NPC Quota, Release Figures and Quota Additions (Updated 8/7/2007)

[XOMichelle]

Although I believe that quota and cealing should be enforced (no hand matching bids to sororities when there are groups under total!), I think the best thing for greek offices to do is help the chapters that are not getting as many girls. Maybe give them a heads-up on fund raising opportunities, maybe ask them what their office could do to helpo the chapter, or help inspire greek unity. Personally, I thing a lot of times it's a group's reputation that can get them in trouble with the PNM's, and fostering a unified greek spirit, instead of letting the chapters compete against eachother would help everyone involved.
-M

[Lindz928]

It seems like things at my school are a little different.... We have a chapter total here (it's 175), but there are only 2 sororities under that. All of the other chapters (there are 11 total) are close to 200, or over 200, one is even about 250! Chapter total on my campus is basically a number that doesn't mean anything unless you are under it, and then it's just the goal to recruit to.

We also don't have anything that guarantees a PNM will get a bid. Some girls are always cross-cut, but this year there were only 15 who were, and quota was somewhere around 45 or 50.

Our system is a little screwed up, and it kind of sucks for smaller chapters. They also don't seem to care about certain chapters, because a couple aren't doing as well as they could be, yet they are inviting another sorority to campus starting next fall!!! I have to say I'm not too thrilled about the idea of doing that when all of the chapters are not doing as well as they should be.

[RACooper]

I have to disagree.... if you have 11 houses with membership totals that high you could easily support another house....

For perspective, your pledge class is roughly the size of the all the girls that got bid on my campus.

[Lindz928]

That's not exactly true.... This is one of the ways that our system is screwed up. If we add another chapter, it diesn't mean that every house will become smaller in numbers. It means that the biggest houses, the ones that are considered "the best" will keep pulling in the bigger numbers, and the smaller chapters will suffer even more. The big chapters at my school are more concerned with themselves than they are will the greek system as a whole sometimes.

There may have only been 40 or 50 girls who got bids on your campus, but I would be willing to bet that you have a smaller greek system and a smaller school. I go to a school that has 45,000 students, and we are trying to make the greek system bigger, which is why rrecruitment numbers are so important. My only issue is that I think we should make sure that all of the chapters we have now are strong enough and on the same level as the other chapters before we worry about inviting another chapter to colonize.

It is just very frustrating when you think that the greek system that is supposed to be supporting the chapters is more worried about expanding and getting bigger than they are about the chapters they have now.

[Angels&Arrows]

Lindz928... I had to reread your post.. I noticed that you said quota was around 45 or 50... I thought you meant regularly. So I was trying to figure out how a chapter could be significantly over 200, and as high as 250. However, I think you meant quota for Fall Formal Recruitment 2002?

That seems a bit lower then in the past for UTx. We have averaged 59 New Members/per rush over the last four recruitments, not including this past recruitment. However, for TX Alpha to be over 200 members/as well as other chapters that would mean UTx Greek system has a very high retention rate. Which is awesome!!! I will use Pi Phi as an example, only because I am more familiar and know the numbers... Not including this past recruitment if we lost no members, Spring 2002 we would have 234 members. To be over 200, our retention rate (as well as others on campus) would have to be near 90%. Which don't get me wrong.. is great.. I have just rarely seen it across the board in a Greek System!

Your retention rate is that high, I could not imagine not adding another chapter. The majority of the chapters would be way to big if the system continues to grow. How far under are the smaller chapters? and what do you think the other chapters or the system can do to help improve that?

Since you are actively involved, I would love to hear more.

[carnation]

I can't figure out how some campuses decide to more or less write off 1 or more smaller groups when deciding whether to add a group. Like they'll have 5 groups of 100 women each and then 2 that hover below 30. If they don't add another group, the big 5 can take more new members but for some reason, PH decides to bring in an 8th group and that kills off the 2 smaller groups. I couldn't tell you how many times I've seen it happen--like PH privately decided,"Those 2 are as good as dead anyway, let's just move on."

[breathesgelatin]

ahhhh!! carnation, I SOOO agree. I don't understand why some schools have almost every group at or near quota, and many women not receiving bids, and WON'T add a group, and then some schools have the problem you described--adding a group when some chapters are already in trouble! It seems to me the latter group should work on improving overall Greek image and unity, not expanding, while the first should try to expand and diversify the Greek system while still remaining exclusive!

[Angels&Arrows]

I think that the Greek Community should pull together and help the smaller chapters. However, (only speaking for southern Greek Systems)... I have noticed that once a chapter has a stigma of being small or the fall back chapter it is hard to pull out of that...

Yes, if the system pulled together and the PNMs would join those chapters, than everyone would be equally strong. However, that does not happen, many PNMs would rather be GDI than join the marked group(s).

Does that mean a school should not bring in a new group that has the potential to succeed? Look at Delta Zeta at UF... There are a few chapters at UF that are under total. Delta Zeta brought out 500 PNMs?... That says something... Why aren't those 500 PNMs trying to fill up the chapters that have room?

I understand that the Greek Community opened their arms to DZ... Maybe chapters feel they have opened their arms to the other chapters and no longer have the interest in helping them? If this goes on at UF.. then I am sure it is an issue on other campuses.

Should PNMs go without a home? Or current chapters become as large as 250-300 members just because you can not bring an additional chapter in until all chapters are at total?

I hope what I am saying makes some kind of sense... I am in a rush to get my daughter to school and then I have class...

Discuss...

[aephi alum]

Originally posted by carnation
I can't figure out how some campuses decide to more or less write off 1 or more smaller groups when deciding whether to add a group. Like they'll have 5 groups of 100 women each and then 2 that hover below 30. If they don't add another group, the big 5 can take more new members but for some reason, PH decides to bring in an 8th group and that kills off the 2 smaller groups. I couldn't tell you how many times I've seen it happen--like PH privately decided,"Those 2 are as good as dead anyway, let's just move on."

This almost happened at my school. 4 out of 5 groups were over total (80), but AEPhi had just been colonized around a year earlier, and we only had about 25 members. The Panhel president really wanted to open the school for expansion, on the grounds that there were a lot of women not receiving bids. She announced this out of the blue at a Panhel meeting one day (I was AEPhi's Panhel rep at the time) and my jaw just hit the floor. We fought the expansion and won - bringing on a new sorority at that time would have destroyed my chapter.

[Lindz928]

Carnation, you put perfectly into words what I was thinking. It is VERY frustrating for me. I am our chapter's panhellenic delegate, so I see what is going on and I don't know if there is anything my chapter can do about it. The new chapter was supposed to come to campus this past fall recruitment, but the numbers were so low last year (2001), that it was decided in panhel to put it off until we could see how this year's numbers were. And this is what I remember them saying at the panhel mtng that decided this.... We will invite the new chapter pending next year's (2002) recruitment numbers, and we will revote on whether we think the other chapter should be invited based on those numbers. Well, we never revoted, because I know my chapter would have voted no.

I would really like to know what my chapter could do about this, or if there is anything that we can do. AEPhi, what you said almost happened to your chapter is exactly what I am worried about. While our greek system might be bigger, it is relatively the same. Chapter total at my campus is 175, and quota for the chapters in recruitment every year is usually somewhere around 50. My chapter has been making huge improvements in the last couple of years, and I want to see that continue. I know that if we have the support of the rest of panhel on our campus, we can become just as strong or stronger than the other chapters that are here. But, just like Carnation said, I feel almost like we have been written off by those in charge. They say they support us, but they seem to do nothing to show it.

I may be completely off in what is going on, and I may be overreacting, but I don't think so. If someone has any advise, please let me know. Thanks alot!!

[RACooper]

Originally posted by Lindz928
That's not exactly true.... This is one of the ways that our system is screwed up. If we add another chapter, it diesn't mean that every house will become smaller in numbers. It means that the biggest houses, the ones that are considered "the best" will keep pulling in the bigger numbers, and the smaller chapters will suffer even more. The big chapters at my school are more concerned with themselves than they are will the greek system as a whole sometimes.

There may have only been 40 or 50 girls who got bids on your campus, but I would be willing to bet that you have a smaller greek system and a smaller school. I go to a school that has 45,000 students, and we are trying to make the greek system bigger, which is why rrecruitment numbers are so important. My only issue is that I think we should make sure that all of the chapters we have now are strong enough and on the same level as the other chapters before we worry about inviting another chapter to colonize.

It is just very frustrating when you think that the greek system that is supposed to be supporting the chapters is more worried about expanding and getting bigger than they are about the chapters they have now.

Well for one our school is a lot larger than yours.... grads/under-grads = 73,000 ish. If you have 11 chapters and each pulls in roughly 40-50 girls (if thats quota), then with 12 chapters quota would be around 35-45... I don't see that as a significant impact. Finally, if your chapter is strong in sisterhood and has those numbers, who cares what the other houses do? Just don't get caught in the numbers game.... quality before quantity.... if you think of a PNM in terms of how many girls that would give you before what you think the PNM will give to the chapter you got the wrong focus.

[oceanphi01]

Yes, it does depend on the amount of women that go through formal recruitment. It also depends on how many COB's you give out throughout the semester to get to total. That's the only way I can see anyone going above the quota set for formal recruitment.

[honeychile]

Originally posted by Angels&Arrows
I think that the Greek Community should pull together and help the smaller chapters. However, (only speaking for southern Greek Systems)... I have noticed that once a chapter has a stigma of being small or the fall back chapter it is hard to pull out of that...

IMHO, Angels&Arrows has summed up the entire Greek system in this paragraph. I was also (over-)involved with Panhel, and it's darn near impossible for a small group to go big, unless they recolonize or (and this has happened!) pledge a field hockey team or the sort!

No matter how hard Panhel tries to help the smaller chapters, it can't be done at the expense of your own - and once the pnm gets the idea that ABC is desirable and XYZ isn't, it's awfully hard to change her mind.

The only way I've seen it work is when, after formal rush, a member of ABC (who is at quota/total) has a friend who didn't rush and is panhellencally minded enough to say to her non-Greek friend, "You know, we're not taking anyone else this year - but why don't you check out XYZ or PQR? The important thing is being a Greek, especially with Greek Week around the corner!" This is how TRUE Panhellenic Recruitment is supposed to work, isn't it?

honeychile

[33girl]

Originally posted by honeychile
The only way I've seen it work is when, after formal rush, a member of ABC (who is at quota/total) has a friend who didn't rush and is panhellencally minded enough to say to her non-Greek friend, "You know, we're not taking anyone else this year - but why don't you check out XYZ or PQR? The important thing is being a Greek, especially with Greek Week around the corner!" This is how TRUE Panhellenic Recruitment is supposed to work, isn't it?

honeychile

Heck, I've done this even when my group WASN'T at total. I know some women who are great, but would not be a good fit for my group. Why talk someone into pledging your org who is going to hate it, just so you can get the numbers? It would be nice if everyone could stop focusing on the almighty quota/total and concentrate on trying to give the rushees the best Greek experience.

[FuzzieAlum]

OK, here's a question for those of you who really know their green books. If chapters close or are added to a campus, how does that affect release numbers for the remaining groups?