Harvard newspaper doesn't want a 4th sorority

[SthrnZeta]

Originally Posted by Gusteau

LOL

As if I wasn't already in disagreement with the premise of the article, citing "Pledged" completely lost me.

Is Title IX really the reason Harvard doesn't recognize these organizations? Aren't these people supposed to be at the vanguard of intelligence?

In an unrelated note, many schools have reported their largest ever numbers of PNMs this year, including my own University - I wonder what's causing this trend.

Well that would explain my chapter doing so well I didn't know it was a national trend though, but it makes sense given the millennial generation attitude of being involved in teams and organizations, desire for networking opportunities, etc.

[ColdInCanada11]

Originally Posted by IotaMuanno

In Canada many schools have NPC GLOs but have no recognition from the University, in fact, lack of recognition is the norm. For example, my university, WLU, has both a Delta Gamma and Alpha Phi chapter (as well as one local sorority) and we are not recognized. The same situation applies to almost every school in Canada (and most have NPC groups). In fact, only University of British Columbia has a formal campus IFC and Panhellenic in the traditional American sense.

Maybe this clarifies things?

Enjoy your discussion about Harvard...

I don't know if it's quite that "across-the-board" in Canada. At my school (Manitoba), all three NPC chapters are recognised, as well as our Panhellenic. I think that it comes down to the specific university.

Also, I believe that in Canada (and possibly in the United States, but that would just be a guess), that many NPC groups were formed when they were recognized on campus, and then remained after they were de-recognised (if that is actually a word).

[Gusteau]

Originally Posted by SthrnZeta

Well that would explain my chapter doing so well I didn't know it was a national trend though, but it makes sense given the millennial generation attitude of being involved in teams and organizations, desire for networking opportunities, etc.

It's one of many reasons that Theta Chi is doing so well.

Re: Dartmouth, I think it's safe to say that the character of the Greek System at Dartmouth is different than the rest of the Ivies, or really, many other universities.

[exlurker]

Originally Posted by Gusteau

. . .
In an unrelated note, many schools have reported their largest ever numbers of PNMs this year, including my own University - I wonder what's causing this trend.

Large numbers of PNMs are being reported by two of the fraternities at Harvard, too:

http://www.thecrimson.com/article/20...-number-frats/

[33girl]

Originally Posted by AGDee

Yep, I was about to post "Almost every Canadian chapter" when I saw this post.

From what people have said about Canada Greek life on here, that also falls into "bullshit PC reasons" as to why they're not recognized.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by 33girl

From what people have said about Canada Greek life on here, that also falls into "bullshit PC reasons" as to why they're not recognized.

Yes, with the chapters I used to work with in Canada, it is solely because GLOs discriminate re: gender so they cannot be recognized by their Universities. I know of one that gets around it for some things by having a "Friends of Panhellenic Sororities" organization that anybody can join if they want to. Then the Friends of Panhellenic Sororities can use campus facilities for recruitment, etc. The Universities aren't against them, per se, they just can't officially recognize them due to the campus rules for recognized orgs.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by AGDee

Yes, with the chapters I used to work with in Canada, it is solely because GLOs discriminate re: gender so they cannot be recognized by their Universities. I know of one that gets around it for some things by having a "Friends of Panhellenic Sororities" organization that anybody can join if they want to. Then the Friends of Panhellenic Sororities can use campus facilities for recruitment, etc. The Universities aren't against them, per se, they just can't officially recognize them due to the campus rules for recognized orgs.

And honestly I don't see this as being PC bullshit. That's their standard and they abide by it. It's not about political correctness (a vastly overused term) at all, it's about equality from the Canadian perspective.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

And honestly I don't see this as being PC bullshit. That's their standard and they abide by it. It's not about political correctness (a vastly overused term) at all, it's about equality from the Canadian perspective.

Right, and I suppose their sports teams are all co-ed? And they don't discriminate against guys in wheelchairs who want to star on the football team?

[ColdInCanada11]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

Right, and I suppose their sports teams are all co-ed? And they don't discriminate against guys in wheelchairs who want to star on the football team?

Hahahahaha, it's only 8am but this made my day Seriously though, we don't have a men's soccer team (only women's) because there isn't a women's football team. So most teams aren't co-ed, but the ratio of all female to all male teams must be equal.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by ColdInCanada11

Hahahahaha, it's only 8am but this made my day Seriously though, we don't have a men's soccer team (only women's) because there isn't a women's football team. So most teams aren't co-ed, but the ratio of all female to all male teams must be equal.

Good thing they don't require an even ratio of sororities and fraternities, or more guys would have to make nice with eachother instead of bringing a new fraternity to campus.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

Right, and I suppose their sports teams are all co-ed? And they don't discriminate against guys in wheelchairs who want to star on the football team?

Yes because those are totally relevant points when contrasting the American concept of "free association" with differing values in other countries. Considering American Greek Life is pretty unique, it's not surprising other countries aren't particularly supportive of it where organizations that developed within the country's own culture will obviously fit better than importing them.

That said your examples suck for two different reasons: in sports you're talking about different physical levels of ability, ones that would, for better or worse, result in primarily female students losing out on the ability to play or just plain getting hurt if the sports were co-ed. It's a long running debate in fact whether some sports should be co-ed, but rolling your eyes and mocking the concept doesn't make your point it instead makes you look ill-informed.

Secondly, using Glee as any sort of basis for a real life point also fails to make your point, is inherently silly, and is still unrelated to why Canadian universities don't recognize single-sex student organizations.

U of Toronto's policy:

In its relations with these organizations, the University is guided by a commitment to the right of University members to communicate and to discuss and explore all ideas, to organize groups for any lawful purpose, to move about the University and to use its facilities in any reasonable way, to distribute on campus, in a responsible way, published material provided that it is not unlawful, to hold meetings, to debate and to engage in peaceful demonstrations, and to freedom from discrimination on the basis of sex, race or religion.
...

(c) Membership in groups should be open to all members of the University community without restriction on the grounds of national origin, race, religion, colour, or sex. While discriminatory membership practices are not allowed, it is recognized that certain groups could well be homogeneous in nature without being discriminatory. Status as non-voting members may be extended to interested persons from outside the University.

Never mind that sports in Canada are also different than sports in the US, but do keep banging the drum.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by ColdInCanada11

Hahahahaha, it's only 8am but this made my day Seriously though, we don't have a men's soccer team (only women's) because there isn't a women's football team. So most teams aren't co-ed, but the ratio of all female to all male teams must be equal.

That's similar to Title IX here, except that it's not necessarily the number of teams, but the number of "athlete" slots so generally football requires several women's teams because football has so many players. And then universities can't have men's football and women's golf and call it a day.

[violetpretty]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

Dartmouth made all of their chapters local--it wasn't a national decision, it was a University-wide decision. It's been discussed ad nauseam around here, by people much more articulate than I.

I don't know about fraternities, but I know that Alpha Chi Omega, Kappa Alpha Theta and Sigma Kappa had chapters at Datmouth where the chapter members voted to go local and became Xi Kappa Chi, Epsilon Kappa Theta, and Sigma Delta, respectively. I believe (at least in the case of SK becoming SD) that they took offense to our ritual and among other things, didn't like the rules that being National entailed. I thought the others were the same.

Also, Dartmouth has chapters of AXiD (began as a local), Tri Delta, Kappa, Alpha Phi, and KD.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Yes because those are totally relevant points when contrasting the American concept of "free association" with differing values in other countries. Considering American Greek Life is pretty unique, it's not surprising other countries aren't particularly supportive of it where organizations that developed within the country's own culture will obviously fit better than importing them.

That said your examples suck for two different reasons: in sports you're talking about different physical levels of ability, ones that would, for better or worse, result in primarily female students losing out on the ability to play or just plain getting hurt if the sports were co-ed. It's a long running debate in fact whether some sports should be co-ed, but rolling your eyes and mocking the concept doesn't make your point it instead makes you look ill-informed.

Secondly, using Glee as any sort of basis for a real life point also fails to make your point, is inherently silly, and is still unrelated to why Canadian universities don't recognize single-sex student organizations.

U of Toronto's policy:

Never mind that sports in Canada are also different than sports in the US, but do keep banging the drum.

I have no idea what Glee has to do with anything, so I'll skip over that.

Your argument is basically that it's not okay to segregate by gender (GLO's), except when it is (sports).

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

I have no idea what Glee has to do with anything, so I'll skip over that.

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

guys in wheelchairs who want to star on the football team?