Indiana University 2014 Recruitment

[DubaiSis]

There are chapters who take quota additions.

[AZTheta]

Originally Posted by suzy88

My daughter rushed in 2011-12. She didn't get a bid. When she asked about informal recruitment, she was told there would be none, because everyone made their numbers! I saw the email from Panhellenic that stated that. I do not know about the other years, but I've heard that they were the same. I agree that women drop because they didn't get their favorites and that is a problem.
However, even if all women maximized their options on this campus, many women would be left out in the cold. Please don't blame the victims for the current situation at IU. They need a system where the number of bids is based on the number of women participating.

No one is "blaming the victims" in this thread. Read carefully, please. What AOII Angel is stating is that eliminating bed quota =/= all the pnms get their top choice(s). That won't be the case. What it does mean (eliminating bed quota) is that, per RFM, quota will be set based on the # of women signing MRABAs divided by the number of chapters (did I state that correctly, AZ-AlphaXi?). That's a far cry from the present system, where there is no quota per se.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by suzy88

My daughter rushed in 2011-12. She didn't get a bid. When she asked about informal recruitment, she was told there would be none, because everyone made their numbers! I saw the email from Panhellenic that stated that. I do not know about the other years, but I've heard that they were the same. I agree that women drop because they didn't get their favorites and that is a problem.
However, even if all women maximized their options on this campus, many women would be left out in the cold. Please don't blame the victims for the current situation at IU. They need a system where the number of bids is based on the number of women participating.

Victims is a ridiculous word to use, IMHO. Just because no one was doing Informal does NOT mean no one had spots unfilled at the end of recruitment. With supply and demand the way it is, chapters needing a few girls need only make a few calls to fill their houses. (This also belies the claim that the unhoused chapters take everyone, huh?) You are missing a huge point in all of this. Opening up recruitment to normal market forces like most campuses use will still mean that most of these unhappy women will still end up in the SAME chapters they are unhappy to be offered invitations to currently. Having more spots open won't suddenly change your desirability. It's not a huge conspiracy against these individual women. Instead, they need to look at these chapters and see them in the light that they want people to look at the PNMs that feel disenfranchised and unloved. They are doing to those chapters EXACTLY what they accuse the more desired chapters of doing to them. The only real "victims" are the women who are completely released with no options at all. If you don't take an opportunity given to you, then that is your CHOICE. No one is crying for you. We all make choices in life no matter how imperfect. Some choices are just harder to live with than others.

[cinder1965]

Originally Posted by AZTheta

Sigmapisimom, we do "get IU". We do. Believe us, we do. You don't have to have your leg amputated to know that it is painful. The argument of "you have to experience it to understand it" doesn't apply.

And things do change. This past fall's recruitment (elsewhere) brought some changes that have been decades in the making.

Personally, I am heartsick at the outcome of Indiana recruitment every January. Their Panhellenic system is perpetuating an archaic method of selecting members based on what, to me, are invalid reasons. Yet there is some powerful motivation and support to continue it. As a Panhellenic-minded GC member (search my posts, I truly have friends in every chapter), I say "shame" on my sisters.

Answer this, IU Panhellenic: why NOT change? What valid, supportable, evidence-based reasons can you provide for NOT changing?

Bring it. I'm ready.

Completely agree. I am with you, bring it, IU Panhel. I want to see the evidence too. It's long overdue.

[suzy88]

AOII Angel- My daughter was told in a email by Panhell that everyone made their quota. There were no unfilled spots. I tend to take them at their word. Maybe you should check with them. I am shocked by your statement "Having more spots open won't suddenly change your desirability." So you think that the women who aren't getting bids are less desirable? Everyone would end up where they are now, even if all the sororities had more spots? Using the word victim was probably a bad choice. However, I dare you to go through an experience with your child like I have with mine and not feel terrible about it. Things aren't right with this rush. Again, NPC has a place for parents to complain on their website. They must feel things are not right at IU.

[cinder1965]

Originally Posted by AXOrushadvisor

I have been reading this thread and have not commented. I am a recruitment adviser and have been for many years. My daughter just navigated a competitive PAC 12 recruitment with a happy ending. Her experience was not happy all the way through the process and she had peaks and valleys loosing some of her favorites along the way. I think my daughter is street smart more so then the average girl. Looking back her opinions on the Chapters going through recruitment were almost spot on. I think that if some of these girls are not feeling a connection that's ok.

Housing. If you want the sorority experience to include housing and the majority of Chapters have housing that might be a deal breaker for some if not most of the PNM's. For my daughter and for me it would also be a deal breaker. I lived in a sorority house for 2 years. I was the BEST experience ever and I would recommend it to any one. I advise at a non housed chapter that does live in University dorms. It is a completely different experience. There are no meals, no cook and no traditions that go along with those meals including grace. Meetings are held in a classroom and not the Chapter House. You loose a lot by not having that communal shared living experience and being in a dorm or apt. is really not a replacement in my opinion

Bills. There are bills to pay with an unhoused Chapter. The budget is HUGE! What I can tell you is that unhoused and housed Chapters do the exact same thing. In fact, my Chapter does more events then my daughters Chapter and her dues are more then my girls.

Mutual Selection. It is mutual selection. With not getting into membership selection a lot of going through recruitment is who you know. Also, please consider that the Chapters have to release a certain amount of women but get 3/4 through the release list and all the women appear to be equal. At that point you have to figure out a way to weed through that next 1/4 you will release. It might be that the Chapter has predetermined what they are looking for and do it that way. They want to raise their grades and they take that 1/4 from girls who have the lowest GPA. Your girl could have missed it by .10 of a point and been the one left off the list. It is a numbers game at ANY university. We do our best but the reality is we can not take every one. Do we make mistakes? You bet, but hindsight is 20/20. Here is a really good example: 2 years ago we released a friend of a member. At the time we didn't know she was a friend because she didn't tell us! We loved this member and respected her and felt bad about it. She went through the entire process preffed 2 houses and still did not feel a connection. She dropped out of recruitment. This was the year 5 Chapters at our University didn't make quota including us and we Snap Bid her. 2 years later she is the Chapter President! Recruitment is not a science. It is a lot about the way people connect with each other much like dating is. Sometimes one feels the connection but not the other and it goes both ways. A lot of recruitment, whether we want to admit it or not, is how you look and dress and the conversations and connection.

Vent. This site is not good on letting people vent. These Moms are hurting and if you don't have a child that has gone through the process I don't think you can comment or judge what these women are feeling. It is crushing when your daughter calls you in tears. A Mom wants to fix things. It is hard to advise your kid when you are hurting because they are hurting. I do this and get it and it was the most difficult process I have ever gone through including my own recruitment experience. These women are hurting we need to let them hurt. Don't get offended when they tell us what their daughters felt about certain chapters. They don't know you and are just writing it down to work through the grieving process. I personally have not once read elitist or entitled into one of their post. I have read that a Mom is hurting and is trying to make sense of the process. We need to cut them some slack.

Indiana. This was a school my daughter had on her radar very early on. I said absolutely not. There are to many fabulous Universities that have thriving Greek systems that I can give my money to. I will protest with my money. I will tell you I have a rec girl going through the process and she has had a perfect recruitment so far. We will see after bid day. She is involved in a group that has a ton of sorority women in it. I think that has helped her along with the fact that she is the perfect package. Again, Indiana might be a place where who you know matters more then recs and how you look on paper. When someone asks me about the Greek system at Indiana I'm honest and tell them it has the most horrible process in the country and recommend if they want to go Greek to do it at another University. I also direct them to the Pan website and have them read those comments. Not many choose to go there after being educated.

100% agree.

[AZ-AlphaXi]

Originally Posted by AZTheta

No one is "blaming the victims" in this thread. Read carefully, please. What AOII Angel is stating is that eliminating bed quota =/= all the pnms get their top choice(s). That won't be the case. What it does mean (eliminating bed quota) is that, per RFM, quota will be set based on the # of women attending preference parties divided by the number of chapters (did I state that correctly, AZ-Alpha Xi?). That's a far cry from the present system, where there is no quota per se.

Actually, when using RFM, quota is set using the number of PNMs who sign MRABA forms .. so women who attend preference but don't sign MRABA forms aren't counted into quota.

[DubaiSis]

If each chapter took 5 more girls, that would get us to approximately 100 more girls getting placed. That would help but it still wouldn't get all girls placed or guarantee the girl who is adamant that she is MEANT to be an ABC will be one. Who we think we are and who the world sees us as are sometimes nowhere near the same thing. The fact is at normal schools, girls complain and/or cry and/or drop out of rush because ABC cut them and it was the only chapter "they felt comfortable in." If IU threw out bed quota there would still be 5 or 6 most competitive chapters and girls would be screaming about getting stuck with "that" chapter. Then IU would fall inline with Alabama and Texas for crazy competitive, but not straight up mean.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

If each chapter took 5 more girls, that would get us to approximately 100 more girls getting placed. That would help but it still wouldn't get all girls placed or guarantee the girl who is adamant that she is MEANT to be an ABC will be one. Who we think we are and who the world sees us as are sometimes nowhere near the same thing. The fact is at normal schools, girls complain and/or cry and/or drop out of rush because ABC cut them and it was the only chapter "they felt comfortable in." If IU threw out bed quota there would still be 5 or 6 most competitive chapters and girls would be screaming about getting stuck with "that" chapter. Then IU would fall inline with Alabama and Texas for crazy competitive, but not straight up mean.

This. And what people don't take into consideration is that the more women who sign their bid cards AND maximize their options, the more women are placed as quota additions...even at IU.

[suzy88]

[IF IU threw out bed quota there would still be 5 or 6 most competitive chapters and girls would be screaming about getting stuck with "that" chapter. Then IU would fall inline with Alabama and Texas for crazy competitive, but not straight up mean.[/QUOTE]

Yes, I think you are totally right. Let's get rid of the mean! We can't get rid of the competitive.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by suzy88

[IF IU threw out bed quota there would still be 5 or 6 most competitive chapters and girls would be screaming about getting stuck with "that" chapter. Then IU would fall inline with Alabama and Texas for crazy competitive, but not straight up mean.

Yes, I think you are totally right. Let's get rid of the mean! We can't get rid of the competitive.[/QUOTE]

We all pray that happens but are doubtful it will.

[suzy88]

I don't get it. There must be something I don't understand. If quota is based on how many women can be housed (at the sororities with houses at IU) where do women who are quota additions live?

[DubaiSis]

At a normal school? In the dorms or in apartments. At IU, that is just VERY slowly starting to occur, but more than likely girls will get apartments together in a building so that they can be with their friends but not under the restrictions of the chapter house. Like drinking and boys

[irishpipes]

Originally Posted by suzy88

I don't get it. There must be something I don't understand. If quota is based on how many women can be housed (at the sororities with houses at IU) where do women who are quota additions live?

There are a few chapters at IU that allow live-outs, so those could accept QAs because they aren't adhering to a strict bed rush. The unhoused chapters could also take QAs.

[AZTheta]

Where are the statistics on QAs at Indiana, please?