UNC rejects religious fraternity

[lifesaver]

Originally posted by hoosier
Why would UNC be giving money to student groups?

If you are a registered group, do they give you money?

Not necessarily, but you are ELIGABLE to receive funding. Example, your GLO wants to bring on speakers on say, risk management issues, then you could apply to a fund to pay for it. Or if you wanted to send a few undergrads to a leadership conference, you could apply to get funding to send a few members.

If youre a registered student group.


But if I had a dollar for every congresman that "called for an investigation' I'd be a millionare. I hate grandstanding. Ugh. House members are so trashy anyway.

[moe.ron]

Originally posted by lifesaver
But if I had a dollar for every congresman that "called for an investigation' I'd be a millionare. I hate grandstanding. Ugh. House members are so trashy anyway.

you'll probably bet set for life brah.

I know in my school, none of the greek organizations gets any sort of funding, wether from the school or the student government.

[Kevin]

Originally posted by TarHeelGirl
at unc, one can be an officially recognized group but not receive student fee money (which is legislatively appropriated by student congress). most greek organizations are officially recognized but receive no funds.

from the unc student organizations website:

"Requirements

So basically,they student gov't had no real reason to not allow them membership. But that's also the student government's purpose. I kind of admire them for actually turning an organization down. We had a small problem with individuals that started clubs only to get a senate seat -- the clubs did NOTHING. I kind of led the charge against one of these groups which was approved by a margin of only 3 votes. Was such a waste.

They were called "El Burros Del Rio" (no, they had nothing to do with spanish/latino culture), their charter actually said their purpose was "Random acts of kindness". I could go off on a tangent here, but I won't

But as far as not voting an organization in because it's religious... well, I have concerns about that, but it's their right to do that as the representatives of the student body.

[IheartAphi]

Up the road at NC STATE, Greek organizations can get money for philantrophy events. They gave ADpi $1,000 for a casino night fundraiser/party.

UNC has a Jewish fraternity, however, they do not limit membership to just jewish people

I think NC State Christian sorority has a Jew in it. At least a classmate of mine who was a sister in the group always wore the star of david.

[IvySpice]

I think the university made the right choice. The students in this group have every right to associate with one another on any basis they choose; they just can't receive a subsidy for doing so if the group is not open to all students.

Most campus religious organizations do not find this type of rule to be any kind of hindrance. Hillel Jewish student organizations, for example, are open to all. It does not prevent them from achieving their goal of serving the Jewish community or providing a space for Jewish fellowship.

[JupiterTC]

I'm pretty disappointed that UNC is taking action like this. The Christian organizations at Elon are open to all students, regardless of whether or not they are Christians. I'm a firm believer that everyone should be accepted if they are willing to learn more about Christ. There have been several students that were "curious" about Christianity, so they check out a Christian organization and not only do they learn more about Christ, but they form new friends and fellowship.

So ironically, I believe that a Christian organization that excludes people defeats the purpose of being Christians. I hope I'm making sense to you guys

[NewBee]

I can understand why UNC is not giving them money, although it does seem like they are slightly anti-Christian. Some of you seem to hold the opinion that the fraternity is being discrimatory, but there is a biblicall reason that most Christian glo's choose to be solely Christian. Its not a club, therefore it doesn't have to be open to everyone. Besides organizations fellowship and build friendships with non-Christians, but how can anyone expect non- Christians to join an organization whose sole purpose is to glorify Christ and evangelize. Thats a violation of both the organization's and the non-Christian's 1st amendment rights.

[Kevin]

Originally posted by NewBee
I can understand why UNC is not giving them money, although it does seem like they are slightly anti-Christian. Some of you seem to hold the opinion that the fraternity is being discrimatory, but there is a biblicall reason that most Christian glo's choose to be solely Christian. Its not a club, therefore it doesn't have to be open to everyone. Besides organizations fellowship and build friendships with non-Christians, but how can anyone expect non- Christians to join an organization whose sole purpose is to glorify Christ and evangelize. Thats a violation of both the organization's and the non-Christian's 1st amendment rights.

I've read your statement several times and am not really seeing where you're making the logical connection that this group somehow stops someone from practicing their religion, or how the University is doing that, or whatever. Please explain how the non-Christian's first amendment rights are being violated??

By that same line of reasoning you can say that churches are in violation of the 1st Amendment.

Please explain the connection you're trying to make here.

[NewBee]

If a non-Christian joined a Christian fraternity or sorority, and requirements included things like mandatory bible studies, prayer sessions, evangelism, and the like, that is a violation because it forces people to participate in activities that go against their beliefs. I am not saying that AEO, or any organization, stops someone from practicing their faith, but rather if non-Christians were forced to intergrate fraternities and sororities that were solely Christian, they world have to participate in activities that wouldn't make them comfortable, and that is not right to the persons trying to affiliate. Its not fair to the Christian organizations to be forced to let non-Christians in if they beleive it goes against their faith.

Maybe we are on to different wavelengths but I dont understand how you drew that churches could be in violation of 1st amendments rights from what I said.

[PhiPsiRuss]

Originally posted by JupiterTC
I'm pretty disappointed that UNC is taking action like this. The Christian organizations at Elon are open to all students, regardless of whether or not they are Christians. I'm a firm believer that everyone should be accepted if they are willing to learn more about Christ. There have been several students that were "curious" about Christianity, so they check out a Christian organization and not only do they learn more about Christ, but they form new friends and fellowship.

So ironically, I believe that a Christian organization that excludes people defeats the purpose of being Christians. I hope I'm making sense to you guys

Elon is private. UNC is public.

Public institutions may not fund groups that exclude people based on religion. If this fraternity wanted to be Christian, but still allow others to join, then UNC, in my opinion, would be in the wrong. This is a fraternity that chooses to exclude people based on religious beliefs. This group should be allowed to exist, but it should not receive funding from a public institution.

[IheartAphi]

Can't this group exist, they just are not "recognized" as a student organization. They still could get a house (good luck in UNC, most are $$$ and off campus) and hold meetings.

I think mandatory bible study defeats the purpose of a Christian Fraternity

[Kevin]

Originally posted by NewBee
If a non-Christian joined a Christian fraternity or sorority, and requirements included things like mandatory bible studies, prayer sessions, evangelism, and the like, that is a violation because it forces people to participate in activities that go against their beliefs. I am not saying that AEO, or any organization, stops someone from practicing their faith, but rather if non-Christians were forced to intergrate fraternities and sororities that were solely Christian, they world have to participate in activities that wouldn't make them comfortable, and that is not right to the persons trying to affiliate. Its not fair to the Christian organizations to be forced to let non-Christians in if they beleive it goes against their faith.

Maybe we are on to different wavelengths but I dont understand how you drew that churches could be in violation of 1st amendments rights from what I said.

Because churches require you to participate in things like Bible studies, prayer sessions, evangalism and the like if you want to be a member -- by your line of reasoning, wouldn't that violate your 1st amendment rights?

I'm not saying that the campus has no right to do this -- as far as my understanding goes, they do. It's just your line of reasoning in my mind is a bit faulty. Their not funding groups that discriminate based on religion is not because those groups violate the 1st amendment. It's because they discriminate based on religion.


And I'm fine with it.

[Optimist Prime]

I fully support singleing out religious fanatics like that guy. No they shouldn't be let on if they discriminate on the basis of religion, that makes all frateries look bad, and if I ever saw them I would kick there ass with letters on.

[MysticCat]

Originally posted by NewBee
Thats a violation of both the organization's and the non-Christian's 1st amendment rights.

and

If a non-Christian joined a Christian fraternity or sorority, and requirements included things like mandatory bible studies, prayer sessions, evangelism, and the like, that is a violation because it forces people to participate in activities that go against their beliefs.

Nope. The Constitution only applies to government. The First Amendment only prevents the government from establishing religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.

UNC is a public school and therefore an instrumentality of the government. There might be a First Amendment problem if UNC required Bible study. If UNC made it mandatory that students join an organization that had mandatory Bible study, there could be a First Amendment problem. But there simply is no First Amendment issue if a private organization, such as a Christian GLO, allows non-Christians to join but then has mandatory Bible study, prayer meetings, etc.

[kddani]

we haven't had a first amendment discussion in awhile, it was about due