Local and NPC orgs/reality based shows vs real life, etc.

Stop hiding behind the negative greek image excuse because some of you aren't helping the situation at all. Stop talking out of both sides of your mouth!!

You know what this kinda reminds me of? "Lord of the Flies", when all the kids turn on the fat kid, Ralph ~ "kill the pig, kill the pig, kill the pig!!" Some of you are just getting swept away in all the hostility. Why so hostile?

It's hard to believe that on a website with so many greeks present there would be so many followers and so few leaders...

[librasoul22]

Originally posted by Serenity
You know what this kinda reminds me of? "Lord of the Flies", when all the kids turn on the fat kid, Ralph ~ "kill the pig, kill the pig, kill the pig!!" Some of you are just getting swept away in all the hostility.

LOL! But it is a really good analogy. Once ONE PERSON says something negative, it sorta opens the floodgates.

[stargirl725]

Originally posted by 33girl
This just shows the fundamental conceit that is very real in the NPC. They deny their member groups, that they are rightly proud of, the chance to be on TV. So MTV finds a non-NPC sorority and films them - then NPC cries foul! "No! We're nothing like that! Our x, y, z is 180 degrees from that!" They wrongly believed that if MTV couldn't get an NPC sorority, which of course are the ONLY groups that MATTER (sarcasm), they wouldn't bother. If you don't stand up and speak up for yourself, then you can't be mad when someone else puts words in your mouth.

I totally agree. And I know I'm going to get slapped for this, but NPC's media-phobia is rediculous, and just makes us look like we've got something to hide.

[aephi alum]

Here's my take on this issue...

Outright bashing of any GLO is a bad thing. We are all greek (or have a sincere interest in the greek system), and we must all hang together, or we will all hang separately.

That said, Sigma AEPi made a decision to go on national TV and represent the entire greek system. For the most part, I feel the sisters have done a good job (with certain exceptions - we didn't see them reprimanding Sylvia for slapping Jessica, but for all we know, the reprimand did happen off camera). But the sisters took in a number of new members at the start of the season, and while some of the NMs' behavior has been exemplary of sisterly conduct, some, well, hasn't.

I confess that I've thrown some fuel on the fire myself, but I've tried to stay away from outright Sigma-bashing. Take another look at my "Ten Commandments" - more than one of them actually bash MTV, not Sigma.

I'd still like to see a nice objective documentary about what greek life is all about... but I'm not holding my breath... and I certainly don't think it will be coming from MTV.

[chideltjen]

I love the fact that certain national chicks are worried because high schoolers are telling them that their moms won't let them rush because of what they saw on TV. I personally don't think that they have a thing to worry about. Whether you want to admit it or not, things like what is going on on Sorority Life does go on in everyone's chapter. There is bound to be a troublesome girl that someone will have to talk to, people joining for the wrong reasons, whatever.
And then there is the whole issue about sigmas asking about religious background. While it may not have been done tactfully, I think they have every right to ask. They ARE a jewish sorority and they do practice judism. (I completely F***ed up the spelling on the one... i appologize.) While it's not a requirement to be jewish, I would want to know if these girls are going to be comfortable with rituals and whatnot. And need we forget that most NPC sororities and IFC fraternities were based originally on some form of religion. I can name a few.

[AXO Alum]

Originally posted by chideltjen
I love the fact that certain national chicks are worried because high schoolers are telling them that their moms won't let them rush because of what they saw on TV. I personally don't think that they have a thing to worry about. Whether you want to admit it or not, things like what is going on on Sorority Life does go on in everyone's chapter. There is bound to be a troublesome girl that someone will have to talk to, people joining for the wrong reasons, whatever.

First of all, I am not a damn chicken so please don't refer to me as a chick -- we don't call fraternities "frats" and you don't call your country a..... well, let that one ride. I am a woman with an opinion -- just like everyone else.

Now, as for the other comment about certain national GLO members with our "letters" in our screen names making snide and bitchy comments...I have NEVER hidden behind my letters - I am proud of my sorority and I'm proud of my work as an alum president and chapter co-advisor. I'm sorry that we aren't ALL going to agree that Sigma deserves to have pity bestowed upon them. In my NEVER humble opinion, I believe that they went into this knowing what could happen and they are finally seeing it for what it was. And now we are supposed to say "oh my goodness gracious sakes alive - these poor poor girls. Why it wasn't really violent for her to hit that girl. And they weren't really being skanky to get up on each other like that." -- let me guess, its the system to blame -- or whatever other sorry excuse fits other than to say "DAMN - did we totally screw up or what?!"

I don't use AXO as my "platform" for superiority (or whatever else you want to call it) - I use it for pride in myself and in my sisters. You don't have that, then I'm sorry for you.

And for the LAST time let me again repeat -- NO NO NO NO NO -- hitting and other violent acts DID NOT go on in my chapter or my pledge class. Yes, there were problems with girls not getting along, or with a boy playing his options now and then, but when you come down to it, its about SISTERHOOD. And I guess that I can say sorry for those of you who DON'T come from a chapter like that. I would NEVER even think of hitting another sister. How can you sit there and condone that as being something that *could have maybe possibly been resolved* -- how do you resolve that? I guess my work with shelters for victims of domestic violence has made me cyncial to the whole "it was an accident and it won't happen again" excuse.

And thrillhouse - as for your explanation of the conspiracy to make it look like she was being hit...you must be right on that! Dang - that's how my body got on that centerfold for SI's Swimsuit edition!! LOL!

Oh - and before I forget...the whole "if you don't have something nice to say, then don't say anything at all" -- hmmm.... how's this - "Gee whiz - Charlie Manson sure has beautiful eyes" -- keep it real and keep it honest.

Delete the thread, don't reply to the thread, whatever -- that's like saying "I'm fed up and leaving GC for good" -- okay then - don't use the forums for your spotlight exit.

We aren't all going to agree on here -- gee, imagine that -- people can ACTUALLY have differing opinions -- surely you jest. Damn, next thing you know, they'll be letting women vote!

Originally posted by cash78mere
You know what i'm tired of??

having to explain to SEVERAL high school aged girls that the sigmas are NOT like a real sisterhood

that we do NOT ask our rushees if they are Jewish or put ANY weight on your religious status.

that we do NOT all freak with our sisters at clubs

that we do NOT speak about our sisters the way those disrespectful new members do


gosh....i work at a camp and all of my junior counselors are in high school or going into college....they ALL come to me and say "i can't believe you were in a sorority...my mom watched it and said she would never allow me to join one...i didn't know you had to be jewish to get in...i can't believe they talk about each other the way they do...." i could go on and on and on about what they think about sorority life.

this show is disgusting. i'm really glad they are getting the negative reaction that they are...they are disillusioning so many young women thinking about college life.

young girls don't have anything to compare real sorority life with. they don't know that this show is a crackpot unless someone like me tells them.

so bash away...

I was going to reply...but this post says it all. I can't tell you how many high school girls I've talked to who are afraid to Rush now because they think this is what sorority life is like...

My sorority (I'm an alumnae now) was nothing like this. And no, I'm not in an NPC sorority. We have depledged girls for acting in much less ridiculous ways than these girls on MTV do, and we have taken away letters from actives for the same reasons.

I can't wait to hear the comments at my class reunion this summer when they find out I am in a sorority. (I'm one of the few from my HS that went to college). Just. Can't. Wait.