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10-02-2005, 08:49 AM
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GreekChat Member
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Lexington, KY, USA
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You're awesome, lifesaver...you said exactly what I was going to say so that I don't have to type a big long post now. 
There's a lot of this argument I don't buy. For example, I don't wear miniskirts up to my arse because the media says I have to; I wear them because I like doing so. If I don't feel like wearing revealing clothing one day, I won't. Like valkyrie said, it's that simple. I can't speak for all women, but I personally don't feel like society views me as an 'object,' so a religion that requires sexuality off-limits wouldn't do anything for me. I don't think I'd like it too much, actually. I get the impression that this thread is trying to turn into a Christian vs. Islam debate. (That was basically the original question, right?) Since I'm neither Christian nor Muslim I'm not going to add anything for either side, but I'll just say...the OP's got nerve for starting this debate so early in the morning... *yawn*
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10-02-2005, 06:35 PM
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GreekChat Member
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Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Ya man's a headache, I'll be ya aspirin
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Quote:
Originally posted by hank1
The Christians most likely killed WAY more protestants, Jews and 'Indian's in South America. Also, North Americans killing the natives and all that. Islam also has its extremists but it united the disparaged tribes of the Middle East and brought peace to the region, which led to it being the bastion of learning, right? Technically speaking, the Destabilization of the area started with the crusades and then continued under many an imperial regime.
I don’t know why people hate Islam; I think the hate comes from the media. Some Americans are so ignorant and gullible that they allow the media to deceive them. Its always "a suicide bomber killed this many" and "violent Palestinian boys throw rocks" but if we look at the bigger picture its a rock against a tank, apache helicopters, grenades and the list goes on. From this view it is quite simple to see the injustice.
Things like 9/11 happen daily in Palestine only like 10X more inhuman all due to American funds. So we don’t require a great stretch of the imagination to understand why Muslims might be angry with the West at the moment. They could easily find faults with "Christianity" in their turn, since so many Christians are acting in total contradiction to Christian principles.
I will add to your list another Moslems with big impact on history!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Crusade Expedition
Josef Stalin
Bush father
Bush son
Blair
Serbia Leader Molsefitch
All Israelis leaders and government members from the begging to date.
Etc
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Good lord, this shouldn’t be this easy.
BTW, if you’re gonna play on GC in a debate, PLEASE actually debate what is posted instead of just cut and paste PR from the falafel vendor.
A few points from above.
If Arab Muslims EVER want their grievances to be taken seriously in the west, ya'll gotta stop with the crusades shit. SERIOUSLY, for Allah’s sake, it was 1,500 YEARS ago. I’ve pissed off some crazy bitches in my time, but NONE had a memory that lasted that long. YOU didn’t know anyone who died, and in the end, ya'll pretty much kept the middle east. Ottoman Empire anyone? So you’re bitching about some shit ya'll won anyway. LET-IT-GO. You're beating a dead camel.
Nobody on here said anything on here about westerners hating the Christian Africans. So thanks for bringing up a non-point. I think its the Arab Muslims that have the beef with Christians in their backyard. Sudan, anyone?
You also need to stop that shit with the "Islam united the tribes." Islam didn’t do that. Oil did. Ya'll were butchering the hell outta each other till 80 years ago when BP threw a spigot in the sand and 'up from the ground came a bubbling crude...oil that is....Texas tea." It would still be heads rollin in the sand over there if it wasn’t for oil. To pretend otherwise is just foolishness. It's not like the Qur'an taught anyone how to be a successful bizillionaire. Again, Oil did that. Oil civilized the mid-east. It provided the intra-arab stability no religion EVER could. Not Islam, Not Judaism, Not Christianity.
And lets not forget that the US has dropped the bombs on a few CHRISTIANS who were whopping the hell up on Muslims. Bosnia, anyone? Where were the mujahideen in 1995 when Scott O'Grady had to bail out of his plane over Bosnia defending the no-fly zone to protect the Muslims? Where were all those brave Islamic Freedom Fighters (other than at hate camp) when he was living in the woods for 5 days eating roaches and stuff? Yeah, we as the US stepped in cause the Arab Islamic countries couldn’t get their shit together to help their own people... as usual.
Your final point goes back to the first post I made, which is that Arab Muslims just don’t get it. You all think that just because US foreign policy says one thing, we all agree with it. I don’t know what the Bedouins are teaching in the tents at night, but its wrong. As an American, I think our Israeli foreign policy is FOOLISH AND STUPID, and so do many people ( I like to believe in the Nixon, ‘silent majority’). I hate that we support Israel. But I'll let you in on a secret. The reason why we do it is two fold. (Let me announce publicly, that I don’t support or agree with these reasons, but they are obvious to even the most causal observer). First, they look like us. It’s a natural extension of the inherent racism that exists in America. If it the Jews were the brown ones and the Palestinians were white, we'd be selling tanks and planes to a whole 'nother group. And second, we like the Jews because they have money and like to buy shit from us Americans. They buy all kinds of shit. F-14's, Double Espresso Caramel Macchiato’s at Starbucks, and baby tees at the Gap. If the situation was reversed It wouldn’t be the Palestinians wearing dynamite belts and climbing onto metro busses. The Jews in Israel buy our shit and we as greedy Americans love that shit. It’s like CRACK for us and we can’t say no. Want the US Support, get jobs and buy our stuff. We go where the cash is. We’re whores like that. Give us an emerging market and we’re there. Example: Vietnam. They’ll be digging up US servicemen from their unmarked graves to put in a Wal-Mart in a matter of months.. Its just how we are.
I don’t think anyone (especially on GC) hates Islam. But to me it seems like most Arab Muslim extremists hate themselves. That they aren’t the world leaders anymore. Again, from an earlier post, it just looks and smells a lot like jealousy to me.
Last edited by lifesaver; 10-02-2005 at 06:39 PM.
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10-02-2005, 07:57 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: Taking lessons at Cobra Kai Karate!
Posts: 14,928
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Umm perhaps you should look at the skin color of Israelis just a tad bit closer. There are even darker shades in the Israeli population than the Arab population. The European roots of Israelis are definitely in the minority and the current ruling party is the darker party.
Anyway, I agree, this whole bullshit about the crusades needs to stop. Given that Islam spread through the sword into so many areas of the world and is trying to do the same with guns now, you have to be an absolute moron to bring up the crusades over and over. Heck why don't we discuss Mohammed and how he gained control over Mecca? Here's a hint: He didn't do it by offering brownies to the locals. The same Mecca is used to cut off body parts to this day. And the Armenian genocide of millions by the Ottomans just a few decades ago is quite the problem for Turkey as it wants to join the EU. The crusades are the last thing anyone has the right to bring up.
This guy is the Muslim version of Reverand Hatchett.
-Rudey
Quote:
Originally posted by lifesaver
Good lord, this shouldn’t be this easy.
BTW, if you’re gonna play on GC in a debate, PLEASE actually debate what is posted instead of just cut and paste PR from the falafel vendor.
A few points from above.
If Arab Muslims EVER want their grievances to be taken seriously in the west, ya'll gotta stop with the crusades shit. SERIOUSLY, for Allah’s sake, it was 1,500 YEARS ago. I’ve pissed off some crazy bitches in my time, but NONE had a memory that lasted that long. YOU didn’t know anyone who died, and in the end, ya'll pretty much kept the middle east. Ottoman Empire anyone? So you’re bitching about some shit ya'll won anyway. LET-IT-GO. You're beating a dead camel.
Nobody on here said anything on here about westerners hating the Christian Africans. So thanks for bringing up a non-point. I think its the Arab Muslims that have the beef with Christians in their backyard. Sudan, anyone?
You also need to stop that shit with the "Islam united the tribes." Islam didn’t do that. Oil did. Ya'll were butchering the hell outta each other till 80 years ago when BP threw a spigot in the sand and 'up from the ground came a bubbling crude...oil that is....Texas tea." It would still be heads rollin in the sand over there if it wasn’t for oil. To pretend otherwise is just foolishness. It's not like the Qur'an taught anyone how to be a successful bizillionaire. Again, Oil did that. Oil civilized the mid-east. It provided the intra-arab stability no religion EVER could. Not Islam, Not Judaism, Not Christianity.
And lets not forget that the US has dropped the bombs on a few CHRISTIANS who were whopping the hell up on Muslims. Bosnia, anyone? Where were the mujahideen in 1995 when Scott O'Grady had to bail out of his plane over Bosnia defending the no-fly zone to protect the Muslims? Where were all those brave Islamic Freedom Fighters (other than at hate camp) when he was living in the woods for 5 days eating roaches and stuff? Yeah, we as the US stepped in cause the Arab Islamic countries couldn’t get their shit together to help their own people... as usual.
Your final point goes back to the first post I made, which is that Arab Muslims just don’t get it. You all think that just because US foreign policy says one thing, we all agree with it. I don’t know what the Bedouins are teaching in the tents at night, but its wrong. As an American, I think our Israeli foreign policy is FOOLISH AND STUPID, and so do many people ( I like to believe in the Nixon, ‘silent majority’). I hate that we support Israel. But I'll let you in on a secret. The reason why we do it is two fold. (Let me announce publicly, that I don’t support or agree with these reasons, but they are obvious to even the most causal observer). First, they look like us. It’s a natural extension of the inherent racism that exists in America. If it the Jews were the brown ones and the Palestinians were white, we'd be selling tanks and planes to a whole 'nother group. And second, we like the Jews because they have money and like to buy shit from us Americans. They buy all kinds of shit. F-14's, Double Espresso Caramel Macchiato’s at Starbucks, and baby tees at the Gap. If the situation was reversed It wouldn’t be the Palestinians wearing dynamite belts and climbing onto metro busses. The Jews in Israel buy our shit and we as greedy Americans love that shit. It’s like CRACK for us and we can’t say no. Want the US Support, get jobs and buy our stuff. We go where the cash is. We’re whores like that. Give us an emerging market and we’re there. Example: Vietnam. They’ll be digging up US servicemen from their unmarked graves to put in a Wal-Mart in a matter of months.. Its just how we are.
I don’t think anyone (especially on GC) hates Islam. But to me it seems like most Arab Muslim extremists hate themselves. That they aren’t the world leaders anymore. Again, from an earlier post, it just looks and smells a lot like jealousy to me.
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10-02-2005, 10:45 PM
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GreekChat Member
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Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Ya man's a headache, I'll be ya aspirin
Posts: 5,298
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rudey
Umm perhaps you should look at the skin color of Israelis just a tad bit closer. There are even darker shades in the Israeli population than the Arab population. The European roots of Israelis are definitely in the minority and the current ruling party is the darker party.
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I was making a broad generalization about that, since it seems to be de rigeur with this cat. You know, Western culture opresses all women, etc.
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10-03-2005, 04:26 AM
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GreekChat Member
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 9
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my point is why Islam is increasing although West is fighting this religion indirectly through media?
I think Islam was thought of as some "Eastern" religion, but with the increasing number of Muslims living in the West, Islam is gradually being perceived as a global faith. Muslims are not thought of as strangers with unusual practices, but are being welcomed as part of the mosaic of life in the West. In many cases, Islam is not just viewed as an acceptable religion, but as a desired way of living.
Influence through reading new sources contributed more in conversion, like this:
God revealed a holy book to Jesus called the Injeel, some parts of which may be still available in the teachings of God to Jesus in the New Testament. But this does not mean that the Bible we have today because it is not the original scriptures that were revealed by God. They underwent alterations, additions, and omissions. This was also said by the Committee charged with revising The Holy Bible (Revised Standard Version). This Committee consisted of thirty-two scholars who served as members of the Committee. They secured the review and counsel of an Advisory Board of fifty representatives of the co-operating denominations.
The Committee said in the Preface to The Holy Bible (Revised Standard Version), p. iv, “Sometimes it is evident that the text has suffered in transmission, but none of the versions provides a satisfactory restoration. Here we can only follow the best judgment of competent scholars as to the most probable reconstruction of the original text.
The Committee also said in the Preface, p. vii, Notes are added which indicate significant variations, additions, or omissions in the ancient authorities (Mt 9.34; Mk 3.16; 7.4; Lk 24.32, 51, etc.).
Maybe some do believe in the information declared in the following sites.
THE TRUTH ABOUT JESUS
http://sultan.org/articles/Jesus.html
Who Was Jesus According to Jesus?
http://www.islaminfo.com
IS THE BIBLE GODS WORD?
http://www.jamaat.net/bible/Bible1-3.html
Women in Christianity and Islam
http://www.jamiat.org.za/isinfo/wchristian.html
The Bible - A Closer Look!
http://www.todayislam.com/bible.htm
The Islamic and Christian views of Jesus: a comparison
http://www.soundvision.com/Info/Jesus/inIslam.asp
Christ in Islam
http://home2.swipnet.se/~w-20479/Christ.htm
Mary & Jesus in Quran
http://www.islamworld.net/
Is Jesus the Same as God?
http://home2.swipnet.se/~w-20479/Samegod.htm
None of the Bible’s Writers Believed That Jesus is God
http://www.islam-guide.com/ch3-10-1.htm
Jesus Will Descend at the End of Time
http://www.islaam.com/Article.aspx?id=77
http://www.jamaat.net/letters.htm
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10-03-2005, 06:27 AM
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Super Moderator
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Southeast Asia
Posts: 9,026
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Not true Rudey, this guy haven't condemn us all to hell because of our greek affiliation. Give him time though.
__________________
Spambot Killer 
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10-03-2005, 06:58 AM
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GreekChat Member
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 1,293
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wow... and I thought I scared Hank away in his "hello" thread.
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10-03-2005, 10:41 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: Taking lessons at Cobra Kai Karate!
Posts: 14,928
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Reasons why you are annoying include:
1) Your stupidity in believing people will convert through your copy-and-paste activities.
2) Your stupidity in calling Islam a global or Western religion given its own rejection of the West. Does someone want a caliphate?
3) Your inability to speak English while writing incredibly lengthy posts.
-Rudey
Quote:
Originally posted by hank1
my point is why Islam is increasing although West is fighting this religion indirectly through media?
I think Islam was thought of as some "Eastern" religion, but with the increasing number of Muslims living in the West, Islam is gradually being perceived as a global faith. Muslims are not thought of as strangers with unusual practices, but are being welcomed as part of the mosaic of life in the West. In many cases, Islam is not just viewed as an acceptable religion, but as a desired way of living.
Influence through reading new sources contributed more in conversion, like this:
God revealed a holy book to Jesus called the Injeel, some parts of which may be still available in the teachings of God to Jesus in the New Testament. But this does not mean that the Bible we have today because it is not the original scriptures that were revealed by God. They underwent alterations, additions, and omissions. This was also said by the Committee charged with revising The Holy Bible (Revised Standard Version). This Committee consisted of thirty-two scholars who served as members of the Committee. They secured the review and counsel of an Advisory Board of fifty representatives of the co-operating denominations.
The Committee said in the Preface to The Holy Bible (Revised Standard Version), p. iv, “Sometimes it is evident that the text has suffered in transmission, but none of the versions provides a satisfactory restoration. Here we can only follow the best judgment of competent scholars as to the most probable reconstruction of the original text.
The Committee also said in the Preface, p. vii, Notes are added which indicate significant variations, additions, or omissions in the ancient authorities (Mt 9.34; Mk 3.16; 7.4; Lk 24.32, 51, etc.).
Maybe some do believe in the information declared in the following sites.
THE TRUTH ABOUT JESUS
http://sultan.org/articles/Jesus.html
Who Was Jesus According to Jesus?
http://www.islaminfo.com
IS THE BIBLE GODS WORD?
http://www.jamaat.net/bible/Bible1-3.html
Women in Christianity and Islam
http://www.jamiat.org.za/isinfo/wchristian.html
The Bible - A Closer Look!
http://www.todayislam.com/bible.htm
The Islamic and Christian views of Jesus: a comparison
http://www.soundvision.com/Info/Jesus/inIslam.asp
Christ in Islam
http://home2.swipnet.se/~w-20479/Christ.htm
Mary & Jesus in Quran
http://www.islamworld.net/
Is Jesus the Same as God?
http://home2.swipnet.se/~w-20479/Samegod.htm
None of the Bible’s Writers Believed That Jesus is God
http://www.islam-guide.com/ch3-10-1.htm
Jesus Will Descend at the End of Time
http://www.islaam.com/Article.aspx?id=77
http://www.jamaat.net/letters.htm
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10-07-2005, 12:13 AM
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Super Moderator
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
Posts: 18,668
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hank --
Do you work for some sort of Muslim outreach group?
If this is the way you guys try to "reach out", have one of your folks actually use their student visas to attend class... maybe classes on Public Relations.
The gist of your argument seems to be somehow that Christianity is simply "made up", it's a farce and in essence, untrue. From what I've read of your links, their versions of the history of the Christian church differ greatly from that of the Christian church.. but I digress.
Your answers thus far have been nonresponsive and deceptive -- almost as if they were read straight off of Hamas' website. Please try and answer some of our questions. I started reading this thread thinking that it was going to possibly be an interesting discussion of cultures, however, it appears that you're only interested in having a one way conversation in which you dispense propaganda.
__________________
SN -SINCE 1869-
"EXCELLING WITH HONOR"
S N E T T
Mu Tau 5, Central Oklahoma
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10-11-2005, 07:37 AM
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GreekChat Member
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 9
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Quran:
11/51 O people! I ask of you no reward for this (Message). My reward is from none but Allah Who created me: will ye not then understand?
Quran:
Chapter No 005
Titel The Table Spread
005/116. And when Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Didst thou say unto mankind: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah? he saith: Be glorified It was not mine to utter that to which I had no right. If I used to say it, then Thou knewest it. Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I know not what is in Thy mind. Lo! Thou, only Thou art the Knower of Things Hidden.
005/117. I spake unto them only that which Thou commandedst me, (saying) : Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. I was a witness of them while I dwelt among them, and when Thou tookest me Thou wast the Watcher over them. Thou art Witness over all things.
005/118. If Thou punish them, lo! they are Thy slaves, and if Thou forgive them (lo! they are Thy slaves). Lo! Thou, only Thou art the Mighty, the Wise.
005/119. Allah saith: This is a day in which their truthfulness profiteth the truthful, for theirs are Gardens underneath which rivers flow, wherein they are secure for ever, Allah taking pleasure in them and they in Him. That is the great triumph.
Chapter No 004
Titel The Women
004/157. And because of their saying: We slew the Messiah Jesus son of Mary, Allah's messenger They slew him not nor crucified, but it appeared so unto them; and lo! those who disagree concerning it are in doubt thereof; they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture ; they slew him not for certain.
004/158. But Allah took him up unto Himself. Allah was ever Mighty, wise.
004/159. There is not one of the People of the Scripture but will believe in him before his death, and on the Day of Resurrection he will be a witness against them
004/170. O mankind! The messenger hath come unto you with the truth from your Lord. Therefor believe; ( it is) better for you. But if ye disbelieve, still, lo! unto Allah belongeth whatsoever is in the heavens and the earth. Allah is ever Knower, Wise.
004/171. O People of the Scripture! Do not exaggerate in your religion nor utter aught concerning Allah save the truth. The Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, was only a messenger of Allah, and His word which He conveyed unto Mary, and a spirit from Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers, and say not "Three". Cease! (it is) better for you! Allah is only One God. Far is it removed from His transcendent majesty that he should have a son. His is all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth. And Allah is sufficient as Defender
The natural inclination for religious faith is an integral part of the human essence. This is an indisputable fact of history. All scholars of comparative religion, regardless of their own religious backgrounds, agree that religious belief is a natural human condition. They differ, however about its origins.
"It is unreasonable to think that so many American converted to Islam without careful consideration and deep contemplation. before concluding that Islam is true. These Americans came from different classes, races and walks of life. , and every other sort of person imaginable"
No comments!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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10-11-2005, 10:10 AM
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Super Moderator
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
Posts: 18,668
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You cut and paste english, but do you speak it?
Your responses are non-responsive.
If you're getting paid for this, you should be fired.
__________________
SN -SINCE 1869-
"EXCELLING WITH HONOR"
S N E T T
Mu Tau 5, Central Oklahoma
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10-11-2005, 10:22 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 175
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He posted this same thing on a Disney board.
Hank. 
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10-11-2005, 11:49 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: Taking lessons at Cobra Kai Karate!
Posts: 14,928
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Quote:
Originally posted by so damn cool
He posted this same thing on a Disney board.
Hank.
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Is he ruining the magic there too? This is ridiculous.
-Rudey
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10-11-2005, 01:00 PM
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GreekChat Member
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 1,293
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I'd liked Hank better when we just knew his commercial and not his opinions.
*in ref. to the starbucks commercial*
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