PRE-NUPTIAL AGREEMENTS...YAY OR NAY?

[AKA2D '91]

I don't know? Just asking questions here, to get some commentary, that's all.

I haven't ever done it, so I wouldn't know.

[Eclipse]

Definately not. I went into my marriage taking the "til death do us part" very seriously and while there have been moments when I contemplated murder to get to that point , I did not and would not want a pre nup.

[1 Woman of Virtue]

IMHO, it just seems like a pre nup makes marriage a legal/sanctified shack-up situation. I mean, why take the vow if you have a "just in case clause"? If I were in that position w/ my man, and I still felt like I needed a "just in case" I'd take that as a sign that I wasn't ready for marriage.

[DPiece7]

I definitely wouldn't. I think it says something about your trust in that person if you want to sign a pre-nup. If you think that person might try and stick you for your things if you're ever to get divorced, then that's a problem. And if you're supposed to be together for better or for worse, till death do you part, then why do you need a pre-nup if there won't ever be a divorce? I think too many times people speak these things into their marriages and that's why so many people end up divorced because they expect to be. Also, like Mocha said, being that I don't have anything anyway, I wouldn't do it.

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I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me. Philippians 4:13

[Chi_ZETABBW]

Originally posted by AKA2D '91:
what I was talking about was securing what you obtained PRIOR to saying those magical words...

I would want THAT protected first. Now, after I am married (whenever), that should be split down the middle, IMHO. Because we have acquired that TOGETHER.
Sisterfriend:
Please don't let that discourage you from buying a home. My home is the best investment I ever made. The one purchase in life I'm truly proud of. Doesn't even compare to cars, furs, diamonds, LOL! I bought my home at 31, been in it 5 years now. I bought it right after my divorce.
Sisterfriend it's hard being head of household, but God has made a way, and I've been able to keep it, and keep it maintained.
I'll hopefully never have to go back to renting. It's so many things you can do with the home once you marry, including staying in it, buying a bigger home, renting it out, etc. If you have the money go for it.
See, Chi...that's why I don't want to purchase a home, so I won't have to go through that ya ya there. Many have said that I can "rent" that home out and move somewhere else. I wouldn't want that hassle. Then, if I rent, that would be MY income, cause my name would be on the "papers", right?

[ClassyLady]

NEVER, in thousands of lifetimes, would I ever sign a prenuptial agreement. When I marry a man, I will be married to him until the day that the good Lord calls me home. Why would I stand in front of a preacher, my family, and, more importantly, the Lord, and say that I will be with this man for the rest of my life knowing that I already have a "backup" plan?

Everybody is talking about the percent of marriages that fail in today's society. Marriages fail so often because people take the commitment of marriage to lightly. People meet on Monday get married on Wednesday. And when they find out they made a mistake they'll end up on Divorce Court by Friday. If people took the time to think about what they're getting into and listened to their hearts when they had reservations, then marriages wouldn't fail so often.

[Rain Man]

As far as pre-nups, I am against them.

How can you say to your soul-mate, "I love you" when you are hedging your bets? IMHO a pre-nup trivializes the very reason why a couple is getting married in the first place and reduces love to a feeling when it is actually a doing.

Pre-nups also:
1. Assumes the worst in a marriage.
2. Places a spirit of distrust in a couple (Oh, s(he) may try to take all that I own, so I gotta sign an agreement so that s(he) doesn't steal the shirt off my back).

On the other hand, if a couples's concept love and marriage is reserved for a season only, then a pre-nup may be the best thing for them.

Just my $.25

RM

[sphinxpoet]

NOPE.....but if I was a millionare I would because how do you know if someone is marrying you for your money or love?



Sphinxpoet

[AKA2D '91]

The Basics
Say 'I do' with a contingency plan in hand

No, a prenuptial agreement about what happens if it doesn't work out isn’t particularly romantic. Yes, it’s a good idea, especially if you’ve been married before.

By Terry Savage


They say that getting married for the second -- or third -- time is a triumph of hope over experience. But because nearly half of all marriages end in divorce, it makes sense to plan ahead the second time around. And even first marriages might benefit from a solid prenuptial discussion of how finances will be handled to make the marriage work -- or in case it doesn’t work!

The key ingredient in that planning process is likely to be a prenuptial agreement. Writing one may not sound very romantic, but it is very smart. The best and most sensible agreements are completed when both parties are very much in love, not when they’re considering divorce. If you’re anticipating getting married -- or know someone who is -- why not send them the link to this article? It will certainly start a discussion!See the numbers
that lenders see.


Prenuptial agreements aren’t just for the wealthy. Forget the stereotype of the wealthy, older man marrying a much younger wife. Even young couples who have already embarked on careers could benefit from a legal agreement about the financial consequences of divorce. Certainly, those embarking on a second or third marriage will want to provide for their children from previous marriages, as well as keeping premarital property separate.

Keys to an agreement
Prenuptials aren’t limited to financial issues, although finances generally are the critical issue. You could make a prenuptial agreement about almost any area of potential conflict -- during the marriage and in case the marriage fails. It’s important to distinguish between a simple, personal agreement of how you’re planning to handle money matters and other important issues (such as work and child-care priorities) and a true prenuptial agreement. The prenuptial is a written, legal and binding document.

There are two key ingredients to a valid, legal prenuptial agreement:
Both parties must be represented by separate and independent legal counsel.

Both parties must fully disclose all of their financial assets and liabilities. Failure to do so will almost always void an agreement.
Once again, throw out the stereotype of the dominating male forcing the young bride to sign on the dotted line just minutes before the ceremony. Not only might that be considered coercion, and thus invalidate the agreement, but these days prenuptials are arrived at through joint discussions handled by attorneys (and, sometimes, accountants if there’s enough money involved) well in advance of any marriage ceremony. And your input is vital, so you need to discuss these issues with the person you’re about to marry.

The purpose of a prenuptial agreement is to supersede, where possible, state laws that apply to dissolutions of marital property. And in states where judges are given broad discretion over division of property and future support, a valid prenuptial agreement limits a judge’s ability to dictate property settlement terms. So you do need an attorney trained in matrimonial law because state laws vary, and because your estate plans will also have to be coordinated with your prenuptial agreement.

Issues to address
Here are a few financial issues to consider dealing with in your prenuptial agreement, depending on your circumstances and state of residence.

Premarital assets. If you agree that any assets owned before marriage will be kept separate, you might want to set up separate, revocable living trusts and transfer title to the assets into the name of your trust.

Marital assets. You’ll have to decide how to deal with assets acquired by joint purchase during your marriage and any assets and earnings you acquire separately during your marriage. In many states, but not all, wealth accumulated after marriage will become community property, or at least marital property. You may want to discuss how to divide marital property in the event of a divorce, or make an advance agreement on ownership of assets acquired during the marriage. (True community property states that assume property acquired after the marriage is equally owned by both spouses are Arizona, California, Idaho, Louisiana, Nevada, New Mexico, Washington, Texas and Wisconsin, as well as the territory of Puerto Rico.)

Retirement assets. Although retirement plans are considered separate property, in many states a non-working spouse is entitled to a share of the working spouse’s retirement assets. You’ll definitely want to see how the law applies in your situation.

Inheritances. If inherited property is kept separate from marital property, most courts do not consider it part of the marital estate in case of a divorce. But if you take a portion of your inheritance and use it for a down payment on a house owned jointly, you’ll convert this portion of your inheritance into marital property. In any case, if you’re expecting to inherit money, your prenuptial should spell out your intentions to keep the assets separate.

Financial lifestyle and support. Your prenuptial can outline your intentions for contributing to the financial lifestyle of the marriage, during the marriage. For example, non-financial contributions such as child-rearing should be taken into consideration. One spouse may limit career prospects to build the family lifestyle. Courts take these contributions into consideration, and so should your prenuptial agreement.

Obviously, circumstances may change during your marriage, and a good marriage will be flexible. But a bad marriage will break -- and that’s why most prenuptials outline a support agreement between the spouses in case of divorce. For example, each spouse may agree to limit ongoing support to three or four years. Or they could agree not to seek support from each other at all, in exchange for an even division of marital property.

If you expect -- or simply want -- to have children, your agreement may contain not only references to child support, education and other expenses, but may extend to social issues such as religious upbringing and type of schools. And in cases of second marriages with children, the agreement should take into account the child-support arrangements from the previous divorce.

Terms. Many prenuptial agreements for support and property division in the event of divorce include a scaled agreement. That is, if the marriage lasts only one or two years, the couple could agree to no support. If a marriage lasts for a longer period, then either larger support or a lump-sum payment could be agreed upon. Or the agreement might “vest” like a pension plan -- with a portion of the payout dependent on the longevity of the marriage. And the couple may agree to review the terms of their prenuptial at a certain date in the future, or the agreement may “sunset” after a specific number of years.

Life insurance. Financial circumstances can change during the course of a marriage. Many prenuptials call for both parties to maintain life insurance -- with each spouse owning the policy on the other’s life. This won’t pay off in the case of a divorce, but as long as each has an “insurable interest” in the other’s future, the owner can continue paying premiums and maintain the coverage.

Estate plans. Prenuptials cover not only financial considerations in case of a divorce, but agreement on what happens if either of the couple dies. So the provisions of a prenuptial must be incorporated into each spouse’s estate plan. For example, as part of a prenuptial, the spouse might receive lifetime use of a residence, which will then become an asset of a child from the previous marriage. Although different attorneys may draw the estate plans, they’ll rely on the prenuptial to outline certain terms. And then each spouse’s attorney should review the separate estate plans for compliance.

A final reminder: If you’re thinking that a prenuptial agreement is about to take all the romance out of your marriage plans, think again. You’re about to spend a lot of time and money making arrangements for the ceremony, the party, the flowers and wedding dress. Those aren’t very romantic subjects, either -- but they’ve become part of the “tradition” of having a wedding. Now, it’s time to start your own new tradition of planning for a financially successful marriage through a mutual prenuptial agreement that demonstrates your love, commitment -- and practicality.

[mela3]

I would never request or sign a prenuptial agreement. I wouldn't feel right promising my soul to someone when I had a contingency plan in mind. People speak about how dirty a divorce can get and how it is a safety net, but in my opinion you don't truly know a person unless you know how dirty they can be. Everyone acts differently, under stress or when they are angry. That is a part of their character that you should know if your going to allow their soul to unite with yours. But that's just my opinion

[MsAKAdemics]

Originally posted by mela3
I would never request or sign a prenuptial agreement. I wouldn't feel right promising my soul to someone when I had a contingency plan in mind. People speak about how dirty a divorce can get and how it is a safety net, but in my opinion you don't truly know a person unless you know how dirty they can be. Everyone acts differently, under stress or when they are angry. That is a part of their character that you should know if your going to allow their soul to unite with yours. But that's just my opinion

I have read several different opinions on this board and I respect all of them.

Personally,

I would not get married without a prenup.... First of all, sometimes people think they know the other person but people change for various reasons. It does not matter how how long you have dated. People change................

I know I am not the same person I was even 2 years ago. People grow apart and you NEVER know what someone else will do.....

I hope and pray my house never burns down but if it does I have fire insurance........ health insurance, money saved, etc..... You hope you never need it but just in case.

There are several reasons why the divorce rate is so high... Money being the #1 reason.......... It is at the top of the list. That should tell you something right there.

Many will disagree but I ALWAYS plan ahead for better or for worse.

I don't want money I have not worked for! It should not be a problem.......... Anyway I plan to have a lot of money and I will not be sharing it will anyone I am not married to just because we use to be married.

AW He*llllll NAW!

[markmywords]

no prenups here. if somehow i acquire anything of value it will be by the grace of God. thus, if i lose it all he can bless me again at his will.

[NOWorNEVER]

Hmmm. I don't think I'd be able to sign a pre-nup. To me, it indicates that you don't trust your partner. And if I don't trust my man or am having doubting questions in my mind, I won't marry.

[pointNclick]

but I don't think I would have a pre-nup nor would I sign one.

It just doesn't feel right to me. If he asked me to sign one, I would have to reconsider my life with him.

[Sahara]

For those of you who are against prenups (myself included), how would you handle it if your significant other asked you to sign one?

For those of you who are for them, how would you go about asking the one you want to marry to sign one?

Everyone's point of view on this is very interesting. It's a very sticky situation when you have to deal with life long committments and contingency plans. Things could easly go wrong. Is it worth breaking up over?