Real World 10

[BrandNubian]

Originally posted by maxx5:
DST Love...

I agree Kevin kept it real. The brotha was/is DEEP!!! And they haven't been able to find anyone like him...or they don't want to show the world positive, non-shallow(if that's a word) brothas like Kevin. Mohammed was close, but he is still not Kevin.

Two observations...
Segun is two-steps aways from being gay!

And..Malik bears a striking resemblance to Prince(the early years), remember the album cover of Prince with the big afro and the hazel/green eyes....

I'll have to agree with people and say that Kevin from New York was the bomb! He came to my school a couple of years ago, and he was still holding it down.

As for Mohammed from San Francisco, that was my guy! They never gave him much air-time and that's because he was basically drama-free! (They love to give air time to the people of color who have crazy drama!) He (Mo) was a positive black man doing his thang, and I loved that.

As far as Segun on the casting special, I didn't get any vibes that he was gay. I got the impression that yes, he was heavily into his appearance. But I know quite a few heterosexual men like that, too. Segun was just a "pretty boy." Even if you don't think he's that attractive, that's just how he carried himself. And while it is true that maybe he took it to the extreme (lotion gloves!), I can appreciate a brotha who cares about his appearance. And just because he was into his appearance, does not mean that folks should assume he's gay. I don't know, that's just me. *shrug*

I like Malik too. I am not diggin' his blow-out afro look, but he is cute. He seems like he will be one of those positive men of color with some actual substance.

I could go on and on about the Real World, but I won't.

[DST Love]

Originally posted by BrandNubian:
[B] As far as Segun on the casting special, I didn't get any vibes that he was gay. I got the impression that yes, he was heavily into his appearance. But I know quite a few heterosexual men like that, too. Segun was just a "pretty boy." Even if you don't think he's that attractive, that's just how he carried himself. And while it is true that maybe he took it to the extreme (lotion gloves!), I can appreciate a brotha who cares about his appearance. And just because he was into his appearance, does not mean that folks should assume he's gay. I don't know, that's just me. *shrug*
B]

I don't think that most people are saying Segun is gay just because he is into his appearance. During the Truth or Dare, they asked him had he ever fantasized about other men. He very quickly said that he had and all men had. He was also saying that he's sure whenever most men are with their gay friends in a gay bar, they wonder about the other side. All of the men at the casting special were yelling NO, not me. The women were in shock. Now whether men are lying or not, I know of no straight men that would admit to thinking about other men. I also don't know of any straight men who knowingly have gay friends or that have been in a gay bar. And if they have, they wouldn't admit it if they are really straight. I don't care whether or not he's gay (although I believe he is but unwilling to acknowledge it just yet) but I think that's probably why people think he's gay.

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#10 Sigma (Clark Atlanta University) Spring 1999
Currently: MAL, Southern Region

[BrandNubian]

Originally posted by Sugar_N_Spice:
I'm glad that they didn't pick him b/c I didn't like his attitude. People would think that's how black men really are...which is not true...But, since you know him, ask him Why was he crying b/c he didn't get picked? Why were some of the other folks crying too? I'm sorry, but it's not the end of the world--you'd then these people were given a death sentence or something...And why is he SO feminine? I know some guys who are slightly feminine as a result of being raised by all women...but he slept with gloves on!! Come on, now!!

I liked Coral; Ellen got on my last nerve...Coral handled it well (I think). My Mom really wants me to try out for the show, but I might not have been able to handle that situation in the same civil way...(she would have been "checked" severely)...She told Coral to "kiss my baby a$$"...I DON'T THINK SO!!

Sophia and Jisela (who says she's not gay or bi) kissing...once again: Come on, now!! I don't know about that one...Whateva floats your boat...And that guy Angel: he has some REAL issues (he seemed REAL anti-gay to me--and that's NOT cool!! )...

"I don't know, you be the judge..."--Hits from the Street

First up, Angel was an ass. He was homophobic and just his whole vibe was just...wrong. His homophobia automatically put me off. I was glad he didn't get picked. (I'm pretty sure he didn't get picked. Right?)

Secondly, I thought that the way folks cried was a bit interesting too. I mean, it's only The Real World after all. It did raise my eyebrow to see them (especially Segun) base their whole sense of self-worth upon acceptance into the Real World or not. But, to be fair, if that was something that they were really shooting for, then who am I to say that they shouldn't cry when they got rejected? Who knows? If I wanted it, and didn't get it, I might cry too. *shrug*

Ok, third (and I'm going back to Segun) - if he had been picked, the show would have been interesting no doubt. But I personally (and I would hope nobody else would either) wouldn't have looked at him on the show, and thought "Oh, this is how black men are." Apparently, some black men are like Segun. And that's fine. Some black men are like Kevin from New York, Mohammed from San Fran, like David from New Orleans, and like the other David from Los Angeles. I'm glad that they don't pick black men who are all cut from the same mold. Because, in reality, black men aren't all the same. I know some people were looking at Segun like "Oh my God, he is so feminine," or "What's up with those gloves?" or "What's up with him crying?" I know he may annoy and bother some people. But just because he behaves like a pretty boy doesn't make him any worse than some of the other black men who have also acted crazy on The Real World. (And we know that they have. )

Just my .25.

[SweetestDiva]

Originally posted by BrandNubian:
First up, Angel was an ass. He was homophobic and just his whole vibe was just...wrong. His homophobia automatically put me off. I was glad he didn't get picked. (I'm pretty sure he didn't get picked. Right?)

Why is everybody accusing Angel of being homophobic?? He said in an interview that his sister is a lesbian who recently came out, and that he now has conflicting opinions about homosexuality. I think there's a difference between that issue and being homophobic.

Also, if I had been smooching some guy and then turned around to see him tonguing some other dude "to make him feel like he belonged", I would have to stop for a second too.



[This message has been edited by SweetestDiva (edited July 02, 2001).]

[BrandNubian]

Originally posted by DST Love:
I don't think that most people are saying Segun is gay just because he is into his appearance. During the Truth or Dare, they asked him had he ever fantasized about other men. He very quickly said that he had and all men had. He was also saying that he's sure whenever most men are with their gay friends in a gay bar, they wonder about the other side. All of the men at the casting special were yelling NO, not me. The women were in shock. Now whether men are lying or not, I know of no straight men that would admit to thinking about other men. I also don't know of any straight men who knowingly have gay friends or that have been in a gay bar. And if they have, they wouldn't admit it if they are really straight. I don't care whether or not he's gay (although I believe he is but unwilling to acknowledge it just yet) but I think that's probably why people think he's gay.

Dang, I was just thinking about that whole Truth or Dare thing! I thought that he had said that he didn't fantasize about being taken or whatever, but he did wonder from time to time what it would be like.

Frankly, I think there are more heterosexual men that wonder from time to time than they, of course, will admit. And for those that were yelling "NO!" and flipping out, well..methinks doth protest too much. When people protest too much, that usually leads me to think that they are hiding something about their own sexuality/sexual orientation or that they are not secure in their sexuality.

I'm not saying that all heterosexual men fantasize about other men or even wonder on an intellectual level. (So don't anybody get into a tizzy. *lol*) But I think that more men do than they let on. When I saw the casting special and his Truth or Dare response, I actually said, "OK, this brotha really took it there." *chuckle* I thought that he could be gay, or it could be just that he his secure in his sexuality (heterosexuality) to have gay friends, go to a gay club, to admit that it has crossed his mind and not feel threatened.

I don't know. I could see how folks would think he was gay based on that Truth or Dare thing. But I just didn't think he was gay. *shrug* I think I'm alone in that though. *lol*

Alright, I think I'm done talking about Segun now.

[novella000]

poor Segun... ech!

ANYwayz, I wasn't feelin' Coral, she seemed a bit on the instigator side.
Jisela was cool
I liked Ellen, although she was a bit insecure...
The I've-Never-Seen-A-Penis-Chick was sweet
Malik -- tiiight. Maybe we'll see some good black male blood on the show again!
Nicole (ghetto Fab) was cool and seemed very sweet and genuine...
I don't remember the other folks, so I will stop here.

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"Success usually comes to those who are too busy to be looking for it."
Henry David Thoreau

[KnowledgeEternal]

I was flipping through the channels and I saw that dude crying. I was like WTH is this? This big @$$ dude sitting down crying like a little girl? I thought THAT was kind of suspect and I didn't even know about the "gloves" and the "Truth or Dare".

[DreamfulOne]

Originally posted by SweetestDiva:

I think Malik and Nicole will hook up. Maybe Coral can convince him to cornrow his hair... I'm thinking he will be HELLA sexy with his hair braided. Did y'all check those eyes???

Jisela is straight trippin. She tongued Sophia down to help her feel like she belonged?? What. Ever.

I think it'll be an interesting season. I'm especially interested to see how Coral and Nicole get along, because they both seem to have strong, no-nonsense personalities.

I saw this yesterday and will definitely be tuning in (or recording) this season. Nicole seems sweeter than Coral ~ but they are representing for the most part. I couldn't believe Coral didn't do or say something to that Chinese chick though! She was very arrogant and shallow.

I don't know what to say about Jisella & Sophia ~ that was just TRIF!

Malik does need to braid that hair ~ it isn't appealing to have it out! He would be much cuter w/ it braided.

What did everyone think about the guy w/ cancer? Do you think he made it because of that? or because he genuinely makes a good cast member? I was surprised Rachel (the promiscious virgin )didn't make it. I liked her.

[maxx5]

I just had to say one more thing about Segun...
And please don't take this the wrong way. I am only stating my opinion.

In my opinion, Segun did not make it because he has nothing to offer and no talent unless you consider looking in the mirror talent!!

I think?? all the other men of color on Real World had at least one thing to offer...music,poetry,comedy, writing...well, maybe Cyrus didn't..but at least he was athletic!!

Segun came across as very shallow, uninteresting and small(minded). Personally, I would like for a black man that has something positive to do or say representing my people, rather than the Segun's of the world. I think that "white america" stereotypes us enough. And although Segun's do exist(we all know at least one)...I don't want the world to think that we are all like that. David, from RW-Nawlins' had the tendency to be shallow at times...but I can overlook some of his arrogance and ignorance. People that are somewhat "artsy" are sometimes on a different level than those of us that do not possess "artistic talents"

Again, this is just my opinion. I could talk about Real World all day...well, maybe not all day, but for a while

[BrandNubian]

Originally posted by maxx5:
I just had to say one more thing about Segun...
And please don't take this the wrong way. I am only stating my opinion.

In my opinion, Segun did not make it because he has nothing to offer and no talent unless you consider looking in the mirror talent!!

I think?? all the other men of color on Real World had at least one thing to offer...music,poetry,comedy, writing...well, maybe Cyrus didn't..but at least he was athletic!!

Segun came across as very shallow, uninteresting and small(minded). Personally, I would like for a black man that has something positive to do or say representing my people, rather than the Segun's of the world. I think that "white america" stereotypes us enough. And although Segun's do exist(we all know at least one)...I don't want the world to think that we are all like that. David, from RW-Nawlins' had the tendency to be shallow at times...but I can overlook some of his arrogance and ignorance. People that are somewhat "artsy" are sometimes on a different level than those of us that do not possess "artistic talents"

Again, this is just my opinion. I could talk about Real World all day...well, maybe not all day, but for a while

I swear, I keep coming back to Segun, but folks are just doing him wrong. *lol* First of all, I can't even agree with the small-minded comment. What about Angel? What about the guy from North Dakota who had a real "problem" with dressing in drag (dang, man, it was just in fun!)? What about the guy (I think his name was Mike and I think he was the one with the video camera and I think he got picked) who talked with Coral about his views on race and homosexuality?

I could say that all three of those people were close-minded. Segun actually seemed pretty open.

I would love it if all the black men on the Real World (and Road Rules, for that matter) were all positive and if all their behavior was positive. But everybody is not a Kevin or a Mohammed, and that's just real. Personally, I too, thought that David from New Orleans was more than a little arrogant. I wouldn't want anyone to think that all black men were like him, either. When you say that you don't want everybody to think all black men are like Segun, what is it about him that you don't want people to see? (Just curious, seriously.)

Segun wasn't un-positive, he was just him. *shrug*

Hmmm...not trying to be funny here, but what does Malik have to offer? I mean, he got picked and he didn't exhibit any "creative" talent as far as I remember, he was just a guy. I like him, this is true, but he was just chillin'. What will be his claim to fame? The fact that he can blow out his hair in a really special way? *lol* He seems really positive, but you never know. Segun, if he had been picked, might have turned out to be one of the most positive cast members. *shrug*

Just a few more thoughts.

[Sugar_N_Spice]

Originally posted by BrandNubian:
Ok, third (and I'm going back to Segun) - if he had been picked, the show would have been interesting no doubt. But I personally (and I would hope nobody else would either) wouldn't have looked at him on the show, and thought "Oh, this is how black men are." Apparently, some black men are like Segun. And that's fine. Some black men are like Kevin from New York, Mohammed from San Fran, like David from New Orleans, and like the other David from Los Angeles. I'm glad that they don't pick black men who are all cut from the same mold. Because, in reality, black men aren't all the same. I know some people were looking at Segun like "Oh my God, he is so feminine," or "What's up with those gloves?" or "What's up with him crying?" I know he may annoy and bother some people. But just because he behaves like a pretty boy doesn't make him any worse than some of the other black men who have also acted crazy on The Real World. (And we know that they have. )

Just my .25.

What I meant was that b/c we live in the United States, some people in white America will no doubt streotype black men (or gay black men, or even gay men in general b/c, as Snoop says "Please Believe It", Segun (I think, But I know that I don't know him but even SweetestDiva said he is very feminine--not saying all feminine men are gay or vice-versa but, COME ON NOW!! ) is a closet homosexual if I've ever seen one--and I have...)...But, anyway, I was saying that I wouldn't want people making ignorant, negative stereotypes. Would you want them to put a black gang-banger or drug-dealer on the show??? I did not want Segun on the show not b/c he may be gay but b/c I did not like his attitude and seemed arogant, shallow (like when he was talking about how he values "Hoes"...WHATEVA!!), and immature. I value diversity just as much as the next person, but we have to draw the line somewhere. Don't get it twisted (cuz I don't) , I know there are MANY shallow, immature (like David acted sometimes on RW New Orleans...he got on my nerves sometimes), and ignorant black men in America, but I'd rather not see stereotypes perpetuated on tv.



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"If there is no struggle, there is no progress"--Frederick Douglass

[maxx5]

BrandNubian,

I appreciate your comments, and it does make me think.

I too, appreciate diversity. You are right, not everyone can be like Kevin or Mohammed. I guess Segun bothered me because he had a little "Beyonce" in him. You know the type, "look at me, look how pretty I am, I am so great"...kind of attitude. But at least Beyonce can sing. Maybe I missed Segun's talent.
Malik on the other hand, is a budding musician. For show and tell he brought a copy of his new CD. So he does have some talent, although we have not heard him play or sing, yet.
Angel and the other guys, yeah they were shallow and small-minded, but they weren't black..so I don't really care how they come across to the general population. Tv has a habit of perpetuating stereotypes and it is nice when you see people that show us in a positive light. For example, Nicole is from "the hood" as she puts it, but she demonstrated that just because you are from the hood, doesnt mean you don't know how to act.
I agree with you, David from N'awlins made me mad as H*@l a lot of times. Especially on his quest to bed all of N'awlins and by trying to prove that he was "the man" and other antics. I thought that David was downright RUDE and self-centered, but as I said before...artsy people are on a different level. That is not excusing him, but I understand it a little better. In the end, David learned that it is not all about him.

Maybe I am a little to hard on Segun...when the special comes on again, I will watch it to see what I missed.

[lastpoetnsite]

much respect...*this is gonna be long*

it seems that there have been quite a few contradictory issues about whether Segun should or should not have been selected for the Real World Ten. what i have read is that initially...people looked at him as feminine because of some lotion gloves. Which seemed to make individuals feel uneasy about him "representing". Then oh no it wasn't just that...i mean the brotha cried...and then he was actually real about a taboo subject in the black community---homosexuality.

And its because of the combination of his: obsession with beauty (i.e. lotion gloves), his crying, and his honesty about homosexuality that he is not a good representative on the real world.

Well folx, first of all if white people were going to stereotype black men they already had 7 individuals by which to make that assumption. And Segun has already made his presence known on television...so...if he was gonna be a "stereotype" then he could reasonably already be one.

also lets look at the 7 individuals:
-kevin (new york): when the filming of the first show took place he was arguably the stereotypical black man. while he was educated he had a short fuse and was accused of violence against a poor defenseless white girl (julie) (see episode 111). so he was already what supposedly white america believed about black men. angry, violent, bitter.
-david (los angeles): accused in episode 207 (by a white girl) of trying to rape tami (a black woman) and also prior to this we see david in episode 204 attempting to strangle jon (the pure white christian man) because he is angry. he gets kicked off. again america is shown black men are: angry, violent, bitter.
-mohammed (san francisco): he was the first black man who actually was just chillin. notice that he was also not completely seen until he was in episode 316 breaking up with his long time girlfriend, Stephanie and then going off with another girl...and then crying and getting back with her...or at least trying to patch up the damage. he was just too "normal" so of course there is very little seen about him.
-syrus (boston): this is the first sign of the black man in his other stereotype...the black man as player, pimp, hustler...who always wants to get in bed with a white woman. syrus screwed several white women during the show. and most of his drama was revolving around women.
-stephen (seattle): a return to the bitter, angry, violent black man...whose home life was so dysfuctional that he doesn’t know his ass from a hole in the ground. what is he known for? for smacking a white girl for...*gasp* questioning his sexuality! *methinks doth protest too much* if anyone had gay vibes it was him!
-tech (hawaii) he was a mans man right? interesting...he is a return to the black man as pimp, player, hustler. he slept with so many women on the island that he and ruthie shared a conquest! (episode 817).
-david(new orleans): this is mtv’s favorite representation black man as: player, pimp, hustler. he embodied not only stereotypical black man but men in general. he reveals that after getting dumped by a female he pumped up and vowed not to love again. so he becomes emotionally unavailable. *he’s a mans man right?* in addition, he fine tuned the art of dating every woman outside of your race imaginable except in one episode where they showed him sexin a black woman. (which if you want to say theres some stereotyping you could say that the black woman who sleeps with david after a couple of hours of knowing him is similar to the one that white america had of black women. (peep: urbanentertainment.com for the documentary on the sexualization of black women).

so ladies lets just be honest. the reason why Segun would not be a good "representative" is because of what those of you with latent gay-dars call his homosexual tendencies. although it does make me laugh that these so-called tendencies are in some ways less than bad and more good. he was emotional, he cared about his appearance, and he was honest and confortable in his sexuality. dag if he is gay then what does that say about str8 men? oh and by the way...everyone’s guy, angel, if you watch the show closely he does his share of crying too. and being rude to jisela. he was quite frankly and asshole.

i think that we need to start getting real and lets face our internalized homophobia.
btw...most of the people on the show do not have talent! unless being whiney bellyaching generation x'ers is a talent. i have seen few people on there actually go on to be successful with their talent. the only one that really comes to mind is Kevin. he is an accomplished writer and journalist....and probably would be without the real world.

peace

[Ideal08]

Originally posted by showstopper_1908:
Personally, I am happy to see more than 1 black person chosen. They have to add one (token) for good measure. I think us complaining about lightskin vs. darkskin is just pointless. Someone mentioned that it is always us (black people) who make it an issue. I don't think Asians worry about if they picked a tan Asian, a pale Asian, an Asian with long hair, etc. They are just happy they put one on the show this go round! I know I am happy to see folks of color, any shade. I wasn't upset that Heather B. on the first show was dark skined and kinda big (unlike myself), she was their representation of black women and I was happy that they decided to include one of us.

Soror, while I agree that we should be happy to be represented regardless, I don't agree that it is "always us" who make it an issue. I guess Asians wouldn't care. Why should they? Last time I checked, there was no such thing as a House Oriental and a Field Oriental, based on their skin complexion. We are STILL dealing with the repercussions (sp?) of this. The fact of the matter remains that there is STILL a color divide within our race, and it is perpetrated in the media. Now whether we want to admit that or not is another story. Jasmine Guy even touched on it in her IP. It's easier to say that it shouldn't make a difference or that it doesn't bother you when you are on the other side. When you grow up dark-skinned and you get teased for it, it's a different story. When you STILL (in 2001) hear ig'nant people say ish like, "You're pretty to be dark-skinned," it's a different story. Maybe that's why some people still pay attention to HOW we are represented on TV.

[maxx5]

lastpoetnsite,
No disrespect intended with this post...

I agree with most of what you said, however I disagree on the talent issue. Being talented does not neccessarily mean that you can sing, dance or write. I think that there are several talented cast members on Real World, AND there are several who are not.

I think we are giving Segun too much credit. I should not have attacked him by saying he is gay...because that really does not matter to me. I had a problem with the superficial way the he represented himself. As if that is all he has to offer...But then of course, it is my problem with him, and not anyone else's.

You are right, MTV tends to pigeonhole all of their cast members into certain roles. As I watched the casting special, I could pretty much guess who was going to be picked. I think Segun rubbed me the wrong way because I thought he gave MTV another chance to show to the world this stereotypical black man, instead of showing positive brothers, like Kevin. Kevin said on the casting special that at the time they were filming, the Rodney King incident just had taken place. I wonder...did that affect his temper at that time?