Fall Rush at UGA

[RU OX Alum]

Originally Posted by EE-BO

Sure- and it does happen. When I was an active we had a particularly good rush one summer and ended up taking almost 40 pledges instead of the usual 25 or so we would normally take in the fall.

Worked out pretty good, but it had its drawbacks. Those guys ended up being a huge voting block in the chapter and that created some friction- especially when they were upperclassmen and held almost all the major offices in the chapter.

Sometimes it can work for the better to have a mega-sized pledge class come along, but usually only if you are in growth mode or if fundamental change is needed in the chapter. If things are running along on course however, it can be problematic.

Oh okay then, that makes sense. I thought it was just arbitrary. I agree about not taking too many, one of the groups here that always had big pledge classes was hit harder than the rest of us during a one or two year dry spell of interested guys, so instead of their of usual 5 fall/ 10 spring class size, one spring after like 3 semester of only 3 - 5 pledges a semester they put bids out on i forget how many people, but they wound up with 19 pledges, which was more than the rest of the chapter minus graduating seinors. I think that pledge class held every position as sophmores until they graduated.

[ugadawg]

I would be careful relying on the suggested fraternity tiers at UGA and serioiusly question the rankings. When I saw the prior post, I went to Old Row to see what posters had said. Almost all of the posts are by a handful of people, most of whom spend time trashing each other and other houses (a most unfratty thing to do if you're in a decent house). Go through summer rush (a lot of the houses have websites and list rush parties - rush is not a time to be timid - but don't be obnoxious either) - most houses have given out or have commitments for a significant portion of their pledge classes before formal rush starts. In the end its not the tier but how well you fit with the group.

[nate2512]

[quota] lot of the houses have websites and list rush parties [/quote]

In my experience, which may be way different at UGA, but most of the time chapters with decent up-to-date websites with all sorts of rush events, generally aren't quality chapters.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by ugadawg

I would be careful relying on the suggested fraternity tiers at UGA and serioiusly question the rankings. When I saw the prior post, I went to Old Row to see what posters had said. Almost all of the posts are by a handful of people, most of whom spend time trashing each other and other houses (a most unfratty thing to do if you're in a decent house). Go through summer rush (a lot of the houses have websites and list rush parties - rush is not a time to be timid - but don't be obnoxious either) - most houses have given out or have commitments for a significant portion of their pledge classes before formal rush starts. In the end its not the tier but how well you fit with the group.

ewalt?

those that don't believe in tiers are likely in the lowest one.

[jarred66]

Originally Posted by nate2512

[quota] lot of the houses have websites and list rush parties

In my experience, which may be way different at UGA, but most of the time chapters with decent up-to-date websites with all sorts of rush events, generally aren't quality chapters.[/quote]
very true

[ugadawg]

The prior poster was concerned about rushing as a sophmore and how he would do in rush. I agree that most top houses don't have or have very poor webpages. But if poster wants to go greek and he doesn't have an in with a house or two, that might be is only option for summer rush. As to top tiers - I didn't say there aren't different tiers (I just differed on which ones are top). But I don't think the posters on Old Row were top tier guys - I don't think top tier guys spend a lot of time trashing each other on the web - its the bottom tier guys who are doing this to try to make themselves look better.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by ugadawg

The prior poster was concerned about rushing as a sophmore and how he would do in rush. I agree that most top houses don't have or have very poor webpages. But if poster wants to go greek and he doesn't have an in with a house or two, that might be is only option for summer rush. As to top tiers - I didn't say there aren't different tiers (I just differed on which ones are top). But I don't think the posters on Old Row were top tier guys - I don't think top tier guys spend a lot of time trashing each other on the web - its the bottom tier guys who are doing this to try to make themselves look better.

I've wondered the same thing about who is really doing the online rankings, outings, etc.

I can completely see a nice guy from a good chapter taking a little time to explain how stuff works just because he's a nice guy and because he wants to make sure his chapter keeps getting good guys.

I can't really see a guy from a good chapter preferring to spend his time talking crap about other chapters or doing online research about other posters when he could be enjoying whatever spoils come from actually being in a top tier chapter.

Unless it's recent alums from good chapters who are really bored at work, maybe.

[CrackerBarrel]

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

I've wondered the same thing about who is really doing the online rankings, outings, etc.

I can completely see a nice guy from a good chapter taking a little time to explain how stuff works just because he's a nice guy and because he wants to make sure his chapter keeps getting good guys.

I can't really see a guy from a good chapter preferring to spend his time talking crap about other chapters or doing online research about other posters when he could be enjoying whatever spoils come from actually being in a top tier chapter.

Unless it's recent alums from good chapters who are really bored at work, maybe.

The tiers listed tend to be right on. And there generally isn't a whole lot of bashing other chapters at your school (unless someone who you know to be bottom tier starts trying to act like they're the sh*t), that's more on JuicyCampus and is more bottom tier guys. Most of it is recent alums at work/actives in class who have to be there but don't have anything better to do.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by CrackerBarrel

The tiers listed tend to be right on. And there generally isn't a whole lot of bashing other chapters at your school (unless someone who you know to be bottom tier starts trying to act like they're the sh*t), that's more on JuicyCampus and is more bottom tier guys. Most of it is recent alums at work/actives in class who have to be there but don't have anything better to do.

This is exactly true. People who are 2nd tier accept the 2nd tier. Not a terrible lot of bitching unless it's like a "Are they low 1st or top 2nd tier?" type thing.There's only bitching and fighting when it's some Acacia from Texas claiming that they're fratty or something like that. I mean come on.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

This is exactly true. People who are 2nd tier accept the 2nd tier. Not a terrible lot of bitching unless it's like a "Are they low 1st or top 2nd tier?" type thing.There's only bitching and fighting when it's some Acacia from Texas claiming that they're fratty or something like that. I mean come on.

I don't doubt the rankings are basically accurate although I do sometimes wonder how people can get impressions to discern among different tier groups that they don't really associate with.

I would think that within your own tier, you'd actually know, but beyond that, how would anyone know about groups that they weren't having socials with who weren't clearly outstanding or on the brink of folding?

I've said this before, I think: the rankings may do disservice to the kind of journeyman groups that are a pleasure to be in and make college more fun but aren't really dazzling folks in the first tier. Guys and girls who aren't going to get bids to the top groups (because of lack of connections or whatever) might really benefit from looking at these groups in some other context other than just as third tier or whatever.

It's particularly true for girls who don't really end up having that much control over rush. If you aren't getting a bid to a higher tier group, what good does it do to know in advance that the group that wants you is "bottom feeder" in the eyes of a guy who graduated three years ago or even that the group is bottom half of the second tier?

[CrackerBarrel]

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

I don't doubt the rankings are basically accurate although I do sometimes wonder how people can get impressions to discern among different tier groups that they don't really associate with.

I would think that within your own tier, you'd actually know, but beyond that, how would anyone know about groups that they weren't having socials with who weren't clearly outstanding or on the brink of folding?

I've said this before, I think: the rankings may do disservice to the kind of journeyman groups that are a pleasure to be in and make college more fun but aren't really dazzling folks in the first tier. Guys and girls who aren't going to get bids to the top groups (because of lack of connections or whatever) might really benefit from looking at these groups in some other context other than just as third tier or whatever.

It's particularly true for girls who don't really end up having that much control over rush. If you aren't getting a bid to a higher tier group, what good does it do to know in advance that the group that wants you is "bottom feeder" in the eyes of a guy who graduated three years ago or even that the group is bottom half of the second tier?

The guys tiers are a lot more important I think, because if you're rushing it makes a big difference to know if in the middle tiers you're looking at a house that is only slightly worse than the very best houses or a house that is a lot closer to the houses where you might as well not join a fraternity than it is to the top ones.

Sorority tiers on the other hand are based primarily on which of the fraternity tiers they do their events with, then ranked within that tier by what stereotype fits their house.

And obviously some of the lower tier houses may be a lot of fun or very rewarding to be in, just they do very poorly if judged by the same categories which establish who the very top houses are.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by CrackerBarrel

The guys tiers are a lot more important I think, because if you're rushing it makes a big difference to know if in the middle tiers you're looking at a house that is only slightly worse than the very best houses or a house that is a lot closer to the houses where you might as well not join a fraternity than it is to the top ones.

Sorority tiers on the other hand are based primarily on which of the fraternity tiers they do their events with, then ranked within that tier by what stereotype fits their house.

And obviously some of the lower tier houses may be a lot of fun or very rewarding to be in, just they do very poorly if judged by the same categories which establish who the very top houses are.

It's interesting that you say that about sorority tiers being primarily based on fraternity socials. I think popularity with fraternities is a component of sorority tiers and is the primary reason why some groups can't ever move up to the next level, but I had considered recruitment results the primary thing for sororities.

Interesting.

[CrackerBarrel]

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

It's interesting that you say that about sorority tiers being primarily based on fraternity socials. I think popularity with fraternities is a component of sorority tiers and is the primary reason why some groups can't ever move up to the next level, but I had considered recruitment results the primary thing for sororities.

Interesting.

Well, when you see these tiers they're usually being put together by guys. The reasoning tends to be "we're top-tier, the girls we hang out with are top-tier."

And yes this does keep sororities from moving up some, but part of it is the girls' fault too. There are guys in the fraternity who would like to do stuff with them as they improve, but they keep agreeing to do stuff with the same lower tier houses they've always hung out with and say a high second-tier house makes themselves look bad if they have a social with a sorority who had a lot of their other events with much worse houses.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by CrackerBarrel

Well, when you see these tiers they're usually being put together by guys. The reasoning tends to be "we're top-tier, the girls we hang out with are top-tier."

And yes this does keep sororities from moving up some, but part of it is the girls' fault too. There are guys in the fraternity who would like to do stuff with them as they improve, but they keep agreeing to do stuff with the same lower tier houses they've always hung out with and say a high second-tier house makes themselves look bad if they have a social with a sorority who had a lot of their other events with much worse houses.

Probably true, but man, it seems lame. Very middle school popularity thinking.

[EE-BO]

UGAalum94- one thing that I think helps is to know that top tier fraternities and sororities tend to recruit from very specific places and have done so for a very long time. At Texas, I think it is safe to say the very top end GLOs get most of their numbers out of a very few high schools. So that right there establishes a lot of how the tier system works.

More than anything else, it is driven by the natural urge to go to college and find "safety" in people you know and have things in common with. This is an urge that lasts all through life- and it applies to everyone, not just the affluent. I like to think I am one of those people who can interact comfortably at all levels and truly enjoy and respect people for who they are, but I also have a very specific comfort zone which, for example, dictates where I live. That is something I am scrupulously picky about even though I am more comfortable than most to drive around and do business/hang out in many parts of town.

Many people in top tier organizations choose to wall themselves off in that small world. Their loss, but it is an attitude that came before and will endure after they go Greek.

If a person is comfortable and happy with their chapter, it is easy to talk about the tiers and be practical about it. Talking about them here helps I think in guiding people who are unfamiliar with Greek life since it educates them in the fact that there can be a big difference between a top tier chapter and the chapter that is right for the person looking for a place to pledge.

Granted, that is not how it always goes down- so I get your point. But I think that most people who have a truly deep and angry opposition to the notion of "tiers" are people who are not in top houses and wish they were. And people like that are doing their own chapters a disservice because that attitude means they think they deserve something else but pledged where they did just to have letters. (And for the record, I am not including you in that group since I think you are talking more about the presentation of the discussion and not the existence of tiers.)