Are you worried about our society?

[Kevin]

There's a concept often discussed when studying mass media related topics. It's called agenda setting.

Basically it holds that the mass media does not determine what you think about an issue but it does determine what issues you think about.

Just as a producer on the producer decides what reporters will cover what on a given day they are essentially deciding what people will see as contraversial.

And again, I'll gaurantee you that this wouldn't even be an issue if there was no video of the event.

[White_Chocolate]

don't worry
people used to believe
that our generation would never see a war
but it happened
and it's not over
we're going to reap the just rewards
our society has spoiled us to the point
that some guys can't even change a tire
or change spark plugs in a car
or will even get their hands dirty
they just call AAA

i believe we will experience hardship one day
what am i talking about?
more than half of this nation's college graduates
will not have a job after they get their diplomas
we're already there

[texas*princess]

Originally posted by KillarneyRose
This is a little bit off topic, but I see the parents of the kids in my daughters' school and they really seem to have the attitude that their little ones can do no wrong. If there is a problem, it is the fault of the teacher or a classmate, but NEVER their kid.

I definately agree with this!!! Before my friend graduated, she had to do student teaching in the nearby schools. It was all going well until the mother of a young girl came to pick up her daughter one afternoon after her daughter had got in trouble several times that week and was sent to the principal's office.

The lady completely b****ed out my friend who was not even the real teacher of the class and was so mean to her. She said things like "What's wrong this time?! Is my daughter so unbearable you had to send her to the principal's office?!"

Yikes!

[ZTAMiami]

Ok, I'll give my opinion as the point of view of an expectant mother.

I think children nowadays have a lack of empathy overall. I think that our society is full of selfish, detached children who crave nothing but instant gratification. This is the fault of the parents and society as a whole. When parents are constantly covering for their kids and defending their worst behavior, the only lesson taught is that there is always a way out of everything. I don't think "beating their azz" would help. It just makes kids mistrust their parent. They'll just hide whatever they got beat for and do a better job of it next time. Parents don't seem to talk to their children anymore. Life lessons, morality, right and wrong can't be learned from tv or school. They have to be taught at home as well. I don't think just making sure your kids are fed, dressed and in school is enought parenting, and that is how most kids are being raised.

Do I make sense?

[33girl]

Along the lines of DeltAlum's post, there's a very good essay by Andy Rooney in his first book (A Few Minutes w/ Andy Rooney) called "Youth." I looked for it online but couldn't find it. He quotes President Eisenhower saying the youth was getting lazy & soft, and counters that by saying that when little Ike was planting corn someone was probably saying kids wouldn't work anymore. One of his points is that "elders" like to say kids suck, just because they are jealous of the fact that they are young and have their lives ahead of them. (he put it more eloquently, needless to say) The last line is "it's amazing how long this world has been going to hell without ever having gotten there."

Believe me, all the bad things in the world - rape, incest, fraud, violence - are not new. They've been going on forever. It's just that now instead of having a messenger take a month to go to another village to tell it, it's on the news in 5 seconds.

I will say when I hear about kids having to have "play dates" every time they want to see a friend and regimented schedules from the age of 2, it makes me sad. When I wanted to play with my friends, I called them or just went to their house. If I wanted a day to do nothing more productive than put curlers and bows on my dog, that was fine too. I feel like kids are losing out on being kids, for the convenience of the parents.

[DeltAlum]

It's pretty easy to put all parents in a line and paint them with the same brush -- but it's not that simple.

In the specific case of the Northbrook hazing incident, I'll bet that out of the 14 sets of parents involved, that some of them are pretty good parents, who are shocked at what happened and not doing their very best to pretend that their offspring are perfect.

Believe me, I've been there.

What probably happened there is that two or three people got out of control, and the rest just followed along. Riots happen that way.

Heading off in a different direction, now, regarding the input we receive from media in particular:

What is of some concern to me in my "advancing state of maturity," (OK, read that middle-age), is that many of the "gatekeepers" of what actually is covered by newspapers and broadcasters is decided by very young people. Most of the Assignment Desk people, even in fairly major markets are what we old folks call 20/20's. That is to say that they're 20 something years old, make $20 thousand a year and believe they know everything there is to know about everything.

Please don't misunderstand. They are bright people -- but they haven't been active in society long enough to have gained the experience they should have to make these decisions. But what, to me, should be considered one of the most important rungs on the news ladder is one of the lowest paid, and thus, becomes entry level.

I heard on NPR just this morning that some group (I really don't care who or how) did some kind of big survey/study on "when you become and adult." This had to do with when you were probably married, having a family and being forced to become financially independent -- in other words, be out on your own.

The answer surprized me. It was 26 years old.

IF that's true, why do we have "children" (is that what you are if you're not an adult?) making these kinds of decisions?

[midwesterngirl]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ZTAMiami
.

I think children nowadays have a lack of empathy overall. I think that our society is full of selfish, detached children who crave nothing but instant gratification.



That is it in a nutshell.The children don't care because their parents don't care.The parents are way too busy with their own lives.
I am a Daycare/Preschool Director and would guess that approximately 70% of the children we care for are there 10 hours a day or more/5 days a week.My staff and I know,that if it weren't for us,many of these children would have nobody to care for them.We know that for many we are the only nutritious meal they get.You can tell without a doubt,who is and is not their parents priority.

[White_Chocolate]

ZTAMIAMI:

Do you think that parents should use less 'time outs' and start to view 'disciplinary actions' such as a swat on the behind with their hand?

My mom didn't do the timeout thing with me and my sister. I got whippings and I turned out fine. My little brother, on the other hand, was a 'time out' child who grew a foot and a half taller than my mom by the time he was 15. She couldn't whip him so she would 'take away phone privileges' or 'make him do house chores'. He's worse than me and my sister combined(he was partying by the time he was 16--basketball stardom does that to you). However, when I asked my mom why she never hit him but always got onto us. . .she said that 'disciplinary actions' are looked down upon.

I think that timeout can work in the instance of not sharing toys, not eatting all of your dinner, etc.
However, there are times when a kid needs a couple of swats(not a beat down as some say).

editted to add:
How do you plan on dealing with discipline?

[starang21]

Originally posted by White_Chocolate
ZTAMIAMI:

Do you think that parents should use less 'time outs' and start to view 'disciplinary actions' such as a swat on the behind with their hand?

My mom didn't do the timeout thing with me and my sister. I got whippings and I turned out fine. My little brother, on the other hand, was a 'time out' child who grew a foot and a half taller than my mom by the time he was 15. She couldn't whip him so she would 'take away phone privileges' or 'make him do house chores'. He's worse than me and my sister combined(he was partying by the time he was 16--basketball stardom does that to you). However, when I asked my mom why she never hit him but always got onto us. . .she said that 'disciplinary actions' are looked down upon.

I think that timeout can work in the instance of not sharing toys, not eatting all of your dinner, etc.
However, there are times when a kid needs a couple of swats(not a beat down as some say).

editted to add:
How do you plan on dealing with discipline?

that's what i'm saying. there's a line between discipline and abuse. i got my tail beat when acted up, and i'm a better man for it. i understand discipline, my ex nor her big brother got any kind of whoopin', they got the time out. come on now, for real. and this family comes from a family just affulent as those from GBN, and now they're spoiled and have no sense of discipline. you can talk all you want about teaching your kids right, blah blah blah. are you seriously going to say that they're going to take all of your lessons they way you want them to? no....they're going to act out of line, and once it gets too drastic...they need to know that there are consequences. you think time-out does anything? no, because they'll sneak it in, or just get it at the end of the week. we've all heard "spare the rod, spoil the child."

[DeltAlum]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by midwesterngirl

Originally posted by ZTAMiami
.

I think children nowadays have a lack of empathy overall. I think that our society is full of selfish, detached children who crave nothing but instant gratification.



That is it in a nutshell.The children don't care because their parents don't care.The parents are way too busy with their own lives.
I am a Daycare/Preschool Director and would guess that approximately 70% of the children we care for are there 10 hours a day or more/5 days a week.My staff and I know,that if it weren't for us,many of these children would have nobody to care for them.We know that for many we are the only nutritious meal they get.You can tell without a doubt,who is and is not their parents priority.

Again, I would just ask that you don't paint all parents with the same brush. A lot of parents do care.

Our daughter worked in the daycare industry for a while, and will do just about anything to keep her daughter out of it. So, she and her husband have different days off. She spends a lot of her free time figuring out grandparents schedules (including ours) so that the baby is always with a family member. (We watch her two to three days a week)

In our case, we simply decided to take a huge financial hit when our first was born so Mrs. DeltAlum could stay home with the children. It was difficult, but we managed. I'm not sure that our daughter and husband could do that on their entry level salaries in this economy.

You see parenthood from a very jaded perspective, as you watch people drop their children off in your care and drive off in their matching Beemers. (No, before anyone starts, all working parents and BMW drivers aren't bad parents -- simply using a stereotype for the sake of illustration) All parents aren't like that, and I suspect your 70% number is pretty high.

[ZTAMiami]

Whitechocolate:

I don't plan on hitting my daughter in order to discipline her. I don't believe "time out" actually works unless you are correcting whatever wrong the child did. I think children need to be talked to. Not screamed at or hit. What do you really learn besides fear and anger towards the parent? If a child can't trust their parent to listen to them and teach them then what kind of person do they turn out to be? I've been doing a lot of reading on parenting and discipline and while you can't go by what a book tells you, it has opened my mind to different things.

I was hit quite often when I was little and you're right, I turned out just fine. But I don't think I really learned any lesson besides don't get caught. I would second guess telling my parents when I did something for fear of getting punished for it. I saw my father as not much else but a disciplinarian and the guy that gave me money. This is probably why I have so many issues with him now. I don't want to make the same mistakes with my children.

[starang21]

Originally posted by ZTAMiami
Whitechocolate:

I don't plan on hitting my daughter in order to discipline her. I don't believe "time out" actually works unless you are correcting whatever wrong the child did. I think children need to be talked to. Not screamed at or hit. What do you really learn besides fear and anger towards the parent? If a child can't trust their parent to listen to them and teach them then what kind of person do they turn out to be? I've been doing a lot of reading on parenting and discipline and while you can't go by what a book tells you, it has opened my mind to different things.

I was hit quite often when I was little and you're right, I turned out just fine. But I don't think I really learned any lesson besides don't get caught. I would second guess telling my parents when I did something for fear of getting punished for it. I saw my father as not much else but a disciplinarian and the guy that gave me money. This is probably why I have so many issues with him now. I don't want to make the same mistakes with my children.

you teach her that there are consequences for her actions. that's what kids need these days, some sort of ability to take responsibility. when kids are young, the only thing they worry about is getting punished....however if the right course of action is taken, that turns into whether or not the action they're contemplating is right or wrong. if they just get a "talking to" about what they did was wrong and no kind of punishment, you seriously think they'll take whatever you say seriously? no....they'll realize that the only thing they have to worry about is you talking to them and not have to worry about consequences. but hey, do you.....as long as the children have some sort of accountability then whatever method works fine. a beat down isn't always the best, but it'll work when things have to hit the fan.

[AXJules]

I was spanked probably three times in my entire childhood. Will I do it to my kids? Probably not, but it definitely kept me in line.

I think it's important to talk to your kids as they get past 5, 6, 7 years old and really explain WHY they can't do something or the repercussions of their poor actions. But after working with preschoolers I think one of the best things I learned was keep the words to a minimum.
There are a few parents around here who just blow me away when their kid knocks over an entire display in my store and they go "Preston please stop running and terrorizing this store, Daddy's going to be mad and then you won't watch Bob the Builder when you get home, do you hear me???" Christ lady! NO he doesn't hear you, the ears shut off after the third word. You say "Stop." No. Stand here.

Back to the original point of the thread, sometimes you look around and see the total lack of concern for others and it is really scary. The thing is, it's probably always been this way. The only thing that has made it worse is that these days, anyone can afford some sort of legal counsel and EVERYONE is quick to shout "lawsuit!" when they've been wronged.

[starang21]

Originally posted by AXJules
I was spanked probably three times in my entire childhood. Will I do it to my kids? Probably not, but it definitely kept me in line.

I think it's important to talk to your kids as they get past 5, 6, 7 years old and really explain WHY they can't do something or the repercussions of their poor actions. But after working with preschoolers I think one of the best things I learned was keep the words to a minimum.
There are a few parents around here who just blow me away when their kid knocks over an entire display in my store and they go "Preston please stop running and terrorizing this store, Daddy's going to be mad and then you won't watch Bob the Builder when you get home, do you hear me???" Christ lady! NO he doesn't hear you, the ears shut off after the third word. You say "Stop." No. Stand here.

Back to the original point of the thread, sometimes you look around and see the total lack of concern for others and it is really scary. The thing is, it's probably always been this way. The only thing that has made it worse is that these days, anyone can afford some sort of legal counsel and EVERYONE is quick to shout "lawsuit!" when they've been wronged.

hahah, i'm mad at the visual. i say give them the death look.... . that's what i got when i was a kid, but usually it was followed by a quick hand in the cereal isle. i really wish my kid would do that....for real, the belt will come off.

[ZTAMiami]

Starang:
Don't get me wrong. I am not going to approach discipline so passively. I just don't think that fear teaches. I think it isolates the child and makes them fearful and mistrustful.

AXJules:
I've seen parents who di that to. They are lazy parents. I know working full time and coming home to "deal" with the kids must be rough. The problem is they are just "dealing" and not parenting.